PAF Within a Decade an Economical Perspective

[Muhammad Omar]

i think J-16 is out of question China can't export them because they are based on Su-30 MKK/MKK-2 which is Russian intellectual property (their design)

If it's available then PAF should try otherwise J-10C is the way forward

 

[imranyounus]

Most logical post on the topic.
A

i think duel seat JF 17 will defiantly remove second.

In regards to the Mirage 3/5....its a simple airframe made with aviation grade aluminum. We have plenty of spare components. Keeping them going only requires labor, which we have lots of. I have no doubt that PAC can keep them air worthy for many years. The bigger issue is the engine. PAC can refurbish them but not really replace them. Old planes can still have a big effect on the battlefield. The USAF's ancient B52's will outlast the stealth B2.

South Africa replaced their engines with a more powerful Snecma Atar 9K50C-11 afterburning turbojet engine, with 49.2 kN (11,100 lbf) thrust dry and 70.6 kN (15,900 lbf) with afterburner.

South African variant of the Atar09K-50 with new compressor, new turbine, new electronics.

When we imitated ROSE program for mirages Pakistan did not had capability to produce a air craft. now things are different. an aircraft technically has three components air-frame engine and avionics.

if we change avionics and engine than why keep an old frame why not use a new air frame i.e JF 17

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

if we change avionics and engine than why keep an old frame

We did buy some new Wings from South Africa that gave an extended life to our old Mirages.

 

[Cornered Tiger]

The Chinese have made their pitch to the GoP, we will see if the make a good reply. Fingers crossed.

Hello Rafi, any progress or update?

Just as you said these words in January, 2019.

Sheikh sb said the same in February, 2019. Watch out

 

[Path-Finder]

The SMR-95 is a modified RD-33 twin-shaft turbojet engine with afterburner for MiG-29 that was developed in mid-90s to upgrade foreign-made 2nd and 3rd generation jet fighters. The engine passed bench tests and flight tests on the Super Mirage F-1 and Super Cheetah D-2 aircraft of the South African Air Force. The flight performance and combat efficiency of these fighter equipped with the new engine improved by a factor ranging from 1.2 to 3.0.

https://web.archive.org/web/20070916180338/http://en.klimov.ru/production/aircraft/SMR-95/

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

My only concern with the current Russian/Chinese jet engines is their Metallurgy,which in my opinion is still half a century behind the current Western counterparts.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

i think J-16 is out of question China can't export them because they are based on Su-30 MKK/MKK-2 which is Russian intellectual property (their design)

Its a pity we cant have these highly modified Flankers in our inventory.

 

[Esgalduin]

PAF need an advance 4.5/ 5.0 generation fighter immediately to counter threat posed to us from Indian Rafale fighters as well as S-400 SAMs . Best options in this category will be Russian Su-35 or their Chinese version J-11/15/16 Flankers . To get these we need to negotiate with Russia and ask friendly loan from China to finance it . If this fails then second best option is try to convince Chinese to give us at least 2 squadrons of J-20s as this can counter the current Indian threats .

At the same time PAF may continue with current lot of F-16s but should not try to get any more as they will come with too much conditions and risk . PAF should continue to develop and induct JF-17 Block 3 which may be similar to J-10s although J-10C may have slight edge in aerodynamics but since PAF is already way ahead in JF-17 development so Block 3 is more economical option in comparison to J-10s.

For future PAF need to evaluate one of the two options ......Fifth generation Chinese J-31 vs. home made Project AZM . J-31 has 2 advantages over Project AZM . First is that J-31 is already in development stage where as Project AZM will take at least 8 years to materialize. Also in order to make it feasible and within acceptable cost per unit the Project AZM should be built and sold in enough numbers - around 200 plus and PAF should be ready to take all of this quantity and should not depend on export orders . With J-31 we can order as per requirement only as Chinese are also going to built them in enough numbers for their own Air Force so its cost per unit will be reasonable .

One good option for PAF can be to go for joint production of J-31 with Chinese by making PAF items within Pakistan along with modification suited to Pakistan's needs . This can give PAF experience in making a 5th Generation plane and also save time and cost as compared to going all alone in Project AZM.

Lets hope PAF decision makers are working thoroughly and selflessly on these options and decide on the best !!!!

You are correct and made very good points. But we also need to understand that platform acquisition is only one half of the entire picture. The other half is integration of cutting edge software and other technologies that enable a more fluid command structure. India's biggest mistake was investing in hardware and platforms such as the Sukhois and Mirages, while failing to recognise the technological edge that Pakistan had in terms of software as well as effective range of its missiles. Rafales biggest advantage is its sensors and the Meteor's advanced range. To counter that, we don't necessarily need newer platforms; we need to integrate better technology with exisitng platforms. The PL-15 will be more than a match for the Meteor.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

we need to integrate better technology with exisitng platforms. The PL-15 will be more than a match for the Meteor.

I do very hope so my friend!! Whilst the Rafale and Meteor combination is a tried and tested one, Not all has been revealed about PL-15 ,it has yet to be proven in battle as well. But some Indian experts are worried !!!
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/20...ce-despite-rafale-jet-deployment-iaf-veteran/

 

[Safriz]

Few people know of "Air force development program 2025" launched by General Musharraf in 2004.
It was an extensive and comprehensive program to upgrade and modernize PAF.
The PAF had to get 800 million USD per year for 21 years.
J-10 was part of that program.
Then came zardari and the rest is history.

I do very hope so my friend!! Whilst the Rafale and Meteor combination is a tried and tested one, Not all has been revealed about PL-15 ,it has yet to be proven in battle as well. But some Indian experts are worried !!!
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/20...ce-despite-rafale-jet-deployment-iaf-veteran/

Rafale and meteor have never been used in an actual air combat.
Bombing some terrorists in northern Africa who have no air defence, doesn't count.

 

[Esgalduin]

I do very hope so my friend!! Whilst the Rafale and Meteor combination is a tried and tested one, Not all has been revealed about PL-15 ,it has yet to be proven in battle as well. But some Indian experts are worried !!!
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/20...ce-despite-rafale-jet-deployment-iaf-veteran/

The Chinese have the right idea with keeping their capabilities classified. I know the US military is worried about PL-15 so that is good enough for me.

 

[mingle]

Hello Rafi, any progress or update?

Just as you said these words in January, 2019.

Sheikh sb said the same in February, 2019. Watch out

He talked about Mush time J10 was pitched along F16s purchase PAF called her F10

J10C might come. Who knows

How many jetts type PAF wants????

 

[Armchair]

We did buy some new Wings from South Africa that gave an extended life to our old Mirages.

Pakistan now has the ability to build wings in Pakistan should they need to do so. The pure delta allows for an amazing low level strike hot rod. I'd love to see equipment for nap of the earth flight installed.

 

[Cornered Tiger]

He talked about Mush time J10 was pitched along F16s purchase PAF called her F10

Watch again and complete please. He said, J-10/F-10 is coming.

 

[Ultima Thule]

How many jetts type PAF wants????

36/72 would be fine i think