Over 100 Sunni scholars declare Wahhabis to be outside mainstream [Sunni] Islam

[Suff Shikan]

They are Salafi inspired. Like some fanatic Deobandis, most of the things they believe in are similar to Wahabis.

I am Deobandi and I am not a Fanatic, Taliban are not Salafi Inspired.

 

[Max]

Taliban are not Salafis/Wahabbis. They are Deobandis another sect of Sunni Islam

you dont know the story behind deobandism, do you? There was only traditional Islam in Indian subcontinent untill 18th century.. There were some Ulema who were not in favor of certain Sufi ways, but they never did Takfeer on them..

Then a Mullah named Shah Ismail dehalavi visit modren day KSA and from where he brought Ibn e Abdul Wahhab's Kitab al tawheed.. he came back to India and publish that book with name of Taqwiyat ul Imaan.. from where deobandism started in India.,. Shah Ismail Dehlavi is combined founder of Deobandis and Wahhabis in South Asia..


The only difference between them and Salafis is Deobandi claim to follow Imam while Salafist dont follow anyone..

They are inspired from Wahhabism from head to toe, for example if you ask a traditional Sunni (Barelvi) about Ibn e Abdul Wahab they will curse him for all the shit happening in today's world,

but The Deobandi will never curse ibne Abdul Wahhab, they will defend his work even it cost them their lives..

similarly, deobandi like Wahhabbis are fan of Takfeer, for them Yeh bhi Kafir, woh bhi Kafir, Jo na mane wo Bhi Kafir is equally applied towards all

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Makes me feel bad for being a Wahabi.

But I am what I am.

 

[Devil Soul]

A Sunni or a Wahabi or a Shia... All got extremist among themselves, instead of talking & working on clearing misunderstanding these so called Sheikhs are declaring each other non muslims etc.. this pretty much show that they r no different to those holding gun against those who don't agree with their thinking.. for me fake mullahs doesn't matter if they r Wahabi, Sunni or Shia r the worst kind & r reponsible for suffering of Muslims

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

you dont know the story behind deobandism, do you? There was only traditional Islam in Indian subcontinent untill 18th century.. There were some Ulema who were not in favor of certain Sufi ways, but they never did Takfeer on them..

Then a Mullah named Shah Ismail dehalavi visit modren day KSA and from where he brought Ibn e Abdul Wahhab's Kitab al tawheed.. he came back to India and publish that book with name of Taqwiyat ul Imaan.. from where deobandism started in India.,. Shah Ismail Dehlavi is combined founder of Deobandis and Wahhabis in South Asia..


The only difference between them and Salafis is Deobandi claim to follow Imam while Salafist dont follow anyone..

They are inspired from Wahhabism from head to toe, for example if you ask a traditional Sunni (Barelvi) about Ibn e Abdul Wahab they will curse him for all the shit happening in today's world,

but The Deobandi will never curse ibne Abdul Wahhab, they will defend his work even it cost them their lives..

similarly, deobandi like Wahhabbis are fan of Takfeer, for them Yeh bhi Kafir, woh bhi Kafir, Jo na mane wo Bhi Kafir is equally applied towards all

Wow. So basically both these schools of thought are one and the same just packaged and presented under a different brand name. Hmmm.

Can you tell me why the Pakistani state and army despite Pakistan being a majority Sufi/Barelvi country continue to support and nurture Wahabbi/Salafi/Deobandi groups like Afghan Taliban, LeT and JeM ? Isn't that counter productive for Pakistan and its society ?

 

[Max]

Wow. So basically both these schools of thought are one and the same just packaged and presented under a different brand name. Hmmm.

Can you tell me why the Pakistani state and army despite Pakistan being a majority Sufi/Barelvi country continue to support and nurture Wahabbi/Salafi/Deobandi groups like Afghan Taliban, LeT and JeM ? Isn't that counter productive for Pakistan and its society ?

I am surprised that you live among so much Muslims but you have to ask this from us Pakistanis, Yes basically they are same, both hate Sufis, both hate Mawalid (birthday celebration of Prophet (PBUH), Urs of Awliyah, both consider Sufis Qabar Parast (grave worshipers), both consider sufis polytheist (Mushrik).. and i am not talking about Shia, they are more worst against them..

They have few differences but they dont matter much.

