Possible Powerplants of Super MKI: AL-31F M1 or 117?

[Harisudan]

I never claimed that.

All I said was that advance PAF F-16s might be able to pick up Su-30MKIs before Su-30s realize the presence of PAF jets...

Anyways, forget it.

That is exactly my point friend, how do you come to a conclusion that the PAF F16 Block 52 which are around 17 in numbers confirmed by Lockheed website, with limited ECM capabilities which are not at all , and Armaments which are not superior to MKIs armaments and Radar which again is almost half the size of MKIs radar, can Pick up MKIs well before the MKIs will even feel the presence of a Bogie???How do u arrive at it???

 

[The Sultan Erdogan]

That is exactly my point friend, how do you come to a conclusion that the PAF F16 Block 52 which are around 17 in numbers confirmed by Lockheed website, with limited ECM capabilities which are not at all , and Armaments which are not superior to MKIs armaments and Radar which again is almost half the size of MKIs radar, can Pick up MKIs well before the MKIs will even feel the presence of a Bogie???How do u arrive at it???

Because RCS of MKI is around 3x greater than F-16s.

"Plain" F-16 is almost stealth!!!

"Plain" Su-30MKI is like 8m^2 RCS!!

MKI's radar range is 2X of F-16....but MKI's RCS is 3x to 4x of F-16s....guess who'll pick up who first?

Answer: F-16 will pick up MKI before vice versa.

 

[Totenkopf]

Because RCS of MKI is around 3x greater than F-16s.

"Plain" F-16 is almost stealth!!!

"Plain" Su-30MKI is like 8m^2 RCS!!

MKI's radar range is 2X of F-16....but MKI's RCS is 3x to 4x of F-16s....guess who'll pick up who first?

Answer: F-16 will pick up MKI before vice versa.

If that were the case, and if aerial warfare were that simple, the USAF would never have developed the F-15, the Russians the Su-27, the Chinese the J-11.

And if that were true, the IAF and the Indian government would go for a mad scramble for a fighter capable of matching the invincible F-16B52. In the early to mid 80s, when Pakistan did indeed get the superior F-16As from the US, the IAFs and Indian government panicked so much, they bought off some 100 Mirages and Mig-29s in response to the F-16.

With the current superiority of Indian buying power, the IAFs panic reaction would be far far greater

 

[Harisudan]

Again the same, RCS Crap...
How do u justify your claim, that Plain F16 is almost stealth and Plain Su 30 MKI is 8Sq.M..??
who gave you these numbers???
Official Lockheed website or Offcial KNAAPP website which Manufactures Su30s???
Or did u get these numbers from any Government sources as such.?Or from any fighter Pilot who wrote a blog on these two fighters comparison??Which source are u quoting to support ur claims???
When you make such tall claims, u should be able to quote certain acceptable sources My friend??
Not some PDF Jingoist's post..
MKIs radar is 2x of F16's radar..??
The F16 Block 52's Raytheon APG 66 v5 Version radar, which is a mid & Late 1990s radar and Maximum Range upto 150 KMs..
Now the Range vs Radar emittance given by an official US radar designer Raytheon comes likes this..
Lookup:
MiG-23: 40nm
MiG-25: 49nm
Tu-95: 75nm
Lookdown:
MiG-23: 29nm
MiG-25: 35nm
Tu-95: 56nm
So imagining that our MKIs are little bit bigger than the FOXBATs let us put it 50nm per se..
The same website has quoted the detection Range for F16 for the same APG radar is at 28 nm which almost half of the MKIs RCS..
So going by that Logic, our MKI is having 1.9 times higher RCS than your F16 BLK 52s and not 3-4 times..
Can u prove me otherwise..???

 

[Harisudan]

MKI's radar range is 2X of F-16...

The BARS PESA has a search range of 400 KM and a Lock on range of 280 KM
Where as the APG 66 V5 has a Search range of 265 Kms and a Maximum lock on range of close to 135- 140 Kms..
As per the official sources the f-16 with approx. Half the RCS of MKI with its AGP radar will lock on to an MKI at 50- 55 Nms Head on Mode..
By official sources, we can conclude that, the MKI will be able to pick up the f16 few seconds before the f16 can pick up, at such speeds..Because practically that is the time gap u can get to decide..
It will be an interesting contest one on one, only with range and radar detection, though lot of other factors such as payload and maneuovarability comes to play, I"m keeping all that as constant for both fighters for arguments sake..
you may prove me otherwise..

