Naval Utility Helicopter (NUH) Procurement Moved Under Buy and Make (Indian) Category

[Agent_47]

MoD on October 8, 2014 released a RFI for procuring more than 100 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) under Buy and Make (Indian) category of the Defense Procurement Policy.

The NUHs will replace the ageing Chetak helicopters in service with the IN and be used for

1. Search and Rescue.
2. Medical Evacuation (MEDEVAC).
3. Communication Duties.
4. Anti-Piracy and Anti-terrorism.
5. Humanitarian Assistance and Disaster Relief (HADR).
6. Limited Maritime Reconnaissance and Targeting.

The NUH would be procured along with Full Mission Simulators and other associated support equipment.

It may be recalled that on August 7, 2012 MoD had invited tenders 56 Naval Utility Helicopters to replace its fleet of ageing Chetak helicopters.

The RFP was issued to several major helicopter, firms including AgustaWestland, Bell Helicopter, Eurocopter and Russian Helicopters.

Two companies responded to the RFP - Eurocopter AS565 MB Naval Panther, a military variant of the popular Dauphin, and the AgustaWestland AW139.

The earlier procurement has now been halted, with the MoD opting for a fresh round of tendering under the category of 'Buy & Make (Indian)' as stipulated at Para 4(c) and 25 (a) of Chapter I of DPP-2013.

The Buy and Make (India) category involves initial off the shelf purchase from an Indian vendor (including an Indian company forming joint venture/ establishing production arrangement with OEM), followed by licensed production/ indigenous manufacture in the country.

Items supplied off the shelf under the category may not have any indigenous components, but locally manufactured systems are required to have minimum 30% indigenous content on cost basis to begin with, and eventually 50% indigenous content. (Indigenous content in the total of (i) Basic Cost of Equipment; (ii) Cost of Manufacturers’ Recommended List of Spares; and (iii) Cost of Special Maintenance Tools and Special Test Equipment must be at least 50% of the total contract value. (Reference parts 1(a), 1(c) and 1(d) of “Commercial Offer”, Appendix G to Schedule I of DPP 2013)

Qualitative Requirements

The NUH is required to be twin-engined with wheeled landing gear and folding rotor blades. It should be capable of operating from ship and ashore and be able to carry weapons in support of its maritime surveillance and targeting capability.

Earlier, HAL expressed its inability to bid against the requirement citing challenges in modifying its Dhruv to feature folding rotor blades.

Thum! Kaun Aata Hai?: Naval Utility Helicopter (NUH) Procurement Moved Under Buy and Make (Indian) Category

 

[special]

MoD on October 8, 2014 released a RFI for procuring more than 100 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) under Buy and Make (Indian) category of the Defense Procurement Policy.

The NUHs will replace the ageing Chetak helicopters in service with the IN and be used for

1. Search and Rescue.
2. Medical Evacuation (MEDEVAC).
3. Communication Duties.
4. Anti-Piracy and Anti-terrorism.
5. Humanitarian Assistance and Disaster Relief (HADR).
6. Limited Maritime Reconnaissance and Targeting.

The NUH would be procured along with Full Mission Simulators and other associated support equipment.

It may be recalled that on August 7, 2012 MoD had invited tenders 56 Naval Utility Helicopters to replace its fleet of ageing Chetak helicopters.

The RFP was issued to several major helicopter, firms including AgustaWestland, Bell Helicopter, Eurocopter and Russian Helicopters.

Two companies responded to the RFP - Eurocopter AS565 MB Naval Panther, a military variant of the popular Dauphin, and the AgustaWestland AW139.

The earlier procurement has now been halted, with the MoD opting for a fresh round of tendering under the category of 'Buy & Make (Indian)' as stipulated at Para 4(c) and 25 (a) of Chapter I of DPP-2013.

The Buy and Make (India) category involves initial off the shelf purchase from an Indian vendor (including an Indian company forming joint venture/ establishing production arrangement with OEM), followed by licensed production/ indigenous manufacture in the country.

