PIA getting over 20 aircrafts in coming months

[khanboy007]

nero was fiddling while rome burnt same happened to PIA. Now let's not waste public money to feed white elephant. The money we spend on bailouts of PIA can be spent on providing more important things to mango man.

I agree with you.....but keep this example in mind

Emirates is 30% of the UAE's economy (as per a documentary I viewed)

now understand just how important of an asset is the airline business

 

[Sugarcane]

I agree with you.....but keep this example in mind

Emirates is 30% of the UAE's economy (as per a documentary I viewed)

now understand just how important of an asset is the airline business

Wrong example, Unlike PIA, EA belongs to Royal family, the employee will get royal size bamboo in his back if he try to do corruption there or will be sacked if his cost is more than his contribution in company's profit. In Pakistan everyone who can get hold consider public entities as maal-e-ghaneemat and loot as much possible and these public organizations are full of haram khoors employees, so privatization is best thing in Pakistan's case.

 

[razgriz19]

Boss, long haul and medium haul jets are good when you can fill them up. PIA has trouble filling the European routes. That's all i am saying. If PIA offered me service and punctuality like ME3, i would love to travel direct from Karachi, but the truth is, they don't and they can't.

You know what they say, what is the fastest way to turn a billionaire into a millionaire? Ask them to start an airline.

Airlines are cut throat business......PIA has no chance against ME3. Even the behemoths like Lufthansa and Air France are struggling and that is why they are calling on their governments to restrict the slots and destinations for ME3 in Europe. Emirates only does 4 German cities, and they have already cut into Lufthansa's passenger revenue.

PIA made the wrong decision to purchase 777 since they ply only 2 routes to North America. Would've been better to purchase some A340s for that and the rest A330s, and that is where i agree with you. Now buying more 777s, is utterly stupid. Where are you going to fly them? Karachi-Islamabad sector? You're better offer expanding your regional fleet with 737s or A320s......they can cover most of South Asia and Middle East. Plus there is great demand for traffic from smaller cities like Rahim Yar Khan, Bahawalpur, Sukkur....so ATRs are good on that route. During the summers, PIA can do triple or quadruple daily to Skardu.......they'll be minting money on that route. If Karachi-Islamabad demands more planes, just put more A320s there....at least you have the flexibility to fly them elsewhere......with one 777 or like before, 747, you are just restricting yourself.

777-300ER are selling at half price currently and may i add factory new!
Boeing announced the new 777x and that forced them to bring the price down to almost half the price tag.

"Though worth $3.3 billion at current list prices, the real value of the Kuwaiti order after standard discounts is about $1.7 billion, based on estimated market-pricing data from aircraft-valuation firm Avitas."

Kuwait Airways plans to buy 10 Boeing 777-300ER jets | Business & Technology | The Seattle Times

But i do agree, we need more 320s than 777. And you're right about the service
here is a prime example of our national airline!
This poor thing is been sitting here in toronto since FRIDAY!
she had pressurization issue TWICE!! she took off and came back twice...

 

[WishLivePak]

777-300ER are selling at half price currently and may i add factory new!
Boeing announced the new 777x and that forced them to bring the price down to almost half the price tag.

"Though worth $3.3 billion at current list prices, the real value of the Kuwaiti order after standard discounts is about $1.7 billion, based on estimated market-pricing data from aircraft-valuation firm Avitas."

Kuwait Airways plans to buy 10 Boeing 777-300ER jets | Business & Technology | The Seattle Times

But i do agree, we need more 320s than 777. And you're right about the service
here is a prime example of our national airline!
This poor thing is been sitting here in toronto since FRIDAY!
she had pressurization issue TWICE!! she took off and came back twice...

PIA placed order before 777x was announced i beleive. They also paid 10m dollars extra for improvements, like furniture sort of stuff.

Perhaps PIA can switch order to 777x, cuz they really don't need 777 nor have funds to pay full price on arrival


The LR is some 10 years old plane, bound to start having some problems.

 

[razgriz19]

PIA placed order before 777x was announced i beleive. They also paid 10m dollars extra for improvements, like furniture sort of stuff.

Perhaps PIA can switch order to 777x, cuz they really don't need 777 nor have funds to pay full price on arrival


The LR is some 10 years old plane, bound to start having some problems.

That is not a very good reason. 10 years is not old in terms of airplanes.
Many operators in Canada are still flying aircraft from 60s! 727, 737-100, etc
PIA has big problem in every single department. Their service is getting worse and worse. A lot of people i know, including my sister, took Etihad or Emirates to go to Pakistan.
PIA needs to be privatised.

