Pakistan’s 2020 economic growth to slow to 2.7%: World Bank

[313ghazi]

Nice way to justify this crisis created by MR ASAD UMAR where was this logic when dar was finance minister stop this double standard. Asad umar should be sacked.

I dont consider filling pockets of Sharif family a step forwards. That's why it can be seen as a different standard.

 

[Turingsage]

GOI was pleading for the money. You weren't at the meetings. I can assure you.

What a load of cods wallop. Every country in the world asks or investments. India policy has been clear for many uears now. WE DO NOT ASK FOR AID. NO GOVT MINISTER CIVIL SERVANT, HIGH COMMISSIONER, AMBASSADOR, TRADE MINISTER, FROM INDIA HAS ASKED FOR AID.
That is a plain unvarnished lie.
As for investments here in the UK the Trade Minister Prime Minister and every other minister visiting overseas asks for and solicits investments. Even Trump does.

Pakistan is unique, comparable to the total basket cases whose ministers go out looking for an endless gravy train of free aid.
Ministers in Pakistan also appear to see loans as investment. Deferred payment for oil and gas as investment.

 

[Rusty]

What a load of cods wallop. Every country in the world asks or investments. India policy has been clear for many uears now. WE DO NOT ASK FOR AID. NO GOVT MINISTER CIVIL SERVANT, HIGH COMMISSIONER, AMBASSADOR, TRADE MINISTER, FROM INDIA HAS ASKED FOR AID.
That is a plain unvarnished lie.
As for investments here in the UK the Trade Minister Prime Minister and every other minister visiting overseas asks for and solicits investments. Even Trump does.

Pakistan is unique, comparable to the total basket cases whose ministers go out looking for an endless gravy train of free aid.
Ministers in Pakistan also appear to see loans as investment. Deferred payment for oil and gas as investment.

Give it a rest, you still get aid from so many places, especially UK.

India has also gone to the IMF in the past

So you're sitting there pretending to have a toilet and acting like your better then us when you have gone through the extract same situation.

We will get through this, just like India.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Give it a rest, you still get aid from so many places, especially UK.

GoI receives zero aid from UK. We are a net aid giver than a receiver.

India has also gone to the IMF in the past

IMF/WB gives loan to all the countries, these are cheap loans. Even China receives such loans. Ever wonder why?

So you're sitting there pretending to have a toilet and acting like your better then us when you have gone through the extract same situation.

We've gone through the situation like nearly 30 years back. A lot of things have changed around the world since then. Pakistan simply doesn't fit to be called the same case as any other country. You are unique. You are surrounded by hostile neighbors, your trade with them is vital and yet is dwindling.

 

[Whirling_dervesh]

O ye potwaris of little faith. You are like heroin junkies going through a Cold Turkey. Your addiction for power and looting is so bad you would rob your own grandmothers for her pension money.

Wait and watch, Zardari and NS were both given full 5 year terms. Give this to PTI and you will see the difference.

I will reopen this thread then.

 

[Rusty]

GoI receives zero aid from UK. We are a net aid giver than a receiver.


IMF/WB gives loan to all the countries, these are cheap loans. Even China receives such loans. Ever wonder why?


We've gone through the situation like nearly 30 years back. A lot of things have changed around the world since then. Pakistan simply doesn't fit to be called the same case as any other country. You are unique. You are surrounded by hostile neighbors, your trade with them is vital and yet is dwindling.

You literally said nothing of value.

You didn't even disagree with my points.
And nice technicality of "GOI"

 

[Turingsage]

Give it a rest, you still get aid from so many places, especially UK.

India has also gone to the IMF in the past

Indian Government DOES NOT SOLICIT AID. The important word is Government. UK NGO's certainly work in India and fund projects but the INDIAN GOVERNMENT CATEGORICALLY DECLINES GOVERNMENT TO GOVERNMENT AID.

India refuses UK foreign aid
20 February 2017 | by IndiaGB | 0

YK Sinha, India’s new high commissioner to the UK, has said that his country no longer needs foreign aid, making it quite clear that India had never asked for or needed such aid from Britain.

“We are grateful for any assistance we received in the past or will get in the future. But if it suddenly stopped would it make a huge difference? No.

“Did anyone in the government of India ask for assistance? No,” he said in his interview with the Sunday Express following his appointment.

He told the newspaper that India has taken “unimaginable” steps forward in the last decades and that foreign aid is an issue of the past.
http://indiagbnews.com/government/india-refuses-uk-foreign-aid/

In fact India is a net provider of aid

No aid policy: How India changed from taker to donor
In 2013 India made it clear to both the US and Japan, which offered $200,000 towards Uttarakhand relief, that it will not accept the aid.
By
Dipanjan Roy Chaudhury

India over last one and a half decade has emerged a donor whenever natural disasters strike anywhere in the world, from impoverished Haiti to developed Japan.