 

[The Great One]

The BARS PESA has a search range of 400 KM and a Lock on range of 280 KM
Where as the APG 66 V5 has a Search range of 265 Kms and a Maximum lock on range of close to 135- 140 Kms..
As per the official sources the f-16 with approx. Half the RCS of MKI with its AGP radar will lock on to an MKI at 50- 55 Nms Head on Mode..
By official sources, we can conclude that, the MKI will be able to pick up the f16 few seconds before the f16 can pick up, at such speeds..Because practically that is the time gap u can get to decide..
It will be an interesting contest one on one, only with range and radar detection, though lot of other factors such as payload and maneuovarability comes to play, I"m keeping all that as constant for both fighters for arguments sake..
you may prove me otherwise..

Can you please comment what happened at Red Flag 2008, and Col. Terrence Fornoff's video too.

 

[Harisudan]

I've heard that during the Red Flag at Nellis, it is understood that, we had difficulties in friend or foe detection and communicating with the ATCs due to the accent problems and hence there was a lot of friendly fire during the exercises..
Apart from that Our Bisons caused troubles to almost all the Teen fighters, and the American counterparts used the term "Invisible " when they referred to bisons..Though they didn't mean it literally, but they were totally surprised by the way upgrades BISONS got and the way they performed..
Colonel Fornoff was not a part of the crew that evaluated the Exercises he was not even a part of the exercise..
Whatever feedback he gave, was purely the outputs he got from his fellow USAF pilots who were there at the exercise and they were not 100% true either..
The exercise was a very good learning experience in some areas for us and for the USAF they respected our aircrew as one of the most disciplined and quickly adaptive of the environmental conditions given..

 

[IND151]

Because RCS of MKI is around 3x greater than F-16s.

"Plain" F-16 is almost stealth!!!

"Plain" Su-30MKI is like 8m^2 RCS!!

MKI's radar range is 2X of F-16....but MKI's RCS is 3x to 4x of F-16s....guess who'll pick up who first?

Answer: F-16 will pick up MKI before vice versa.

But in war F 16 will be carrying lots of weaopns, increasing its RCS by a large extent.

 

[The Sultan Erdogan]

But in war F 16 will be carrying lots of weaopns, increasing its RCS by a large extent.

Yeah, and so would Su-30MKI....

Anyways..

 

[Manindra]

Yeah, and so would Su-30MKI....

Anyways..

F-16 have to carry Fuel drop tanks which increases RCS many fold but Su-30 MKI didn't

 

[IND151]

F-16 have to carry Fuel drop tanks which increases RCS many fold but Su-30 MKI didn't

Now he wont reply.

He is a known troll who got banned months before, according to many a false flag.

 

[Manindra]

Now he wont reply.

He is a known troll who got banned months before, according to many a false flag.

He is Safriz the Chutia

 

[The Great One]

I've heard that during the Red Flag at Nellis, it is understood that, we had difficulties in friend or foe detection and communicating with the ATCs due to the accent problems and hence there was a lot of friendly fire during the exercises..
Apart from that Our Bisons caused troubles to almost all the Teen fighters, and the American counterparts used the term "Invisible " when they referred to bisons..Though they didn't mean it literally, but they were totally surprised by the way upgrades BISONS got and the way they performed..
Colonel Fornoff was not a part of the crew that evaluated the Exercises he was not even a part of the exercise..
Whatever feedback he gave, was purely the outputs he got from his fellow USAF pilots who were there at the exercise and they were not 100% true either..
The exercise was a very good learning experience in some areas for us and for the USAF they respected our aircrew as one of the most disciplined and quickly adaptive of the environmental conditions given..

Whoa.
No BISON participated in Red Flag 2008.
BTW dude could you quote me the next time, since without that it is hard to know if you replied.

Anyway, I asked if you know the kill ratio in Mountain Home AFB.

 

[Harisudan]

Whoa.
No BISON participated in Red Flag 2008.
BTW dude could you quote me the next time, since without that it is hard to know if you replied.

Anyway, I asked if you know the kill ratio in Mountain Home AFB.

in fact nellis was right after mountain home and I was Referring bison performance at mount home..
No the kill ratios were not disclosed and heard that mostly in favour of MKIs..but some times we too had bad kill ratios in aggressor defender sorties than 1 Vs 1..

 

[The Sultan Erdogan]

F-16 have to carry Fuel drop tanks which increases RCS many fold but Su-30 MKI didn't

F-16s would have to carry fuel tanks if they are on a mission that goes deep in india.

If they are intercepting indian jets in border regions, there isn't much need for fuel tanks.