Can you tell me why the Pakistani state and army despite Pakistan being a majority Sufi/Barelvi country continue to support and nurture Wahabbi/Salafi/Deobandi groups like Afghan Taliban, LeT and JeM ? Isn't that counter productive for Pakistan and its society ?

maybe its our fault, we traditional Sufi Sunni (majority of Muslim in subcontinent) never liked Mullah and never voted for Mullahs, we always elect secular leaders like bhuttos and Sharifs. while Wahhabis always vote for their Mullahs, even in current parliament JUI (deobandi) party have 10 seats in National assembly while there is no representative of Sufis, Shia etc..

maybe Sufi need to change their way of thinking... they should try to grab their influence which rightfully belong to them..

 

[lastofthepatriots]

I am surprised that you live among so much Muslims but you have to ask this from us Pakistanis, Yes basically they are same, both hate Sufis, both hate Mawalid (birthday celebration of Prophet (PBUH), Urs of Awliyah, both consider Sufis Qabar Parast (grave worshipers), both consider sufis polytheist (Mushrik).. and i am not talking about Shia, they are more worst against them..

They have few differences but they dont matter much.



maybe its our fault, we traditional Sufi Sunni never liked Mullah and never voted for Mullahs, we always elect secular leaders like bhuttos and Sharifs. while Wahhabis always vote for their Mullahs, even in current parliament JUI (deobandi) party have 10 seats in National assembly while there is no representative of Sufis, Shia etc..

maybe Sufi need to change their way of thinking... they should try to grab their influence which rightfully belong to them..

As a Wahabi, what you wrote is absolute bull shit.

 

[Max]

As a Wahabi, what you wrote is absolute bull shit.

Do you want me to add reference from your books?

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Do you want me to add reference from your books?

I'm not sure about books, but I can tell you as a Pakistani Wahabi from my grandfather, what I have learned. If you are interested.

 

[LfcRed]

How can a sect determine the level of violent extremism in a group. This argument in itself is foolish. Violent extremism is an individual trait and sect carries no such influence. No people from are a single sect all violent or nonviolent. Another debate on whose sect is the best is a never ending debate. Why don't people start learning and investigating more about the proper and authentic teachings of Islam. Pitching stories from hearsay does not prove anything nor any prevalence over any other.

People accusing Ibn Taymiyyah or Mohammed AbdulWahab of false things are nothing but who inherited something from their forefathers. Their forefathers could not counter the arguments presented by these people doing wrong practices or back it up with proof. Hatred for Ibn Taymiyyah by shias is understood as he single handedly made their imams and scholars look like a fool with reason and proof which they could not handle. The last resort is to spread lies about the person which is not uncommon in our shia brothers. If salafis and wahabbis are out of mainstream Islam, people who argue and reason with proof then what is Islam. People who strictly follow the Qur'an and the sahih hadiths and the lives of the companions of the prophet or maybe someone from Sufism singing and dancing all over shrines of people, fabricating Hadiths, dressing like a weirdo or Barelvi spending all day chanting Allah Allah and reading naats and fighting to drink the water from the wudu of their imam, cutting cakes on the birthday of the prophet and having a birthday bash, or asking their imam to spit in their food for tabarruk etc etc

Muslims need to wake up and question what they are doing and look for answers themselves. We need to stop being pushovers and a propaganda tool. Believing in fabricated stories learnt from the so called masters of 'Non Violent Islam' is nothing but sheer ignorance. Even the people of Quraish said that they are imitating their forefathers in kufr. Don't be one of them. Start researching for your own and do not settle without reason, logic and authentic proof.

 

[Max]

I'm not sure about books, but I can tell you as a Pakistani Wahabi from my grandfather, what I have learned. If you are interested.

what i wrote is typical text book ideology of deobandis and wahhabis, you are most welcome to share your viwes..

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

I am surprised that you live among so much Muslims but you have to ask this from us Pakistanis.

Thanks for your explanation. I have Muslim friends but we never discuss such political and religious issues.

 

[lastofthepatriots]

what i wrote is typical text book ideology of deobandis and wahhabis, you are most welcome to share your viwes..

I can tell you that growing up, as a so called Wahabi, here the principles we followed.