In 2013 India made it clear to both the US and Japan, which offered $200,000 towards Uttarakhand relief, that it will not accept the aid.

“As a general policy in case of rescue and relief operations, we have followed the practice that we have adequate ability to respond to emergencies

Read more at:
//economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/65523690.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

Emerging power India gives more aid than it receives
India has quietly transitioned into the role of provider as in the last three years it has given more aid to foreign countries.

Ritu Sharma
Express News Service
NEW DELHI: From one of the highest recipient of multi-lateral development aid, India has quietly transitioned into the role of provider as in the last three years it has given more aid to foreign countries than it has received.

This was informed by Minister of State for External Affairs General VK Singh in a written reply to the Parliament. “India is currently a net donor of foreign aid. In the last three years, India has provided more aid to foreign countries, than it has received,” Singh said in response to a question on Wednesday.

Development Aid to foreign countries not only serves economic objectives but also as a strategic tool. The effort to raise the assistance it has been providing to foreign countries is part of a conscious effort on part of India to commensurate its role as an emerging power where it sees itself as one of the permanent members in the UN Security Council. In the financial year 2015-16 India gave Rs. 7719.65 crores as aid whereas it received Rs. 2,144.77 crore in NGO aid from foreign countries.




The neighbourhood is the biggest recipient of aid from India in sync with New Delhi’s “Neighbourhood first” policy. Bhutan for years have received the biggest chunk of Indian aid with Rs. 5,368.46 crores in 2015-16, primarily aimed at developing hydro-electric power in the Himalayan Kingdom. In the same financial year, the second largest recipient of the assistance was post-conflict Afghanistan where India has been constructing Parliament building, cricket stadium among other things. It is followed by Sri Lanka where India is undertaking the construction of houses for rehabilitation of Tamil population displaced by nearly three decades long war.

The largest provider of aid to India in 2015-16 was the Global Fund, the international financing organisation that gives aid to fight HIV/AIDS, Tuberculosis, Malaria and other diseases that provided Rs 1477.72 crore. The second largest donor is the European Union. Interestingly, the United Kingdom, the former colonial rulers of India have the balance sheet in negative for the year 2016-17.

http://www.newindianexpress.com

 

[Chhatrapati]

You literally said nothing of value.

You didn't even disagree with my points.
And nice technicality of "GOI"

India has no restriction on funding NGO's. Organizations like Amnesty, Save Children, etc... receives such funds. Despite India requesting them to stop these fundings.

You sound as if India asks for it. That stage have passed, we can handle things by ourselves. GoI is very relevant it isn't a technicality. If aid is funneled through governments sure, then it has some relevance.

 

[Abdussamad]

India has also gone to the IMF in the past

Last time was in the early 90s. They learned their lesson after that. We keep going back every 5-6 years.

 

[YeBeWarned]

it should be more than 4%

 

[Rusty]

Last time was in the early 90s. They learned their lesson after that. We keep going back every 5-6 years.

We are a dheet qaum
But current government has decided to never go again.
So better late then never

 

[Max Pain]

IMF and WB are not conspiring against poor countries. They do want you guys to pay off their debts and not write it off. Yes, IMF do write off debts at times. It is pointless to blame IMF and WB for your situation, these are your own making. IMF expect you to abide by their policies when they give loans, India have done that and it was proven beneficial in the 90's. IMF is reluctant now because you didn't adhere to the conditions of last loan. Now IMF put stiff condition before giving loan.

BTW, stopping imports is a stupid move, it'll only lead to more inflation and black market.

what do you think should be done,
how did India manage to get out of this back in late 90's

Am sorry to ask, i am not reading much on pak economy... but i come across plenty CPEC threads and projected growth rates .... what happened suddenly?..

reality happened

 

[Chhatrapati]

what do you think should be done,

If you are asking about taking loans then strictly adhere to IMF directions. They have a team of economists who know what they are doing. It will not be very popular measures. It may lead to temporary inflation for a while. But few years from now, it'll turn out to be fruitful.

What Pakistan in general should do is, break down the Zamindari system and have a new land reform. Put ceiling on how much land one person can hold. Empower the provincial governments, let them have more freedom from central government. These are the basics. There is a lot to be done on structural reforms.

how did India manage to get out of this back in late 90's

Pakistan is not in a similar situation as India in 1990's. I'll explain.

It wasn't simply Indian economy going down in one day. Back in those days, India and West weren't at good terms and as a moderately socialist nation our relationship and interests was aligned with USSR. So, our main export partner during the 1990's were none other than USSR, unfortunately Soviet Union split up into 15 countries (If my guess is right), which put pressure on our exports started dwindling.

