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Pak & India should withdraw from Siachen, Nawaz Sharif
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No sir, it is NOT your territory unless you are directionally and geographically challenged.
No it does not.
Pak thinks Siachen belongs to it just like India thinks whole of Kashmir belongs to it. Big difference
SpArK
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saiyan0321
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buddy your the one challenged if you would bother to read and even go to some threads about saichin over there it clearly says that the loc according to the shimla agreement it comes on our side it was abandoned yes but it was on our side of the loc and you took it how is it your territory and if you r talking about all of kashmir belongs to india then this discussion ends here bcz we can say the same thing
saiyan0321
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i am going to repost this as he pretty much summed it all up and every nw and then some new indian will come over here all chest thumping and they can read this and shut up........ but still if they say pakistan has no control or right on saichin then buddy you r trolling
third eye
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Demilitarisation of Siachen: Let's not get swayed by oratory , aninews
The Indo-Pakistan impasse on Siachen has been described by Dr Stephen Cohen, a Washington based South Asia analyst as 'a fight between two bald men over a comb'.
The problem with US thinkers and opinion makers is that they oversimplify important strategic issues as has been done by the good doctor with his bland comment.
One would expect them to be gracious enough to give a modicum of respect to the intelligence of the parties involved in the dispute. We do not have a set of idiots sitting in India and Pakistan who fail to understand what the good doctor wishes to project as a fairly easy issue.
The matter of demilitarisation has been debated between India and Pakistan for many years now. At the diplomatic level, no less than 12 meetings have been held and on many an occasion it has been said that a breakthrough is around the corner. During the last decade, two Prime Ministers of India, Atal Bihari Vajpayee and Manmohan Singh, have expressly desired a withdrawal of forces, and their sentiments are echoed my many political leaders in Pakistan, especially Nawaz Sharif.
Recently, an avalanche on the Pakistani side of the glacier has claimed more than 124 Pakistani Army soldiers and 11 civilian
contractors. Those who lost their lives were mostly from the ill fated Northern Light Infantry of the Pakistan Army, whose soldiers were used as cannon fodder for their Army's misadventures against India during the Kargil conflict.
Being Shia natives belonging to the occupied territories, they are considered to be expendable. It is for this reason that they were sent into India to die in the Kargil war and are now expected to man all environmentally sensitive and calamity prone regions like Gayari where the recent avalanche occurred on April, 07
.
The calamity of huge proportions once again put the spotlight on the issue of demilitarisation of the region. In this instance the
initiative was taken by none other than the Pakistani Army Chief,General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani. While on a visit to the site of the
disaster, he spoke of peaceful co-existence with India, withdrawal of troops from Siachen and cuts in the defence budget to boost economic activity.
The Pakistani press and commentators went into over drive after the statement was released. Some described Kayani's statement as revolutionary and pertinent to Pakistan's interests. Others considered it to be significant since the army has traditionally been regarded as dominated by hawks. Yet another opinion termed this as a surprisingly refreshing view of Pakistan-India relations which points towards a rethink in the military's fixation of India being a permanent enemy.
"Why should we be going for an agreement, we should just withdraw," said Imtiaz Alam, the Pakistan based head of the South Asian Free Media Association.
In India also, a demand to take advantage of the opening provided by Kayani to resolve the issue has started doing the rounds.
The popular sentiment was soon enough put to rest. An emphatic denial of any change in Pakistan's policy on Siachen in the wake of General Kayani's statement was issued by the country's foreign office. Thiswas further emphasised by the Pakistan Foreign Minister, Hina Rabbani Khar, who said that the withdrawal would happen only when both countries trust each other. Since the Pakistani foreign office cannot dare to counter what General Kayani has said, one cannot but ask whether there has been a real change of heart.
One may ask, what is so difficult about the whole issue that it cannot be resolved' There is a two word answer- 'trust deficit'. India is, very rightly, not ready to contemplate any change in its advantageous tactical position astride the Saltoro Ridge till such time that the actual position on ground of the two sides is not authenticated on a map; Pakistan is, of course, not ready to do anything which would tie down its options for the future and take the region out of the ambit of being a boundary dispute. This aspect, in itself, nullifies most hopes of a forward movement in the talks.
A third dimension has been added to the problem by the Chinese interest and ingress into Pakistan's illegally occupied Indian
territory of Gilgit-Baltistan. Now in an open and blatant act of felony, it has seceded some strategically important real estate of
Gilgit-Baltistan to China. As a result, China can also look covetously towards the Saltoro Ridge. Under these circumstances, even if India and Pakistan reach to an agreement for withdrawal of forces from the glacier, what stops China from conniving with Pakistan to occupy the dominant positions' Considering the cosy relationship that exists between these two Nations it would become a classic case of Pakistan eating the cake and having it too.
The expenditure that is being incurred by India to hold on to Siachen is well within the means of the country. If anybody is feeling the pinch it is Pakistan . A problem bigger than the expenditure is the environmental degradation that is taking place in the ecologically sensitive zone due to continued presence of a large body of men and material; India needs to take a call on this aspect by instituting measures to clean up the piling up waste in the area.