Items supplied off the shelf under the category may not have any indigenous components, but locally manufactured systems are required to have minimum 30% indigenous content on cost basis to begin with, and eventually 50% indigenous content. (Indigenous content in the total of (i) Basic Cost of Equipment; (ii) Cost of Manufacturers’ Recommended List of Spares; and (iii) Cost of Special Maintenance Tools and Special Test Equipment must be at least 50% of the total contract value. (Reference parts 1(a), 1(c) and 1(d) of “Commercial Offer”, Appendix G to Schedule I of DPP 2013)

Qualitative Requirements

The NUH is required to be twin-engined with wheeled landing gear and folding rotor blades. It should be capable of operating from ship and ashore and be able to carry weapons in support of its maritime surveillance and targeting capability.

Earlier, HAL expressed its inability to bid against the requirement citing challenges in modifying its Dhruv to feature folding rotor blades.

Thum! Kaun Aata Hai?: Naval Utility Helicopter (NUH) Procurement Moved Under Buy and Make (Indian) Category

Eurocopter AS565 MB & AgustaWestland AW139. are medium lift choppers...

 

[Agent_47]

Earlier RFI was for 56 Utility Helicopters but it has changed to 100.

Items supplied off the shelf under the category may not have any indigenous components, but locally manufactured systems are required to have minimum 30% indigenous content on cost basis to begin with, and eventually 50% indigenous content. (Indigenous content in the total of (i) Basic Cost of Equipment; (ii) Cost of Manufacturers’ Recommended List of Spares; and (iii) Cost of Special Maintenance Tools and Special Test Equipment must be at least 50% of the total contract value. (Reference parts 1(a), 1(c) and 1(d) of “Commercial Offer”, Appendix G to Schedule I of DPP 2013)

These are very good terms
Have we done the same with mi17 ?
We should do something similar and bring Sea hawks home.

Its true, here is the tender - http://tenders.gov.in/viewtenddoc.asp?tid=del691907&wno=1&td=TD

 

[Abingdonboy]

Have we done the same with mi17 ?

That's a done deal, deliveries have been on for the past few years- too late now.

MoD on October 8, 2014 released a RFI for procuring more than 100 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) under Buy and Make (Indian) category of the Defense Procurement Policy.

The NUHs will replace the ageing Chetak helicopters in service with the IN and be used for

1. Search and Rescue.
2. Medical Evacuation (MEDEVAC).
3. Communication Duties.
4. Anti-Piracy and Anti-terrorism.
5. Humanitarian Assistance and Disaster Relief (HADR).
6. Limited Maritime Reconnaissance and Targeting.

The NUH would be procured along with Full Mission Simulators and other associated support equipment.

It may be recalled that on August 7, 2012 MoD had invited tenders 56 Naval Utility Helicopters to replace its fleet of ageing Chetak helicopters.

The RFP was issued to several major helicopter, firms including AgustaWestland, Bell Helicopter, Eurocopter and Russian Helicopters.

Two companies responded to the RFP - Eurocopter AS565 MB Naval Panther, a military variant of the popular Dauphin, and the AgustaWestland AW139.

The earlier procurement has now been halted, with the MoD opting for a fresh round of tendering under the category of 'Buy & Make (Indian)' as stipulated at Para 4(c) and 25 (a) of Chapter I of DPP-2013.

The Buy and Make (India) category involves initial off the shelf purchase from an Indian vendor (including an Indian company forming joint venture/ establishing production arrangement with OEM), followed by licensed production/ indigenous manufacture in the country.

Items supplied off the shelf under the category may not have any indigenous components, but locally manufactured systems are required to have minimum 30% indigenous content on cost basis to begin with, and eventually 50% indigenous content. (Indigenous content in the total of (i) Basic Cost of Equipment; (ii) Cost of Manufacturers’ Recommended List of Spares; and (iii) Cost of Special Maintenance Tools and Special Test Equipment must be at least 50% of the total contract value. (Reference parts 1(a), 1(c) and 1(d) of “Commercial Offer”, Appendix G to Schedule I of DPP 2013)

Qualitative Requirements

The NUH is required to be twin-engined with wheeled landing gear and folding rotor blades. It should be capable of operating from ship and ashore and be able to carry weapons in support of its maritime surveillance and targeting capability.

Earlier, HAL expressed its inability to bid against the requirement citing challenges in modifying its Dhruv to feature folding rotor blades.

