More Anti Pakistan Army propoganda

[AHMED85]

Nawaz Sharif and Army saga is that Army / ( Mussaraf gang of four ) actively tried to decieve him while he was Prime Minister.
Specificaly while Nawaz Sharif was engaged in peace talks , Army was engaged in Kargil operation and didnt tell Nawaz. Its not the work of Foreign Agencies, its Army itself.

Tell me who is running army

A Gen or A soldier ?

Definitely Gen

So with intellectual mind if he has a dispute with Musharraf, let suppose if Musharraf deceived him, kindly indicate me what is the fault of a common soldier standing at road.

I personally knew by the sources of ISI and other info that some time army personals also involving in several kind of criminal activities, i am not claiming that army is 100% pure, no way. But it does not mean that we are treating every one with same mind.



بھائی پرائیم منسٹر پوری قوم کا ہوتا ہے قوم مے آرمی شامل ہے ہاں اگر کوئی بیڈ فیکٹر ہو تو دلیل کے ساتھ حل ہو جاتا ہے

اور یہ بات آج مے کہ کے جا رھا ہوں آئی ایس آئی کبھی بھی کسی غلط انسان حتکہ سرونگ جنرل کو بھی اٹھا کے پھینک دیتی ہے تو یہ بات کہ دینا کے پوری آرمی غلط ہے یہ ٹھیک نہیں ۔ یہ تو بچوں والی بات ہوئی نا۔

اس طرح اچھے لوگوں کا دل ٹوٹ جاتا ہے


خیر بڑی عجیب بات ہے کے انسان غلطی خود کرے اور الزام آرمی کو دے دو۔
اور موجودہ حالات کا ذمہ دار کم اذ کم آرمی نہیں یہی سچ ہے


آپ اپنے دل سے جواب مانگ لو

 

[baapu]

Tell me who is running army

A Gen or A soldier ?

Definitely Gen

So with intellectual mind if he has a dispute with Musharraf, let suppose if Musharraf deceived him, kindly indicate me what is the fault of a common soldier standing at road.
I personally knew by the sources of ISI and other info that some time army personals also involving in several kind of criminal activities, i am not claiming that army is 100% pure, no way. But it does not mean that we are treating every one with same mind.

I cannot comment on the ordinary soldier. or even supporters of military who justify Army's every action except that they cause harm in their innocence by providing support who cause harm.
In the case of Musharaf / Kargil / Nawaz it was the height of arrogance on Army's part. I don't know if the same level of arrogance is still found at the top level command. I think its a case of absolute power corrupts absolutely where the system of checks and balances is broken.

If your sources of criminal activity( in army personnal ) are ISI, that would mean you're talking about colonels and higher. you dont mention what action has been taken against such element?If any ? They are human , so its to be expected someone somewhere would take advantage of their posting and influence.

 

[AHMED85]

I cannot comment on the ordinary soldier. or even supporters of military who justify Army's every action except that they cause harm in their innocence by providing support who cause harm.
In the case of Musharaf / Kargil / Nawaz it was the height of arrogance on Army's part. I don't know if the same level of arrogance is still found at the top level command. I think its a case of absolute power corrupts absolutely where the system of checks and balances is broken.

If your sources of criminal activity( in army personnal ) are ISI, that would mean you're talking about colonels and higher. you dont mention what action has been taken against such element?If any ? They are human , so its to be expected someone somewhere would take advantage of their posting and influence.

So you think Pakistan did wrong, in battle ground every thing is possible, enemies tries to upset other forces and persuading to do violation. So no one have proof that Pakistan trigger this war first. When the fight was start's the duty of every Gen is to save his terrain.
So what if Pakistani paramilitary forces kick Indians.

Arrogance claimed with personal initiatives in public etc, if arrogance is for country then its good that you are defending your country with pride.

Actually there was no dispute between Army & Nawaz but some bad factors did it.