Beyond this the country cannot afford to be swayed by the oratory of some doves and pressures emanating from Pakistan. While tasking a positive view of the whole issue, primacy has to be given to facets of real estate, sovereignty, strategic interests and above all the trust deficit. (ANI)
The Indo-Pakistan impasse on Siachen has been described by Dr Stephen Cohen, a Washington based South Asia analyst as 'a fight between two bald men over a comb'.
The problem with US thinkers and opinion makers is that they oversimplify important strategic issues as has been done by the good doctor with his bland comment.
One would expect them to be gracious enough to give a modicum of respect to the intelligence of the parties involved in the dispute. We do not have a set of idiots sitting in India and Pakistan who fail to understand what the good doctor wishes to project as a fairly easy issue.
The matter of demilitarisation has been debated between India and Pakistan for many years now. At the diplomatic level, no less than 12 meetings have been held and on many an occasion it has been said that a breakthrough is around the corner. During the last decade, two Prime Ministers of India, Atal Bihari Vajpayee and Manmohan Singh, have expressly desired a withdrawal of forces, and their sentiments are echoed my many political leaders in Pakistan, especially Nawaz Sharif.
Recently, an avalanche on the Pakistani side of the glacier has claimed more than 124 Pakistani Army soldiers and 11 civilian
contractors. Those who lost their lives were mostly from the ill fated Northern Light Infantry of the Pakistan Army, whose soldiers were used as cannon fodder for their Army's misadventures against India during the Kargil conflict.
Being Shia natives belonging to the occupied territories, they are considered to be expendable. It is for this reason that they were sent into India to die in the Kargil war and are now expected to man all environmentally sensitive and calamity prone regions like Gayari where the recent avalanche occurred on April, 07
.
The calamity of huge proportions once again put the spotlight on the issue of demilitarisation of the region. In this instance the
initiative was taken by none other than the Pakistani Army Chief,General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani. While on a visit to the site of the
disaster, he spoke of peaceful co-existence with India, withdrawal of troops from Siachen and cuts in the defence budget to boost economic activity.
The Pakistani press and commentators went into over drive after the statement was released. Some described Kayani's statement as revolutionary and pertinent to Pakistan's interests. Others considered it to be significant since the army has traditionally been regarded as dominated by hawks. Yet another opinion termed this as a surprisingly refreshing view of Pakistan-India relations which points towards a rethink in the military's fixation of India being a permanent enemy.
"Why should we be going for an agreement, we should just withdraw," said Imtiaz Alam, the Pakistan based head of the South Asian Free Media Association.
In India also, a demand to take advantage of the opening provided by Kayani to resolve the issue has started doing the rounds.
The popular sentiment was soon enough put to rest. An emphatic denial of any change in Pakistan's policy on Siachen in the wake of General Kayani's statement was issued by the country's foreign office. Thiswas further emphasised by the Pakistan Foreign Minister, Hina Rabbani Khar, who said that the withdrawal would happen only when both countries trust each other. Since the Pakistani foreign office cannot dare to counter what General Kayani has said, one cannot but ask whether there has been a real change of heart.
One may ask, what is so difficult about the whole issue that it cannot be resolved' There is a two word answer- 'trust deficit'. India is, very rightly, not ready to contemplate any change in its advantageous tactical position astride the Saltoro Ridge till such time that the actual position on ground of the two sides is not authenticated on a map; Pakistan is, of course, not ready to do anything which would tie down its options for the future and take the region out of the ambit of being a boundary dispute. This aspect, in itself, nullifies most hopes of a forward movement in the talks.
A third dimension has been added to the problem by the Chinese interest and ingress into Pakistan's illegally occupied Indian
territory of Gilgit-Baltistan. Now in an open and blatant act of felony, it has seceded some strategically important real estate of
Gilgit-Baltistan to China. As a result, China can also look covetously towards the Saltoro Ridge. Under these circumstances, even if India and Pakistan reach to an agreement for withdrawal of forces from the glacier, what stops China from conniving with Pakistan to occupy the dominant positions' Considering the cosy relationship that exists between these two Nations it would become a classic case of Pakistan eating the cake and having it too.
The expenditure that is being incurred by India to hold on to Siachen is well within the means of the country. If anybody is feeling the pinch it is Pakistan . A problem bigger than the expenditure is the environmental degradation that is taking place in the ecologically sensitive zone due to continued presence of a large body of men and material; India needs to take a call on this aspect by instituting measures to clean up the piling up waste in the area.
