PM Hun Sen asks UN for help against Vietnam

[Aepsilons]

The people of South East Asia have quite a history of expansion as well as martial prowess in their home environment.

Remember the Kingdom of Champa? No?
Well, the Viets destroyed them very thoroughly and in fact, it was so bad that refugees flooded into Hainan Island.

Another warlike people who are often overlooked are the Burmese. During the Qing dynasty, there were three massive expeditions into Burma and all three ended in failure. People from other climates adapt very poorly to the humid insect infested environments. Gun powder gets wet, horses cannot be used and armour chafes while the heat and disease attacks Northerners very badly.

Dont underestimate the shirtless half dressed opponents with spears smeared with human faeces. The look that way because they have adapted very well and the faeces are very effective albeit very dirty - pun intended.

I agree with what you said, the last paragraph was very "descriptive", don't you think? lol.

I just wanted to add about Champa. The Kingdom of Champa was actually not an innocent state at all and they were probably the authors of their own demise through their constant warfare, leading to the exhaustion of their own man power. If you look into the History of the Kingdom of Champa (i'll provide you the link):

Champa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You will notice that Champa had two titular enemies: a) The Khmer Empire (Angkor) and 2) The Viets {Annam}. Early in Champa's existence, they feuded with Angkor , the principal legacy state of what was then the Kingdom of Chenla. The two, the Angkorian Khmers and the Champanese , fought constant wars with each other. Champa even sacked the capital of the Khmer Empire , Angkor, and then again in Lovek, multiple times. Then there were times that the Khmers sacked the capital of the Champanese in Indrapura. The constant warfare, depleted their man power , in fact this led to not only the exhaustion of Champa's population, but also the constant war put a strain on Khmer's population as well.

During the 8th to 10th centuries, there were 2 'foreigners' that were changing the environment of Southeast Asia:
a) The Tais (they would eventually make up Thailand and Laos) who came from what is now present day Yunnan, and 2) The Vietic Kinh who came down from Guanxi. The Tais and Vietic Kinhs were of course came with a large population ; the Tais defeated the Khmers and created their first Kingdom known as Sukkothai with their first king --- King Rhamkamhaeng the Great. Eventually, the Tais would subsume Khmer lands and culture , make it their own. As for Champa, it had a new enemy now, not the traditional enemy the khmers, but the Vietic Kinh. Champa , an indianized civilization, tried fighting the Viets in the traditional warfare style that it had implemented with the Khmers. This was basis for failure. Why? Because the Viets were Sinicized , and fought in Chinese-style military tactics , implementing horse drawn cavalry, utilized archers, utilized organized infantry blocks. Plus the Viet armies had utilized superior armor padding as comapred to the Champa soldiers who went to battle practically with just a wooden shield and a sword. They were easily dispatched.

Champa was defeated because for : 1) they had poor tactics, 2) they had depleted their man power through constant wars with the Khmers, 3) superior technology of the Sinicized Viet Kinhs.

 

[+4vsgorillas-Apebane]

I agree with what you said, the last paragraph was very "descriptive", don't you think? lol.

I just wanted to add about Champa. The Kingdom of Champa was actually not an innocent state at all and they were probably the authors of their own demise through their constant warfare, leading to the exhaustion of their own man power. If you look into the History of the Kingdom of Champa (i'll provide you the link):

Champa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You will notice that Champa had two titular enemies: a) The Khmer Empire (Angkor) and 2) The Viets {Annam}. Early in Champa's existence, they feuded with Angkor , the principal legacy state of what was then the Kingdom of Chenla. The two, the Angkorian Khmers and the Champanese , fought constant wars with each other. Champa even sacked the capital of the Khmer Empire , Angkor, and then again in Lovek, multiple times. Then there were times that the Khmers sacked the capital of the Champanese in Indrapura. The constant warfare, depleted their man power , in fact this led to not only the exhaustion of Champa's population, but also the constant war put a strain on Khmer's population as well.