 

[imiakhtar]

This poor thing is been sitting here in toronto since FRIDAY!
she had pressurization issue TWICE!! she took off and came back twice...

Interesting.

Who does that hangar belong to?

Westjet? Air Canada?

 

[WishLivePak]

That is not a very good reason. 10 years is not old in terms of airplanes.
Many operators in Canada are still flying aircraft from 60s! 727, 737-100, etc
PIA has big problem in every single department. Their service is getting worse and worse. A lot of people i know, including my sister, took Etihad or Emirates to go to Pakistan.
PIA needs to be privatised.

But they also take good care of planes. PIA doesn't. So many planes are scarped. They have this 777 on lease and they were using that as scrap a year ago.

Lufthansa is still using 737-300s, which PIA has retired. Canada has this airline which uses A310 and is still profitable.

Finally, those airlines using planes from 60s are small airlines. I doubt any passenger plane (well known airline) flies over the atlantic in 727.

It's true they've awful departments. They recently closed down office in Australia, where PIA doesn't even fly. And they have offices in downtown locations, which are hella expensive.

Interesting.

Who does that hangar belong to?

Westjet? Air Canada?

Air Canada, as they also have 777LRs

Westjet doesn't fly anything other than 737s and bombadier

 

[razgriz19]

Interesting.

Who does that hangar belong to?

Westjet? Air Canada?

Air Canada hangar. They're trying to sort the isuue. I believe its a bleed air shut off valve that pressurizes the aircraft.
This one flew on friday evening (5pm) and came back after she failed to pressurize the cabin. She took off again (after AC mechanics did something to it) at 1:30AM, and again the same problem arised so she came back. Now its sitting in the hangar so mechanics from AC and PIA can sort out the issue. I believe PIA flew in some mechanics today.

 

[WishLivePak]

Air Canada hangar. They're trying to sort the isuue. I believe its a bleed air shut off valve that pressurizes the aircraft.
This one flew on friday evening (5pm) and came back after she failed to pressurize the cabin. She took off again (after AC mechanics did something to it) at 1:30AM, and again the same problem arised so she came back. Now its sitting in the hangar so mechanics from AC and PIA can sort out the issue. I believe PIA flew in some mechanics today.

were the passengers in plane the second time as well? Must be a pissed off moment.

Hope PIA does get some compensation if proper work was not done the first time. Fuel isn't free, neither is time.

Also not sure the point of flying in mechanics, when there are ones from Air Canada, who are better experienced. It'd only add to costs. Flying in some Boeing mechnic from Seattle would've been cheaper and more sound

 

[razgriz19]

But they also take good care of planes. PIA doesn't. So many planes are scarped. They have this 777 on lease and they were using that as scrap a year ago.

Lufthansa is still using 737-300s, which PIA has retired. Canada has this airline which uses A310 and is still profitable.

Finally, those airlines using planes from 60s are small airlines. I doubt any passenger plane (well known airline) flies over the atlantic in 727.

It's true they've awful departments. They recently closed down office in Australia, where PIA doesn't even fly. And they have offices in downtown locations, which are hella expensive.


Air Canada, as they also have 777LRs

Westjet doesn't fly anything other than 737s and bombadier

Manufacture specifies what work needs to be done at what time and what condition. the problem is the way that work is done causes the problems. PIA has a very bad regulating body. They can never investigate a crash or an incident properly, thus they don't implement better safety precautions. Transport Canada is much stricter, thats why you dont hear a lot of incidents taking place in Canada. shit happens everywhere, but its the consistency that matters.

were the passengers in plane the second time as well? Must be a pissed off moment.

Hope PIA does get some compensation if proper work was not done the first time. Fuel isn't free, neither is time.

Also not sure the point of flying in mechanics, when there are ones from Air Canada, who are better experienced. It'd only add to costs. Flying in some Boeing mechnic from Seattle would've been cheaper and more sound

yup there were.
and that's why i said, PIA has the worst management.
Pearson also charges a crap load of money to park aircraft. PIA lost a lot of money because of this.

 

[WishLivePak]

Manufacture specifies what work needs to be done at what time and what condition. the problem is the way that work is done causes the problems. PIA has a very bad regulating body. They can never investigate a crash or an incident properly, thus they don't implement better safety precautions. Transport Canada is much stricter, thats why you dont hear a lot of incidents taking place in Canada. shit happens everywhere, but its the consistency that matters.

which is why a 10 year old is troublesome for PIA, but not for someone like Air Canada.