Army attacked on Indians, not on Pakistani civilians. What Kalboshan Yadaive admitted in his statement, you this is sufficient that Indian army is not innocent, they always set example's on behalf you can say they had tried to broken the patience.


بارڑر پے کھڑا فوجی شریف دماغ نہیں رکھتا آئے روذ بارڈر پے شیلنگ چلتی ہے ہزاروں سویلین مارے گئے اگر آپ سمجھتے ہو انڈین آرمی شریف ہیں تو کشمیر کو دیکھ لو۔

انڈین فلم ضرور دیکھو مگر انٹرٹینمنٹ تک۔

 

[baapu]

So no one have proof that Pakistan trigger this war first.
Arrogance claimed with personal initiatives in public etc, if arrogance is for country then its good that you are defending

You may repeat in Pakistan that no we didnt do it first and people might believe you , but internationally o one believes you and Pakistan has lots of credibility around the world. Probably any and all credibility.
Musharraf was arrogant in that he believed he didnt report to the prime minister or was responsible for informing the prime minister truthfully. Im not sure how that is defending the country.

 

[AHMED85]

You may repeat in Pakistan that no we didnt do it first and people might believe you , but internationally o one believes you and Pakistan has lots of credibility around the world. Probably any and all credibility.
Musharraf was arrogant in that he believed he didnt report to the prime minister or was responsible for informing the prime minister truthfully. Im not sure how that is defending the country.

If you expecting every thing from foreign countries, then you are working on Bad policies, When CPEC was signed i was one of them who opposing this project because i want tax while utilizing Pakistani sources. Now new gov realized that the beneficiary is China.
In my secret investigation i cant say any words against this project. Second what is the credibility of world in sense of Kashmir issue & water crisis. Have they played their role, no the would not. So every country deal you as per its own interests.
Yes it might be possible that Musharraf had think or reports that Nawaz have personal good relations with Indian lobby therefore he did not info him on time.


ایک فوجی، ایک پرائم منسٹر اور انٹیلیجنس تینوں مختلف انداذ مے سوچتے ہیں

اور بعد مے نواذ کے آرڈر پے ہی فوج واپس بلائی گئی مگر اک سائن سیٹ کیا گیا کے پاکستان کی طرف مت دیکھنا۔

ہاں یہ مے نے نہیں کیا۔ پاکستانی عوام نے نہیں کیا جس کی وجہ سے اک پرائم منسٹر جیل مے ہے اسی دنیا نے یہ سب کچھ بھی دیکھا ہے

 

[baapu]

Yes it might be possible that Musharraf had think or reports that Nawaz have personal good relations with Indian lobby therefore he did not info him on time.

It was not his decision to make . You cannot Plot against your Boss. If he considered Nawaz Sharif a Security Risk , The proper procedure was to be followed.
There has been no indication from Musharraf that was the case. all indications are he was just too arrogant and considered himself to be incharge while army chief. This is still the case with the current High command. They consider it their good will that they are letting Civilian administration to rule.

I dont think you realise, Army was badly defeated in Kargil. If America had influenced India this war would have gone on for longer and Pakistan would have lot more. This might have turned into another 1965 scenario.

 

[AHMED85]

It was not his decision to make . You cannot Plot against your Boss. If he considered Nawaz Sharif a Security Risk , The proper procedure was to be followed.
There has been no indication from Musharraf that was the case. all indications are he was just too arrogant and considered himself to be incharge while army chief. This is still the case with the current High command. They consider it their good will that they are letting Civilian administration to rule.

I dont think you realise, Army was badly defeated in Kargil. If America had influenced India this war would have gone on for longer and Pakistan would have lot more. This might have turned into another 1965 scenario.