*We do not worship graves. For us that is considered Shirk. At the same time, this does mean we don't respect the Sufis. We can go to a Sufi Mazar and pray for them, but we will not ask them to bless us. We only ask Allah swt for anything.

*We do not follow any religious clergy in Islam. There is no third party to ask for anything. We only ask Allah swt directly.

*We do not believe in birthdays. Allah swt has given us life. We appreciate it, and we do not want to celebrate one less year from our life.

*We do not consider anyone kaafir as long as they recite Shahada.

*We do not believe in practices of Taweez and black magic like many Pakistanis do. We believe in black magic, but we do not want to go anywhere near it.

Other than that, we are just normal Muslims. I was never told to hate Shias, Hindus, or Ahmedis. We will advise them If they bring up religion for the sake of Allah swt, but it doesn't automatically mean we hate them. It doesn't mean we disassoicate from them. We are all human, and the only way you can teach Islam is by being a friend, not an enemy. It is up to them If they want to accept the message or not. We will always try to advise when asked, because we love all human beings and want them to be on the right path.


Grew up a Wahabi in Pakistan. Always went to Sunni Masjids. As for Shia, as long as they follow Shahda, they are also Muslim. I never was taught to hate or kill anyone. I was taught to change perceptions with dialogue and love.

 

[Max]

*We do not worship graves. For us that is considered Shirk. At the same time, this does mean we don't respect the Sufis. We can go to a Sufi Mazar and pray for them, but we will not ask them to bless us. We only ask Allah swt for anything.

this is your personal belief, not all Wahhabi believe in what you do.. let alone visiting Mazar, Wahabi want to destroy all Mazar in this world, and currently they are busy destroying shrines of Prophets (as) and Companions (r.a) in Syria..

*We do not follow any religious clergy in Islam. There is no third party to ask for anything. We only ask Allah swt directly.

this is just a myth, you follow other wahabbis, you do as other wahhabis do, you pray as other wahhabis do, you dont believe in Mawlid as Wahhabis dont do..

We do not believe in birthdays. Allah swt has given us life. We appreciate it, and we do not want to celebrate one less year from our life.

Fine, do you consider it Biddah?

*We do not consider anyone kaafir as long as they recite Shahada.

We? or only you and your like minded? books says otherwise..

*We do not believe in practices of Taweez and black magic like many Pakistanis do. We believe in black magic, but we do not want to go anywhere near it.

No literate and god fearing Muslim practice Black magic, neither Sufi asked us to practice black magic, (Taweez) Rouhani Ilaaj is different from black magic, for example..

Allah Most High says in the Qur’an:

“…We send down in Qur’an that which is a healing and a mercy to the believers…”

[Sura Banu Isra’il, verse 82]

Qadi Shawkani writes,“If the Qur’an’s du’a’s are recited and blown on the sick, they will be cured.When the non-believers recite the Qur’an, their blasphemic disease will be cured”

[Tafsir Fath al-Qadir, under Sura Bani Isra’il, verse 82]

 

[lastofthepatriots]

this is your personal belief, not all Wahhabi believe in what you do.. let alone visiting Mazar, Wahabi want to destroy all Mazar in this world, and currently they are busy destroying shrines of Prophets (as) and Companions (r.a) in Syria..



this is just a myth, you follow other wahabbis, you do as other wahhabis do, you pray as other wahhabis do, you dont believe in Mawlid as Wahhabis dont do..



Fine, do you consider it Biddah?



We? or only you and your like minded? books says otherwise..



No Muslim believe in Black magic, neither Sufi asked us to believe in black magic, (Taweez) Rouhani Ilaaj is different from black magic, for example..

Allah Most High says in the Qur’an:

“…We send down in Qur’an that which is a healing and a mercy to the believers…”

[Sura Banu Isra’il, verse 82]

Qadi Shawkani writes,“If the Qur’an’s du’a’s are recited and blown on the sick, they will be cured.When the non-believers recite the Qur’an, their blasphemic disease will be cured”

[Tafsir Fath al-Qadir, under Sura Bani Isra’il, verse 82]

Prophet Muhammad mentioned black magic and you are saying Muslims don't believe it. Dude, I'm not here to argue with you. I get the intention that you just want to bash Wahabis. Fine. Do so. If it gives you some peace in your heart continue on. I refuse to have any discussion with you regarding this any further. You've already proved that you are not well-read.