In the 1990's Iraq attacked Kuwait, and in turn the Americans started a war with Iraq, ships couldn't reach Persian gulf and both Kuwait and Iraq were our largest oil suppliers, this lead to an oil crisis.

The then leadership was involved in a lot of scams and the political situation in India was a turmoil. Like the IPKF disaster in Lanka, Bofors Scam, Shah bano case, Rajiv Gandhi assassination etc...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Because India was aligned with USSR, US vetoed IMF bailout plan for India.
So we had to do the unimaginable thing at the time, we pledged around 70 tons of our gold reserve to IMF for $3.9 billion (todays $7.5 billion).

IMF put conditions, we had tough import conditions and duties on import goods were as high as 400%. So, we had to strike down a lot of such duties. Remove import restrictions.

Abolished license raj, until 1991 we need to have license to import even a screw. License was hard to get due to restriction and red tape. Also we had production licensing, i.e the government decided on what to produce and how to produce how many employees should be given job etc.

Then allowed foreign investors to come to India and start their own industries. This along with with Ambani and Tata lead to a stock market boom. All this contributed to more investments to India. Many government owned industries were privatized.

@Max Pain Do you see any similarities with the case of Pakistan? If yes, then please explain them, I don't know Pakistani laws regarding all that.

Anyway,Pakistan is in a better condition vis India in 1990's. And you may overcome the troubles in few years, it probably wouldn't take decades if correct measures are done.

 

[Rusty]

If you are asking about taking loans then strictly adhere to IMF directions. They have a team of economists who know what they are doing. It will not be very popular measures. It may lead to temporary inflation for a while. But few years from now, it'll turn out to be fruitful.

What Pakistan in general should do is, break down the Zamindari system and have a new land reform. Put ceiling on how much land one person can hold. Empower the provincial governments, let them have more freedom from central government. These are the basics. There is a lot to be done on structural reforms.


Pakistan is not in a similar situation as India in 1990's. I'll explain.

It wasn't simply Indian economy going down in one day. Back in those days, India and West weren't at good terms and as a moderately socialist nation our relationship and interests was aligned with USSR. So, our main export partner during the 1990's were none other than USSR, unfortunately Soviet Union split up into 15 countries (If my guess is right), which put pressure on our exports started dwindling.

In the 1990's Iraq attacked Kuwait, and in turn the Americans started a war with Iraq, ships couldn't reach Persian gulf and both Kuwait and Iraq were our largest oil suppliers, this lead to an oil crisis.

The then leadership was involved in a lot of scams and the political situation in India was a turmoil. Like the IPKF disaster in Lanka, Bofors Scam, Shah bano case, Rajiv Gandhi assassination etc...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Because India was aligned with USSR, US vetoed IMF bailout plan for India.
So we had to do the unimaginable thing at the time, we pledged around 70 tons of our gold reserve to IMF for $3.9 billion (todays $7.5 billion).

IMF put conditions, we had tough import conditions and duties on import goods were as high as 400%. So, we had to strike down a lot of such duties. Remove import restrictions.

Abolished license raj, until 1991 we need to have license to import even a screw. License was hard to get due to restriction and red tape. Also we had production licensing, i.e the government decided on what to produce and how to produce how many employees should be given job etc.

Then allowed foreign investors to come to India and start their own industries. This along with with Ambani and Tata lead to a stock market boom. All this contributed to more investments to India. Many government owned industries were privatized.

@Max Pain Do you see any similarities with the case of Pakistan? If yes, then please explain them, I don't know Pakistani laws regarding all that.

Anyway,Pakistan is in a better condition vis India in 1990's. And you may overcome the troubles in few years, it probably wouldn't take decades if correct measures are done.

A sensible Indian..... They do exist...

Anyways, I agree with your analysis.
Pakistan's problem are mostly self inflicted. That means we can mostly solve them ourselves.

I imagine we will be ok the right track in less than 5 years of good governance.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Anyways, I agree with your analysis.
Pakistan's problem are mostly self inflicted. That means we can mostly solve them ourselves.

I imagine we will be ok the right track in less than 5 years of good governance.

Just being optimistic. Without a significant export and industrial growth I don't see much opportunities for Pakistan. Situations with India and Afghanistan must be improved at least start a minimal trade. Forget India, Convince Afghan, who used to import in nearly $3 billion 2-3 years back have reduced to some $300 million range. Changing policies regarding the Taliban is not really helping trade with Pakistan. Similar is the case with Iran, expand opportunities with Iran.

If Imran and Modi (If he wins) is able to solve the Kashmir issue amicably, it'll be a big win for the region. If that happens, South Asia will be the next Gulf.