باس آرمی 100٪ رولز پے نہیں چلتی۔


جب کبھی چلی مجھے بتانا

کچھ چیزیں پس پردہ چلتی ہیں سکیورٹی ریزن کی وجہ سے

National Security Matters

زندگی آمد، برائے بندگی
زندگی بے بندگی شرمندگی

 

[baapu]

باس آرمی 100٪ رولز پے نہیں چلتی۔
جب کبھی چلی مجھے بتانا
کچھ چیزیں پس پردہ چلتی ہیں سکیورٹی ریزن کی وجہ سے
National Security Matters
زندگی آمد، برائے بندگی
زندگی بے بندگی شرمندگی

.This sort of thing would be called Treason. So don't say its in National security. If you Think its OK for Army not to obey the rules, then .....

 

[HAIDER]

Call in general election in FATA and hand over govt to elected party and watch with eagle eye.

 

[AHMED85]

.This sort of thing would be called Treason. So don't say its in National security. If you Think its OK for Army not to obey the rules, then .....

So if you think such action are the form of treason, its mean you are allowing every criminal to activate its police in free environment.

No order is above the Sovereignty/ Dignity & Status of country.

No one is above the law & no personality is above the country either.

 

[baapu]

So if you think such action are the form of treason, its mean you are allowing every criminal to activate its police in free environment.
No order is above the Sovereignty/ Dignity & Status of country.
No one is above the law & no personality is above the country either.

You understand that Prime Minister is the Head of Government in Pakistan . Right?
Chief of Army is the head of Army , who reports to the Head of Government. If he decieves the head of government, who is the traitor? If the head of government is engaged in a foreign policy, and chief of Army is engaged in undermining him. who is the traitor?
( You implication of Nawaz Sharif being a traitor is suppositions forwarded by religious groups . Musharaf has never said it. Nor has anyone else of authority. ) If Musharaf thought he was serving a master who wasnt acting in the interest of Pakistan he should have resigned.

 

[AHMED85]

You understand that Prime Minister is the Head of Government in Pakistan . Right?
Chief of Army is the head of Army , who reports to the Head of Government. If he decieves the head of government, who is the traitor? If the head of government is engaged in a foreign policy, and chief of Army is engaged in undermining him. who is the traitor?
( You implication of Nawaz Sharif being a traitor is suppositions forwarded by religious groups . Musharaf has never said it. Nor has anyone else of authority. ) If Musharaf thought he was serving a master who wasnt acting in the interest of Pakistan he should have resigned.

If any one doing wrong, by mistake or with intention. So at the time enemy is active and killing your colleagues, so if you are the in charge of security. What you would do, running for phone booth to get orders or defending your self and your colleagues.

Man i am not defending army person but giving reply as per my own intelligence. If he would acquiring advice/ order from PM probably PM give it or not its depended on scenario & relation.

And this was a little issue but some groups extended it again and again, which is not good for country.


کچھ باتیں آف دی ریکارڈ ہوتی ہیں

رٹن رول اور ریگولیشن ہر چیز نہیں ہوتی کہیں کچھ اچھا کرنے کے لیے کبھی کبھی رولز سے ہٹ کے چلنا پڑہ جاتا ہے
آپ جاؤ اور ہر ادارے کے ہیڈ سے سوال پوچھو کے ان کا ادارہ کتنے پرسنٹ رول فالو کرتا ہے۔ بھائی کیوں دماغ کی دھی نکال رھا ہے

 

[baapu]

If any one doing wrong, by mistake or with intention. So at the time enemy is active and killing your colleagues, so if you are the in charge of security. What you would do, running for phone booth to get orders or defending your self and your colleagues.

Man i am not defending army person but giving reply as per my own intelligence. If he would acquiring advice/ order from PM probably PM give it or not its depended on scenario & relation.
And this was a little issue but some groups extended it again and again, which is not good for country.

He was sending in troops , and was decieving the PM before they were under attack.

If we dont bring up and keep in mind the mistakes of the past, we are bound to repeat them . This very incident is a the very example of it. This Kargil plan was a repeat of a past mistake made in 1965, but it was suppressed and was hence repeated.