Pakistan urges China to soften terms for power deals

[KhanBaba2]

Maybe by reducing the interest rate, Pakistani government will get discount from those IPP (Independent Power Producer) to buy their electricity.

The whole saving on interest will be passed to the Pakistan Government, but try telling that to the Pakistani PDF members here. They have been refusing to believe that they have to bear the cost of the loan interest ever since it was clear that the interest rates were going to be kept a secret.

Look like Pakistan government who finance all 12 000 MW power plant project since the government who borrow the money from China. So it means Pakistan state owned companies who will build all of those power plants ???

The power plants are being build and paid for by Chinese companies. They are the owners. The Pakistani government has given them pretty generous guarantees of returns on their equity.

while the anti-CPEC side didn't formulate a real argument other than "Army this, Army that, Army, Army, Army."

There are a lot of articles in Pakistani media and also a lot of discussion here that criticize CPEC on economic grounds. Over here the voices got drowned by being called anti-national in case of their being Pakistani. If the poster was American, he was called anti Chinese. And Indians were called jealous. The supporters of CPEC never removed their blindfolds.

It doesn't need an economist to know that secret deals are bad deals. And secret deals mean kickbacks.

 

[ziaulislam]

Seems American were right about CPEC debt. And Imran Khan was right about reassess all CPEC project. Because PMLn blindly sign all contracts. Bring back Nawaz and co and get the answer of these mega debts.

Ofcourse they were...power generation and road infrastructure doesnt mean productivity..it means consumption..

You didnt saw bangakdesh vietnam or even china building motorways before its industrial revolution

Probkem with CPEC power deals as i already said 5 years ago was the RR..20%...now this isnt exculsive for china there are qatarian in it too. That is TWICE whats in india ..making electricuty more expensive than india despite our 30% of free energy mixed into it..

This 20 RR was a tragedy for out industry..i would have rather asked sharifs (& zardaris)to finance plants yourself rather than giving such a incredible return rate .. Hell they did built 3 LNG plants..why couldnt do it your self..
Now a 20% RR in hydro make sense(as hydro is way cheap anyway & it is BOT u get a free plant in 30 yrs & ITS JOB INTENSIVE) but for fuel which is already expensive its going to make it unfeasible

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I will like to say I TOLD YOU SO i wont tag the ones i had this discussion with

The whole saving on interest will be passed to the Pakistan Government, but try telling that to the Pakistani PDF members here. They have been refusing to believe that they have to bear the cost of the loan interest ever since it was clear that the interest rates were going to be kept a secret.



The power plants are being build and paid for by Chinese companies. They are the owners. The Pakistani government has given them pretty generous guarantees of returns on their equity.



There are a lot of articles in Pakistani media and also a lot of discussion here that criticize CPEC on economic grounds. Over here the voices got drowned by being called anti-national in case of their being Pakistani. If the poster was American, he was called anti Chinese. And Indians were called jealous. The supporters of CPEC never removed their blindfolds.

It doesn't need an economist to know that secret deals are bad deals. And secret deals mean kickbacks.

CPEC isnt bad..its the KICKBACKS that made CPEC bad..chinese arent tranparent they want shit done so kickbacks..are okay for them as long as shit gets done..plus they are business man first..

It all comes back to our culture " khata hey tu lagata be hey" its not CPEC or anyone else fault but fault of educated elite of country who supported two families in every way for their gains in the country and dubai..and idiots are stepped on the banwagan

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Having said the basic direction of going towards manufacturing and trying to get the power prices down is right..
Govt made first move of decreasing the LNG return but its going to be very tough with IMF at your head..you have revenue targets you need to meet..
Will china listen..probably not..its also a double axe sword you need investments too..china invested when noone wanted to..its a high risk investment ..

The only way out for pakistan to look at its economy and balance it out..a economy too much dependent upon one thing is destined to fail be it services (like ours), tourism(like dubai) or oil like saudis..see how corona is going to crush each one of these..

Diversify and stop importing oil seed when you call your self a agriculture country..

On agriculture I would give PTI 4/10 here and 3/10 for PPPP and 2/10 for PMLN .. But let see if their is balance sheet change when it comes to pulses and oil imports

 

[KhanBaba2]

CPEC isnt bad..its the KICKBACKS that made CPEC bad..chinese arent tranparent they want shit done so kickbacks..are okay for them as long as shit gets done..plus they are business man first..

You can also get shit done transparently.

Kickbacks are generally a small percentage of the increase in profits. If Pakistan people in power took large kickbacks, you can be sure that the tax payers of Pakistan will be paying a magnitude higher amount over the years to the kickback payers.

 

[ziaulislam]

You can also get shit done transparently.

Kickbacks are generally a small percentage of the increase in profits. If Pakistan people in power took large kickbacks, you can be sure that the tax payers of Pakistan will be paying a magnitude higher amount over the years to the kickback payers.

Kick backs are like this..
Give me 1 crore and we will manipulate to give u a return of 17% instead of known 10-15% rate

Why do you think you found qatari letters so easily ..? Ever wondered ..why not a lettee from bharian

 

[Yankee-stani]

We do have that mindset but slowly I see people becoming more adaptable and moving away from the Uncle type. We need to lose our emotions when Interacting with others.

Pakistanis tend to think when foreigners like Chinese and Turks say nice things they will support 1000 percent which in reality it's just diplomatic support and arms support but not much

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

Bro what does the harsh cut throat nature of CPC have to do with my background??

Thats why i said atleaset 1 concession out of 2 but remember We are talking about this due to Covid-19 , which is once in a life time kind of situation ( Earth quakes , floods e.t.c happened in certain parts of Pakistan in Past but this time whole Pakistan , or may i say whole world including China ) , Plus with countering Anti CPEC propaganda by western countries and chance for China to show the world that China friendship brings Benefits not Debt traps , We can say they will give some concessions but dont know which ones .
If u don't agree no need to show your background by disrespecting/snubbing new members. Thanks . Take Care .

 

[Yankee-stani]

Bro what does the harsh cut throat nature of CPC have to do with my background??

Should equal wary of all foreigners not just Chinese

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

Indians!
They count as foreigners right?

Should equal wary of all foreigners not just Chinese

 

[Yankee-stani]

Indians!
They count as foreigners right?

Yes them too

 

[Sine Nomine]

Tag all ruling junta fanbois.

 

[nahtanbob]

Kick backs are like this..
Give me 1 crore and we will manipulate to give u a return of 17% instead of known 10-15% rate

Why do you think you found qatari letters so easily ..? Ever wondered ..why not a lettee from bharian

If you are giving 17% return why not give it to a local crony capitalist. At least he will keep most of the profit within Pakistan

 

[KhanBaba2]

At least he will keep most of the profit within Pakistan

He doesn't. Nobody does.

 

[nahtanbob]

He doesn't. Nobody does.

I cannot help you there