Beyond this the country cannot afford to be swayed by the oratory of some doves and pressures emanating from Pakistan. While tasking a positive view of the whole issue, primacy has to be given to facets of real estate, sovereignty, strategic interests and above all the trust deficit. (ANI)
ice_man
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Being Shia natives belonging to the occupied territories, they are considered to be expendable. It is for this reason that they were sent into India to die in the Kargil war and are now expected to man all environmentally sensitive and calamity prone regions like Gayari where the recent avalanche occurred on April, 07
A third dimension has been added to the problem by the Chinese interest and ingress into Pakistan's illegally occupied Indian
territory of Gilgit-Baltistan. Now in an open and blatant act of felony, it has seceded some strategically important real estate of
Gilgit-Baltistan to China. As a result, China can also look covetously towards the Saltoro Ridge. Under these circumstances, even if India and Pakistan reach to an agreement for withdrawal of forces from the glacier, what stops China from conniving with Pakistan to occupy the dominant positions' Considering the cosy relationship that exists between these two Nations it would become a classic case of Pakistan eating the cake and having it too.
good propaganda and insecurities by indians!
A third dimension has been added to the problem by the Chinese interest and ingress into Pakistan's illegally occupied Indian
territory of Gilgit-Baltistan. Now in an open and blatant act of felony, it has seceded some strategically important real estate of
Gilgit-Baltistan to China. As a result, China can also look covetously towards the Saltoro Ridge. Under these circumstances, even if India and Pakistan reach to an agreement for withdrawal of forces from the glacier, what stops China from conniving with Pakistan to occupy the dominant positions' Considering the cosy relationship that exists between these two Nations it would become a classic case of Pakistan eating the cake and having it too.
good propaganda and insecurities by indians!
Bang Galore
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Standard rubbish by people unable to come to terms with reality. Saltoro is not Siachen! Pakistan forces cannot even see the Siachen glacier from their posts let alone stepping on it.
Shardul.....the lion
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People here make prominent mistake.
India's official stand is All Jammu and Kashmir including gilgit/baltistan is integral part of India.
So, Giving up a strategically and defensively important position for the sake of goodwill (especially when opposition is weaker than you) is next to stupidity.
Now imagine reverse situation, if Pakistan had a booming economy, and had plenty of money and resources for armed forces, Pakistan would never compromised on position of strength.
India's official stand is All Jammu and Kashmir including gilgit/baltistan is integral part of India.
So, Giving up a strategically and defensively important position for the sake of goodwill (especially when opposition is weaker than you) is next to stupidity.
Now imagine reverse situation, if Pakistan had a booming economy, and had plenty of money and resources for armed forces, Pakistan would never compromised on position of strength.
tarrar
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Nawaz Sharif is one sick bastard who has no idea what to say. He is one big anti Pakistani who now a days is openly speaking against Pakistan & Pakistan Army. I don't see any reason why Article 6 should not be applied on this bastard. He is a traitor SOB.
AdeelFaheem
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Dedicated to every Soldier in Siachen (Either side)
Especially Victims of Giyari :
Aaiyah Arz Guzarain k Nigar e Hasti
Zehr e Imroz mai Shirini e Farda Bhar Day
Wo Jinhain Tab e Giran, Bari e Ayyam Nahi
Onke Palkon py Shab o Roz ko halka kr Day
Jin ke Aankhon ko Rukh e Subh ka Yaara b Nahi
On ke Ratoon mai Koi Shamah Munawar kr Day
Jin k Qadmon ko Kisi Rah ka Sahara b Nahi
On ke Nazron mai Koi Rah Ujagar kar Day
(Faiz Sahab)
Especially Victims of Giyari :
Aaiyah Arz Guzarain k Nigar e Hasti
Zehr e Imroz mai Shirini e Farda Bhar Day
Wo Jinhain Tab e Giran, Bari e Ayyam Nahi
Onke Palkon py Shab o Roz ko halka kr Day
Jin ke Aankhon ko Rukh e Subh ka Yaara b Nahi
On ke Ratoon mai Koi Shamah Munawar kr Day
Jin k Qadmon ko Kisi Rah ka Sahara b Nahi
On ke Nazron mai Koi Rah Ujagar kar Day
(Faiz Sahab)
Bobby
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How many times will you guys repeat this debunked myth ?
Enlighten me , where is the Gyari Sector ?
Where is Gyong La - one of the three major mountain passes ?
Where is Conway Saddle ? Pakistan's army largest base on the Siachin area ...
As a result of operation "Meghdoot", two out of three passes on the Siachen Sia La and Bilfond La -- came under India's control, while the third pass -- Gyong La remained under Pakistan's control.
-Cobra Post
It then mounted a superhuman effort to stabilise the situation, even as the initial tactical advantage had enabled the Indian army to capture positions on the ridge; the valorous Pakistani contingent was still a week short of it. This counter-move was not futile; it relatively secured the Gyong La pass sub-sector
-Tacstrat
In two ways, India s position has already been compromised, as Pakistan controls the Gyong La pass overlooking Shylok and Nubra rivers, along with the road that links mainland India to Leh, and China s de facto hold over Aksai Chin.
-BR
All the Important points are with India....Pakistan is bellow Siachen waiting to capture...Pakistan tried several times but failed miserably.... So Siachen is with India and Pakistan is near Siachen....Same way at the time of Kargil war...Pakistan was owning the Kargil and Indian were below major hill...later they recaptured those points back in Kargil
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