Pakistan's Service Rifle (G-3, Type-56) Replacement Competition 2016.

[Imran Khan]

rejected it was testing phase pic

 

[lastofthepatriots]

I will join TTP If Scar is not given to @Zarvan bhai.

 

[DJ_Viper]

Any Results about Rifle that's gonna replace G3

Bren 807

Beauty

How heavy is this? Do you know? This looks pretty heavy to me, may be its all composites so it would be lighter when you hold it. But AR type rifles are much less of a weight to keep in your hands. A soldier needs to be agile and be holding lighter weapons for quick reaction.

 

[Zarvan]

ARX-200 is going to replace G3 as far as the matter of ground realities is concerned. It is a natural replacement. Beretta will handover a legacy of quality to Pakistan which is necessary to replace the royal G3 of Pakistan Army. POF already signed an MoU with Beretta for upgrading of manufacturing facilities.

SCAR was best in performance in 7.62 X 51 and SCAR is giving quite good offers and SCAR is likely the winner for G3 replacement

 

[Sardar Anees Abbasi]

Look nice

 

[Zarvan]

Excellent one of my favorites which was supposedly dropped according to the "so called" insiders proved to be wrong. Now lets see x51 tender winner announced come on ARX200 Hazrat @Zarvan

I am also waiting for 7.62 X 51 winner. I am hoping for SCAR and as some members are suggesting that BREN and SCAR are similar in features than SCAR will be mostly likely going to win 7.62 X 51 so hope for the best.

 

[muhammadali233]

rejected it was testing phase pic

it is your word against yours.

 

[Imran Khan]

it is your word against yours.
View attachment 358957

i am sorry it was my mistake lets say when i see in 100 solders hands

 

[CriticalThought]

NOTE: MAJOR speculation ahead. If you know better, please correct me ASAP.

The induction of the CZ BREN, indicates a paradigm shift in the Army's grassroots level battle strategy. With a high powered rifle such as G3 in hand, there is a natural psychological inclination for the soldier to engage the enemy from larger distances. Combined with the difficulty to control and smaller magazine size, this can result in a drastically reduced kill ratio.

With the CZ, the army's strategy has evolved to closing the gap with the enemy. With an accurate, rugged rifle in hand wielding the stopping power of 7.62×39mm, combined with state of the art optics for pinpoint accuracy, the soldier transforms into a mean killing machine.

Back circa 2003/4, I remember reading a review somewhere by an American guy of the Pak Army's weaponry. The review on the G3 was extremely critical. The reviewer pointed out the same points I have noted above: basically, no human user can effectively engage a target at 500m+ with plain iron sights. This essentially makes the G3 an overpowered ammo cruncher. The reviewer further said that modern armies have already transitioned to providing optical sights to every soldier, and such provision is considered stock standard these days.

This modernization program has been long overdue. Kudos to our forward thinking leadership who have acted with decisiveness on the issue. Hopefully, this will have a follow on effect in raising the morale of our soldiers.

May Allah guide our Army according to the best outcomes for Islam and Muslims. Aaameen.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

How heavy is this? Do you know? This looks pretty heavy to me, may be its all composites so it would be lighter when you hold it. But AR type rifles are much less of a weight to keep in your hands. A soldier needs to be agile and be holding lighter weapons for quick reaction.

3.6 KG

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

Honestly, Pakistani modified Type-56 were very effective, reliable and not costly - I don't see why we have to replace them.

 

[DJ_Viper]

3.6 KG

Ok, good. So it has more composited weighing about 8 to 9 pounds with bullets, etc. That's not bad.

 

[CriticalThought]

Honestly, Pakistani modified Type-56 were very effective, reliable and not costly - I don't see why we have to replace them.

Looking at some videos about the CZ 806 on youtube:

1. The gun is extremely modular. Comes with 3 different barrel lengths.
2. Has a position to attach a silencer.
3. Accuracy is very good.
4. Ambidextrous.
5. They are boasting 'aircraft grade hardened aluminium'. Not sure what effect it has, but on of the aims I have read in articles is to acquire new manufacturing processes and technologies.

In general, the way I see it, more than the gun itself, POF is looking to acquire the manufacturing know how. Hopefully, this will translate to better versions of locally designed products such the POF LSR.

 

[Gryphon]

The induction of the CZ BREN, indicates a paradigm shift in the Army's grassroots level battle strategy. With a high powered rifle such as G3 in hand, there is a natural psychological inclination for the soldier to engage the enemy from larger distances. Combined with the difficulty to control and smaller magazine size, this can result in a drastically reduced kill ratio.

With the CZ, the army's strategy has evolved to closing the gap with the enemy. With an accurate, rugged rifle in hand wielding the stopping power of 7.62×39mm, combined with state of the art optics for pinpoint accuracy, the soldier transforms into a mean killing machine.

Back circa 2003/4, I remember reading a review somewhere by an American guy of the Pak Army's weaponry. The review on the G3 was extremely critical. The reviewer pointed out the same points I have noted above: basically, no human user can effectively engage a target at 500m+ with plain iron sights. This essentially makes the G3 an overpowered ammo cruncher. The reviewer further said that modern armies have already transitioned to providing optical sights to every soldier, and such provision is considered stock standard these days.

This modernization program has been long overdue. Kudos to our forward thinking leadership who have acted with decisiveness on the issue. Hopefully, this will have a follow on effect in raising the morale of our soldiers.

The biggest advantage of 7.62x51mm is that it can penetrate BP jackets. Otherwise, a magazine with 20 rounds only is a -ve.

Ok, good. So it has more composited weighing about 8 to 9 pounds with bullets, etc. That's not bad.

If we pick SCAR to replace G-3s then it would have made sense to have just one single production line for all rifles and training. Now we would have to train soldiers on two different rifles.

As the CZ official has said there are 3 finalists (out of total 8), another rifle (SCAR or Beretta) is unavoidable.

 

[CriticalThought]

The biggest advantage of 7.62x51mm is that it can penetrate BP jackets. Otherwise, a magazine with 20 rounds only is a -ve.

Not denying the efficacy of 51mm, but it really is about the distance. You don't want to be in the firing line of x39 at less than 200m. Some references:

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62×39mm

After 1989, the regular (PS) Russian bullets started to be manufactured with a steel core with a higher carbon concentration and subjected to heat treatment. This change improved their penetration by 1.5–2 times. It is not possible to externally distinguish these bullets from the earlier, softer PS ones except by year of fabrication. At about the same time, tool steel was adopted for a normal velocity 7.62×39 bullet. Called BP, this bullet was developed in the 1980s and 1990s. It was officially adopted for Russian service in 2002 under the service name "7.62 BP", and with the GRAU designation 7N23. The BP bullet is claimed to achieve over three times the penetration of the PS bullet; it can defeat the Russian bullet-proof vest with designation 6B5 at distances below 250 meters. The BP cartridge has the tip of its bullet painted black. The BP bullet itself is slightly longer (27.4 mm) compared to the PS bullet, but has the same mass of 7.9 grams.

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Where I wouldn't want to use x39 is mountain cliff ambushes involving a small number of troops armed only with rifles and rocket launchers. In other words, SF operations.