During the 8th to 10th centuries, there were 2 'foreigners' that were changing the environment of Southeast Asia:
a) The Tais (they would eventually make up Thailand and Laos) who came from what is now present day Yunnan, and 2) The Vietic Kinh who came down from Guanxi. The Tais and Vietic Kinhs were of course came with a large population ; the Tais defeated the Khmers and created their first Kingdom known as Sukkothai with their first king --- King Rhamkamhaeng the Great. Eventually, the Tais would subsume Khmer lands and culture , make it their own. As for Champa, it had a new enemy now, not the traditional enemy the khmers, but the Vietic Kinh. Champa , an indianized civilization, tried fighting the Viets in the traditional warfare style that it had implemented with the Khmers. This was basis for failure. Why? Because the Viets were Sinicized , and fought in Chinese-style military tactics , implementing horse drawn cavalry, utilized archers, utilized organized infantry blocks. Plus the Viet armies had utilized superior armor padding as comapred to the Champa soldiers who went to battle practically with just a wooden shield and a sword. They were easily dispatched.

Champa was defeated because for : 1) they had poor tactics, 2) they had depleted their man power through constant wars with the Khmers, 3) superior technology of the Sinicized Viet Kinhs.

Indeed, the irony of the Vietnamese hatred of their Northern neighbour is that they themselves prospered immensely from Chinese bureaucracy and learning.

They really are a warlike people and looking at the map of their expansion starting in the 11th century, they expanded south steam rolling any kingdom and adding to their dominion sections of territory like segments of bamboo on a long stalk.

They cannot expand north but in SEA they are very strong. Kingdoms like Champa really had no chance.

 

[Aepsilons]

Indeed, the irony of the Vietnamese hatred of their Northern neighbour is that they themselves prospered immensely from Chinese bureaucracy and learning.

They really are a warlike people and looking at the map of their expansion starting in the 11th century, they expanded south steam rolling any kingdom and adding to their dominion sections of territory like segments of bamboo on a long stalk.

They cannot expand north but in SEA they are very strong. Kingdoms like Champa really had no chance.

The weak will be defeated by the strong, my friend. Vietnam, which was heavily Sinicized in their formative years, utilized everything they learned from the Chinese (organized bureaucracy, efficient land taxing schemes, social harmony through the presence of local magistrates, mobilized standing army, constant supply of rice and produce through the organized land schemes/ taxing schemes) enabled the Vietic Kinhs to subsume their much poorer, less organized, less disciplined, less "civilized" southern neighbors such as the Khmers and the Champa.

If you think about it, the Viets are almost a smaller version of the Han. If you look at the Vietnamese population, the closest to the Vietic Kinh in phenotype are the Northern Vietnamese, whose phenotype are closer to East Asian appearance: profound epicanthal eye folds, lighter skin, high cheek bone, taller, larger in frame, prominent nasal bridge. If you go to say central or southern Vietnam, you will see people there with facial features that are different from Northern Vietnamese Kinh, as many Southern or Central Vietnamese have Champa blood, or were descendents of the Champanese who were subsumed / conquered into Dai Viet. Actually in the south of Vietnam there are even some Vietnamese who have Khmer blood line asn they have more Khmer facial features : darker skin tone, flatter nose bridge, rounder eyes.

Yet despite this, these people still consider themselves as "Vietnamese". It is the identity. The same as how some Chinese who are Han Chinese claim Han identity due to the cultural as well as some genetic influence. Tho we know that there are variances in genotype and even phenotype amongst the larger Han ethnic group.

I can't help but find similarity between the Vietic Kinh and the Yayoi of Japan. The early Yayoi who came to Japan from what is now Zheijiang region of China (yes, the first "colonizers" of Japan were people from Northern China) brought with them some early agricultural techniques, tax schemes, and city organization. In fact one of the first rulers of Yamato Japan was a descendent of King Wu Taibo of the state of Wu. When the Yayoi Japanese came to the Japanese Archipelago some 3000 years ago, they did not come to an empty land , no, they arrived and saw that the land was already occupied by a foreign people whom we referred to as the Jomon. The Yayoi Japanese defeated the Jomon militarily through time and colonized Japan starting in Honshu, then through Shikoku, Kyushu and eventually Hokkaido. The Jomon were either eradicated through war, or were subsumed and married into the Yayoi culture / society. The Yayoi that came to the Japanese islands came in massive numbers, hundreds of thousands came from Zheijiang.

I guess one can say that the ethnic groups or peoples that came from China were 'prepared' to conquer / defeat the less organized civilizations.