Thum! Kaun Aata Hai?: Naval Utility Helicopter (NUH) Procurement Moved Under Buy and Make (Indian) Category

Hmmm, interesting.
Firstly, the number of N-LUHs has jumped to 100 from 56 (which I always thought was too low considering the IN's surface fleet's rapid expansion).

Secondly the GoI has recently said the 197 RSH/LUH deal for the IAF and IA will go the same way (Buy and Make India) so could there be two different Indian private firms producing two different LUH models simultaneously? Would be great to see that...



Certainly short term (critical) pain for long term pain but I hope, somehow, things in the MoD (for once) move expediatnely on all these new "Buy and Make Indian" deals so that pain is lessened and these birds end up in Indian hands sooner rather than later. No doubt this wave of new RFIs fits in with the larger new GoI policy of "Make in India" but if done right these steps can be truly great for the Indian Mil and nation as a whole.



The frustrating thing is this "Buy and Make India" clause has been in the DPP for quite a few years now but RARELY used. Why wasn't it employed initially in this N-LUH bid??


It seems deal after deal is being put on the right track things are boding well, hopefully a similar approach is taken to the M777 deal. Similarly I hope the MoD/GoI is able to put the SPG, towed arty, N-MRH, F-ICV and F-INSAS deals/projects firmly back on course.

Intriguing an potentially golden days ahead for the Indian Mil and industry- IF the GoI is truly working seeking the best for the nation and not their own political interests (the two should go hand in hand mind you).

 

[SanjeevaniButi]

And still there are people who still say there is no difference between UPA and NDA

 

[The_Sidewinder]

That's a done deal, deliveries have been on for the past few years- too late now.




Hmmm, interesting.
Firstly, the number of N-LUHs has jumped to 100 from 56 (which I always thought was too low considering the IN's surface fleet's rapid expansion).

Secondly the GoI has recently said the 197 RSH/LUH deal for the IAF and IA will go the same way (Buy and Make India) so could there be two different Indian private firms producing two different LUH models simultaneously? Would be great to see that...



Certainly short term (critical) pain for long term pain but I hope, somehow, things in the MoD (for once) move expediatnely on all these new "Buy and Make Indian" deals so that pain is lessened and these birds end up in Indian hands sooner rather than later. No doubt this wave of new RFIs fits in with the larger new GoI policy of "Make in India" but if done right these steps can be truly great for the Indian Mil and nation as a whole.



The frustrating thing is this "Buy and Make India" clause has been in the DPP for quite a few years now but RARELY used. Why wasn't it employed initially in this N-LUH bid??


It seems deal after deal is being put on the right track things are boding well, hopefully a similar approach is taken to the M777 deal. Similarly I hope the MoD/GoI is able to put the SPG, towed arty, N-MRH, F-ICV and F-INSAS deals/projects firmly back on course.

Intriguing an potentially golden days ahead for the Indian Mil and industry- IF the GoI is truly working seeking the best for the nation and not their own political interests (the two should go hand in hand mind you).

I hope various vendors not only makes in India fullfilling the needs of three services but also exports from Indian plants under jv. If it happens, we will see further improvement of our economy.

 

[SanjeevaniButi]

I hope various vendors not only makes in India fullfilling the needs of three services but also exports from Indian plants under jv. If it happens, we will see further improvement of our economy.

Once they start production in India, export is inevitable due to lower production cost and availability of skilled labour.

Ache din aane wale hai

 

[The_Sidewinder]

Once they start production in India, export is inevitable due to lower production cost and availability of skilled labour.

Ache din aane wale hai

Hope so. Privatisation always leads to better accountability & professionalism. Increasing FDI limit to 49% in defence has oppened doors for new opportunities. I am hoping to see a transformed India within a dacade.

 

[sancho]

Certainly short term (critical) pain for long term pain but I hope

How is that a short term problem? RFI => RFP => selecting helicopters for the evaluation => evaluation => shortlisting => decision. Just as in all these scrapped tenders, we are talking about years of delays and if you add the tenders, it's a major pain in the a... for our forces, because the modernisation attempts will be delayed for years!