Manufacture specifies what work needs to be done at what time and what condition. the problem is the way that work is done causes the problems. PIA has a very bad regulating body. They can never investigate a crash or an incident properly, thus they don't implement better safety precautions. Transport Canada is much stricter, thats why you dont hear a lot of incidents taking place in Canada. shit happens everywhere, but its the consistency that matters.



yup there were.
and that's why i said, PIA has the worst management.
Pearson also charges a crap load of money to park aircraft. PIA lost a lot of money because of this.

Busiest airport in Canada. Plus PIA aircraft is needing repair. No negotiations with costs now

I doubt those passengers will ever fly PIA again. Coming back twice, in an intense situation. Plus time lost (many people booked holidays)

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

were the passengers in plane the second time as well? Must be a pissed off moment.

Hope PIA does get some compensation if proper work was not done the first time. Fuel isn't free, neither is time.

Also not sure the point of flying in mechanics, when there are ones from Air Canada, who are better experienced. It'd only add to costs. Flying in some Boeing mechnic from Seattle would've been cheaper and more sound

The State of Registration/ AOC Holder i.e. PIAC engineers are required to be present for inspecting that the work is being done according to Pakistan approved operational requirements by CAA Pakistan.

Compensation is not what is important but the recurrence of the problem that was thought to be removed. May be the findings of the incident report find some thing that was not previously known that might require changes in procedure / training / replacement on all B777's or other aircraft using the same parts or may be the part manufacturer is also required to do some improvements in design or quality. Safety of the passengers is more important. All the expenses will be paid by insurance so that removes the cost part.

Interesting.

Who does that hangar belong to?

Westjet? Air Canada?

The maintenance facilities that are to be provided are mutually discussed and agreed upon by the Contracting States (Pakistan & Canada) not airlines. The Bilateral agreements are signed by the Contracting States in this case Pakistan and Canada. PIA is the only airline that flies to Canada and Air Canada is also selling the agreed Passengers to PIA as they do not intend to fly this sector. This way PIA can use Air Canada maintenance facilities only.

which is why a 10 year old is troublesome for PIA, but not for someone like Air Canada.


Busiest airport in Canada. Plus PIA aircraft is needing repair. No negotiations with costs now

I doubt those passengers will ever fly PIA again. Coming back twice, in an intense situation. Plus time lost (many people booked holidays)

Though this is not as simple, the passengers must have been compensated for the trouble the have gone through. This also gives a higher safety rating for PIA, passengers tend to opt for those airlines that have a good safety record.

 

[imiakhtar]

The maintenance facilities that are to be provided are mutually discussed and agreed upon by the Contracting States (Pakistan & Canada) not airlines.

This is bull crap.

Government agreements don't come into it.

When I was with BA, our Toronto maintenance was covered by a commercial agreement with Air Canada to support our 767 or 777 ops if such service was needed.

The terms were negotiated between BA and AC solely.

No third party or regulatory authority such as UK CAA or Transport Canada were involved.

You seem to be living in a bygone era of regulated air traffic where aviation entities were all nationalised.

PIA is the only airline that flies to Canada and Air Canada is also selling the agreed Passengers to PIA as they do not intend to fly this sector.

PIA and Air Canada do not codeshare which is what you are referring to. Furthermore, even if they were, ground support services would still be another matter that would need organising along the lines I explained above.

This way PIA can use Air Canada maintenance facilities only.

If West jet, Air Transat or any other carrier had the necessary facilities and approvals for 777 maintenance, there would be nothing stopping PIA from using those facilities.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

This is bull crap.

Government agreements don't come into it.

When I was with BA, our Toronto maintenance was covered by a commercial agreement with Air Canada to support our 767 or 777 ops if such service was needed.

The terms were negotiated between BA and AC solely.

No third party or regulatory authority such as UK CAA or Transport Canada were involved.

You seem to be living in a bygone era of regulated air traffic where aviation entities were all nationalised.



PIA and Air Canada do not codeshare which is what you are referring to. Furthermore, even if they were, ground support services would still be another matter that would need organising along the lines I explained above.



If West jet, Air Transat or any other carrier had the necessary facilities and approvals for 777 maintenance, there would be nothing stopping PIA from using those facilities.

This is relevant still.

 

[Arsalan]

Will these planes be acquired on lease or is PIA buying and is going to own them? This is an important factor considering the current financial situation of PIA.