Pakistan seeks Russia, South Korea and New Zealand's support for Nuclear Suppliers Group membership

[VCheng]

Well you can trace back the roots of the problems a decade or so back, may be, but the real trouble came in last few years only. I would go so far to say that even PPP tenure was better in foreign policy and especially diplomacy compared to this current one.


that is a myth on which you and i had have lengthy discussions in the past as well. Not to go down the same road, in this post i mentioned "that the government NEEDS to take care of" :

Ordering the government to "take care" of these issues simply will not work here. Pakistan's predicament is set to grow much worse in the coming years, a fact that I have highlighted for years already. This is just the beginning.

 

[A-Team]

Ordering the government to "take care" of these issues simply will not work here. Pakistan's predicament is set to grow much worse in the coming years, a fact that I have highlighted for years already. This is just the beginning.

So what is the solution in your opinion?

 

[Arsalan]

Ordering the government to "take care" of these issues simply will not work here. Pakistan's predicament is set to grow much worse in the coming years, a fact that I have highlighted for years already. This is just the beginning.

It is not about ordering rather just "pointing out" and i am sure there wont be many who disagree with this statement, you wont disagree with this i suppose!
Like everyone else, i appreciate the solution to the problem more then the identification of the problem alone. That is the more constructive approach. What is your version of solution to this problem?
(yeah i know we have talked about this in the past but perhaps it will be good for the discussion? or shall we leave it for the relevant thread and time? )

So what is the solution in your opinion?

exactly!! That is how it should be. When one identify the problem, it is better he also proposes a solution. That is how we can get maximum out of this forum.

 

[VCheng]

It is not about ordering rather just "pointing out" and i am sure there wont be many who disagree with this statement, you wont disagree with this i suppose!
Like everyone else, i appreciate the solution to the problem more then the identification of the problem alone. That is the more constructive approach. What is your version of solution to this problem?
(yeah i know we have talked about this in the past but perhaps it will be good for the discussion? or shall we leave it for the relevant thread and time? )

We can discuss it here, or elsewhere, but the first thing to determine is whether an effective solution exists. Only then can one talk about what shape it might take.

 

[Arsalan]

We can discuss it here, or elsewhere, but the first thing to determine is whether an effective solution exists. Only then can one talk about what shape it might take.

Well i believe that there is no problem which do not have an effective solution to it other then death. The onus is on the ones who need to/have to find that solution and implement it. All we do/can do is talk about it. Are you of the view that there is NO solution to this? I don't take you for someone who will give up so easily

 

[VCheng]

Well i believe that there is no problem which do not have an effective solution to it other then death. The onus is on the ones who need to/have to find that solution and implement it. All we do/can do is talk about it. Are you of the view that there is NO solution to this? I don't take you for someone who will give up so easily

Okay, let us discuss this as best as we can:

Let us state the problem first: Pakistan's lack of international support to gain membership of NSG on par with India.

One good way to proceed would be to ask "why" 5 times:

1. Why does Pakistan have no support for its NSG bid?

 

[Winchester]

With a foreign policy like ours we are talking about support of NZ and Korea!!

Korea has an economy of $ 1.3 trillion almost equal to that of India and carries much more economic clout than Pakistan ever will.

NZL is a NSG member and each vote counts hence even Modi is visiting Mexico.

We must contact all 48 members of the NSG from Slovenia to Romania to Kazakhstan.

 

[Arsalan]

Korea has an economy of $ 1.3 trillion almost equal to that of India and carries much more economic clout than Pakistan ever will.

NZL is a NSG member and each vote counts hence even Modi is visiting Mexico.

We must contact all 48 members of the NSG from Slovenia to Romania to Kazakhstan.

Surely we should. One if you have seen my previous posts you would realize that i have just been short of banging my head against the wall at this matter. What i am concerned about is the effectiveness of such approaches given our current state of foreign relations/policy and diplomatic efforts.

 

[khanmubashir]

this is a strategy with china we know that west would not allow our membership but china would use this aS an excuse to veto india entry to nsg on basis of no biased favors can be allowed

this is a strategy with china we know that west would not allow our membership but china would use this aS an excuse to veto india entry to nsg on basis of no biased favors can be allowed

 

[Pumba]

Korea has an economy of $ 1.3 trillion almost equal to that of India and carries much more economic clout than Pakistan ever will.

NZL is a NSG member and each vote counts hence even Modi is visiting Mexico.

We must contact all 48 members of the NSG from Slovenia to Romania to Kazakhstan.

Almost equal oh yes

 

[Arsalan]

Okay, let us discuss this as best as we can:

Let us state the problem first: Pakistan's lack of international support to gain membership of NSG on par with India.

One good way to proceed would be to ask "why" 5 times:

1. Why does Pakistan have no support for its NSG bid?

Just a little correction, the problem is not just that. It is not only about support at this NSG matter and it is more about the lack of trust/support on an international level regarding many issues. However if you want to limit this to NSG may be it will help contain the debate here. So, why don't you go ahead and answer this same question you have just posted.

 

[Piper]

Just a little correction, the problem is not just that. It is not only about support at this NSG matter and it is more about the lack of trust/support on an international level regarding many issues. However if you want to limit this to NSG may be it will help contain the debate here. So, why don't you go ahead and answer this same question you have just posted.

I think it has less to do with Pakistan and it's past follies (of which there are many). India's entry into NSG, is a culmination of demographic, geopolitical and economic factors all of which Pakistan and to an extent even "Indian State" does not have influence on.

Infact if it would have been any other country having combination of beneficial traits like India, it would have gained NSG and even UNSC membership much earlier but Indian's in their usual meandering way took the stumbling, blundering path to it.

 

[Winchester]

What i am concerned about is the effectiveness of such approaches given our current state of foreign relations/policy and diplomatic efforts.

The current state of our foreign policy is inhibited by the current as well as future state of our economy.

The biggest challenge is the U.S appointing Bharat as its regional sheriff here.

We have two choices here, either submit to this new dynamic and be like what Egypt is to Israel OR put our national interests first, team up with China and make the difficult decisions to make the economy work.

The good news is we won't submit like Israel's Arab neighbors, the bad news is we are not willing to put in the hard yards to really stand-up.

 

[war&peace]

Pakistan does not even have a FM....After three years of the "tajurba kar" team took over. I'm fasting otherwise a few 4-lettered words for them..
How can you expect to get support from these countries while you did not even bother to engage them previously. The world outside Pakistan does not run on adhoc basis or at whims and wishes of individuals; it takes time, dedication and efforts through smart diplomacy. Though I wish that Pakistan gets NSG membership but not much expectations. Perhaps we are up for a surprise...who knows

 

[OrionHunter]

Well thanks for your well wishes but the truth is we have messed up or foreign policy and diplomatic efforts real bad in last two three years or so and i do not see much effort being out in to improve that. Sadly, our concerned authorities do not seem to be well aware of the important of this in today's world.

So the question is: Where's your minister for external affairs? Or is there no one because he/she will be a lame duck considering that foreign affairs are fully controlled by the Pak Army?