No doubt this wave of new RFIs fits in with the larger new GoI policy of "Make in India"

No, because make in India was the whole idea from the start so that hasn't change, since it's still a licence production. The only difference is, that it is now offered only to privat companies and the JVs with the OEM. But the problem is, as we can see for a long time in the Avro replacement, when the privat industry shows no interest in the competition! Former DM Antony started the make in India policy, invited the private industry, just as the NDA does it now for the Avro replacement too and the new DM faces the same problems too and had to delay the tender once more, because it's difficutl to find vendors and Indian JV partners that are interested. So it's silly to force any even running tender into such a policy, without knowing if the Indian industry even wants to participate. That should be considered before the tender will be opened, to not be forced to delay or even scrap things again.

LUH - reissued => delayed
N-LUH - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
NMHR - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
P75 - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
Lightweight howitzer - soon to be reissued?
MMRCA - soon to be reissued?

The result of 5 months of the new MoD, so much for fast tracking modernisation of the forces!

 

[Bang Galore]

How is that a short term problem? RFI => RFP => selecting helicopters for the evaluation => evaluation => shortlisting => decision. Just as in all these scrapped tenders, we are talking about years of delays and if you add the tenders, it's a major pain in the a... for our forces, because the modernisation attempts will be delayed for years!



No, because make in India was the whole idea from the start so that hasn't change, since it's still a licence production. The only difference is, that it is now offered only to privat companies and the JVs with the OEM. But the problem is, as we can see for a long time in the Avro replacement, when the privat industry shows no interest in the competition! Former DM Antony started the make in India policy, invited the private industry, just as the NDA does it now for the Avro replacement too and the new DM faces the same problems too and had to delay the tender once more, because it's difficutl to find vendors and Indian JV partners that are interested. So it's silly to force any even running tender into such a policy, without knowing if the Indian industry even wants to participate. That should be considered before the tender will be opened, to not be forced to delay or even scrap things again.

LUH - reissued => delayed
N-LUH - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
NMHR - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
P75 - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
Lightweight howitzer - soon to be reissued?
MMRCA - soon to be reissued?

The result of 5 months of the new MoD, so much for fast tracking modernisation of the forces!

They key is to allow foreign companies to manufacture in India with full ownership. 51% - 100%. I was watching a show on NDTV where Deepak Parekh was saying that there is absolutely no difference between 26% & 49% (in terms of voting rights etc) and no foreign company would be interested. He further said that according to government's own figures, the total FDI that has come in defence in the last 12 years was $4 million. How absurd is that. He made the point that the government was actually initially interested in raising it to 74% but domestic companies lobbied successfully to keep at 49%. I agree with buy "made in India" but this won't happen overnight. We need, when we have a substantial order, to get the companies to invest & build in India. Why not offer 74% instead of buying 100% foreign owned, made in another country?

 

[sancho]

that there is absolutely no difference between 26% & 49% (in terms of voting rights etc)

Of course there isn't, that's the point why it was limited to 49%, to keep the Indian side in control! It is silly to provide foreign companies in control of JVs and follow their own interests (cheap production and developments of arms, which not necessarily are meant for the Indian forces) and to believe that this JV will get India the most in return. The minute we give away the control, our interests and requirements will have less importance. That's maybe less problematic in unimportant fields, but not in the defence sector, which is why any country tries to keep at least some control over the defense industry (look at shares of Airbus, Thales, DCNS, BAE..., hold by German, French or Spanish, or British governments).

I agree with buy "made in India" but this won't happen overnight.

The problem is, that made in India, doesn't meand developed in India and only that would make it useful for us to provide higher stakes. It serves us nothing, if Sikrosky getss 74 or even 100% control of a JV with an Tata and produces more parts of the cabin and the airframe of the S92 helicopter. That won't change the fact that our forces don't operate it, that won't change the fact that we can't develop a similar helicopter including all the critical techs and systems, only by learing how to build the airframe, nor does it change the fact that Sikorsky then will aim on the benefit of offering the S92 at lower costs to the bigger global market, rather than to Indian forces at much lower scale. So we have to look at the best to improve our industry and not only to attract foreign companies to oursource screwdriver parts of the production to India. If they offer us more critical techs, they get more control over the JV, that policy was even there in the past, the fact that they don't use it just shows that they have their own interest in mind. That's why the former DM changed the defence policy towards JV's and team ups, to force froeign vendors to JV's if they want a piece of the Indian defence market and the new MoD is following the same policy, but sadly in a more radical way to please the privat industry. So we will see more FDI coming in no matter what, because the vendors have no choice anymore, however the aim must be to get what is useful for our forces and to improve our industry. As long as that is not given, providing the foreign vendors with limited control is the logical think to do.