 

[Jlaw]

on a recent mekong summit in Tokyo: Vietnam joins hand with Japan. together with Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar, Thailand. where is mekong supower China, that wants to bring chaos into the region?

good that china is not invited. chinese posters here behave like hooligans.

Viets begging Japan for money is your business. Why would China be invited?

 

[kohai]

Viets begging Japan for money is your business. Why would China be invited?

correct it is not your business so stay out of our affairs, chinese.

 

[Jlaw]

correct it is not your business so stay out of our affairs, chinese.

aww, did you just create this account to counter my argument?

 

[xunzi]

Since when is there any morality in geo politics? Loool there are many things you also did that others countries will consider lawless/immoral,but does that change anything? NO. Lol

As you said not even you can do what vietnam did, means you are weaker than most people think(ok to be honest, i will say your leaders are weak in strategic thinking). So you shouldnt be bitter about the fact that vietnam is able to exert so much influence in/dominate its region while China couldnt/cant stop it despite its size.

Never complain of others strength, complain about your weakness. So i see absolutely nothing wrong with Vietnam protecting its interests in its immediate neighbourhood BY ALL MEANS NECESSARY, just like how china took scarborough shoal from philippines, i see nothing wrong(if countries cant negotiate peacefully, then let the best/strong win.lol.) after a couple years at most everybidy will forget about this.lol

Countries ought to always seek to pritect their interests with as much means as they can, nothing is illegal in this case. Thats,what real smart powers/countries do. Only those not able to change things/situation complain. Realpolitik.

My Mikey friend if that is the case, don't cry over what we are doing in South China Sea. Why are your son, Uncle Sam, are crying about it? Not to mention their puppets are unhappy with what we did? I thought this so called "Might is right" don't apply equally or what? LOL

 

[biendong]

Viets begging Japan for money is your business. Why would China be invited?

Looks at China, how much money you begged from Japan ODA ?

Tokyo started extending aid to China in 1979, but stopped fresh loans in 2007. Japanese loans to China during the 2008 fiscal year totaled 3.32 trillion yen or about US $40.5 billion, according to Tokyo.

Japan to review aid for booming China - CNN.com

 

[asad71]

Cambodia also seems to have issues with Thailand.

 

[xesy]

Are you gay or something? I am a guy here and stop calling a guy, "babe" it's disgusting.
Btw, you could procure the condom from Vietnam. Do you guys even have the tech to make condoms? Or do you use a substitute with leaves from your jungle wrapped around it? Lol...

FYI, I prefer using goat's intestine .

Joking aside, I don't want our Kilos to get some nasty stuff from your oil rig, that's what I mean.

 

[frequency]

Hun Sen is getting paid a lot of money by the CCP to ask for UN help to fight against Vietnam.

LOL very respected my azz. He's just a propagandist let‘s call him what he is. If you want to discuss issues you go to your own section and discuss open defecation, that's what I call “real” issues you disgusting inidans

Speak like a true communist.

 

[mike2000 is back]

Looks at China, how much money you begged from Japan ODA ?

Tokyo started extending aid to China in 1979, but stopped fresh loans in 2007. Japanese loans to China during the 2008 fiscal year totaled 3.32 trillion yen or about US $40.5 billion, according to Tokyo.

Japan to review aid for booming China - CNN.com

Yes japan indeed provided lots of aid/loans to china and even South Korea(in the 60s to early 90s). Even though both governments don't want to publicize this fact for obvious political reasons.

 

[Aepsilons]

Yes japan indeed privided alot of aod/loans to china and even south korea(in the 60s to warly 90s). Even though both governments dont want to publicize this fact for obvious political reasons.

No need for that babe. The only thing we need is a submarine-size condom . No, make it 6.

In that case, prepare for a submarine-sized dock

Hun Sen is getting paid a lot of money by the CCP to ask for UN help to fight against Vietnam.

He is friendly to everyone, to be honest. The type of leader that smiles to whomever helps his cause.

 

[大汉奸柳传志]

ok ok.. you are a VERY respected propagandist.. stop bad rating me and leave me alone!!

 

[waz]

correct it is not your business so stay out of our affairs, chinese.

Dear new member welcome. Could you please introduce yourself properly in our "introductions" section please? I see you are Japanese.

Folks many posts were deleted from this thread. Please don't turn the far East section into a war, like we have seen with the Middle East section, which is now calm.