 

[SanjeevaniButi]

How is that a short term problem? RFI => RFP => selecting helicopters for the evaluation => evaluation => shortlisting => decision. Just as in all these scrapped tenders, we are talking about years of delays and if you add the tenders, it's a major pain in the a... for our forces, because the modernisation attempts will be delayed for years!

How come all these delays were never an issue during UPA time or about these tenders going to foreign firms ? Now when its time to correct the mistakes of the UPA govt. you suddenly are more worried about "delays" rather than "Make India" and streamlining of purchases.

"Years of delay" is PURE SPECULATION on your part based on the shameful history of UPA govt. There is nothing to indicate the NDA govt. is anywhere as slow or as unconcerned as the UPA. If anything, all indications are to the opposite.

No, because make in India was the whole idea from the start so that hasn't change, since it's still a licence production. The only difference is, that it is now offered only to privat companies and the JVs with the OEM. But the problem is, as we can see for a long time in the Avro replacement, when the privat industry shows no interest in the competition! Former DM Antony started the make in India policy, invited the private industry, just as the NDA does it now for the Avro replacement too and the new DM faces the same problems too and had to delay the tender once more, because it's difficutl to find vendors and Indian JV partners that are interested. So it's silly to force any even running tender into such a policy, without knowing if the Indian industry even wants to participate. That should be considered before the tender will be opened, to not be forced to delay or even scrap things again.

LUH - reissued => delayed
N-LUH - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
NMHR - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
P75 - (reportedly) reissued => delayed
Lightweight howitzer - soon to be reissued?
MMRCA - soon to be reissued?

The result of 5 months of the new MoD, so much for fast tracking modernisation of the forces!

The difference is in just having an empty Idea and actually IMPLEMENTING it. That is what the NDA is doing, Implementing the "make in India" BECAUSE the same was NOT implemented during UPA time.

The NDA has modified FDI to 49% so it is too early to comment if the JV will work or not. Indian Industry concerns will now come up and will be addressed by the govt. IF they are not addressed then you would have a valid reason to complain, not otherwise.

The ONLY way to find out if the Indian industry is interested in to Acutally release the tender and measure the response. Not Theoretical speculation.

This is what the NDA has done in 4 months, No bad if I may say so.

 

[SanjeevaniButi]

They key is to allow foreign companies to manufacture in India with full ownership. 51% - 100%. I was watching a show on NDTV where Deepak Parekh was saying that there is absolutely no difference between 26% & 49% (in terms of voting rights etc) and no foreign company would be interested. He further said that according to government's own figures, the total FDI that has come in defence in the last 12 years was $4 million. How absurd is that. He made the point that the government was actually initially interested in raising it to 74% but domestic companies lobbied successfully to keep at 49%. I agree with buy "made in India" but this won't happen overnight. We need, when we have a substantial order, to get the companies to invest & build in India. Why not offer 74% instead of buying 100% foreign owned, made in another country?

Forget anout FDI, Just a single Company Boeing is required to invest 600 million $ just for P-8I offset.

What has the UPA govt. done about it ? This is the CAG report.

Indian Audit Body Objects To Defense Offset Transactions | Aviation International News

India’s audit body for government projects, the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG), has censured the Ministry of Defense for violations in the offset clause of five projects for which waivers were given. As a result, the CAG says, more than $376 million in foreign direct investment for the Indian aerospace industry has been lost. The projects were all started before India introduced its latest offset policy earlier this year.

CAG named Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Rosoboronexport and MiG in its report, which noted the lack of any value addition by the nominated Indian service provider. The MoD did not respond to many of its queries, said the CAG.

Offsets offered by Boeing for India’s purchase of C-17 airlifters that did not meet the CAG’s approval include the establishment of a transonic wind tunnel test facility for the Defense Research and Development Organisation (DRDO); airworthiness seminars; transfer of metallurgy and hydraulic laboratory facilities; composite manufacturing assembly/tooling; mobile broadband; and aerostructures tools and processes. CAG described all these as “direct imports.” Other violations identified by the CAG included Lockheed Martin’s training simulator for C-130J aircrews; Rosoboronexport’s two mission training simulators for the medium lift helicopters buy; and MiG’s simulator center for the upgrade of MiG-29s.

“We are studying the fine print [of the CAG report]. It points out that certain proposals did not meet offsets…we returned them to Boeing…the P-8I offset liability is $600 million spread across seven years. Nothing is cleared yet,” said Indian Navy Chief Admiral DK Joshi recently. He conceded: “Offsets are a fairly complex process…we are learning each day.” The first P-8I is due for delivery next June.

“While we have the basics of the policy right, execution is vital. This includes selection of the right people, processes and implementation,” said Ajay Batra, managing partner of Delhi-based World Intellectual Property Optimization Bank.

 

[Bang Galore]

Of course there isn't, that's the point why it was limited to 49%, to keep the Indian side in control! It is silly to provide foreign companies in control of JVs and follow their own interests (cheap production and developments of arms, which not necessarily are meant for the Indian forces) and to believe that this JV will get India the most in return. The minute we give away the control, our interests and requirements will have less importance. That's maybe less problematic in unimportant fields, but not in the defence sector, which is why any country tries to keep at least some control over the defense industry (look at shares of Airbus, Thales, DCNS, BAE..., hold by German, French or Spanish, or British governments).

I disagree, this is odd logic. Why should we care about management control if a company wishes to onvest in India to build & maybe export products that are not for our use. What logic would there be for such companies to invest. Did you read, we got $4 million in 12 years....... The argument about other countries doing the same is silly, they don't keep buying 100% foreign owned, foreign manufactured as we do.... If they build in India, we will learn. Not like they will bring foreign workers & the factories are in India. I simply can't understand your argument.

The problem is, that made in India, doesn't meand developed in India and only that would make it useful for us to provide higher stakes. It serves us nothing, if Sikrosky getss 74 or even 100% control of a JV with an Tata and produces more parts of the cabin and the airframe of the S92 helicopter.

It serves us nothing? you mean factories & investments in India are nothing? as are all those workers & local companies who will have orders subcontracted.? It's precisely this thinking that has caused us to remain in the condition we are in.

So we will see more FDI coming in no matter what, because the vendors have no choice anymore, however the aim must be to get what is useful for our forces and to improve our industry. As long as that is not given, providing the foreign vendors with limited control is the logical think to do.

Those are only for orders already ordered by India & for which there are offset conditions. Otherwise vendors have a zillion choices. We must allow for investment to happen with companies hoping that the investment in India may give them a better shot at an Indian contract in the future. Once they have put their money in, it is they who will be hungry to get the orders. Otherwise we will have the Rafale type offset where we pay for everything including the kitchen sink & the vendor laughs his way to the bank.

 

[sancho]

How come all these delays were never an issue during UPA time or about these tenders going to foreign firms ? Now when its time to correct the mistakes of the UPA govt. you suddenly are more worried about "delays" rather than "Make India" and streamlining of purchases.

You obviously have no idea of what you are talking, so please inform yourself first! It's about selecting a foreign helicopter and produce it under licence in India, be it in the initial tender that was started in 2012, or in the new one. As mentioned, the only difference is, which Indian company will produce them in India, which now depends on the JV of the winning helicopter.
So scrapping tenders that actually could be done now and re-issuing these them only to provide private industry more advantages, while our forces are suffering with old helicopters is not a good thing when the forces expected faster modernisations and not further delays!

The rest of your post is just based on silly party politics, which I am neither a part of nor follow. I am looking at the promises the new government gave our forces to speed up modernisations and at the results and these scrapping of running tenders is logically resulting the opposite. I don't care if it's less delay than UPA or not, as long it is still delay and not fast tracking!!!
Implementing that policy is good, but for new tenders not for tenders that already are running or in some cases just awaited final selection of the MoD. Scrapping them at this stage is a huge mistake which undeniably hurts the operational capability of the forces. So please start looking beyond party politcs and that crap and look at what's important for our forces and the security of the country unless you want to see more of this:

3 officers killed as Army helicopter crashes in UP | The Indian Express[/quote]