Modi Wants Indian Railways to be Better Than Airports, Calls for Private Sector Role

[Mr.S.Singh]

My point is when susbsidised diesel is still necessary for transport vehicles. Only car owners would be targeted for that charge.

govt choose the other route, but you do have a point, but this amount would be approximately collected and there would be a deficiency in collection

Most cities don't charge octroi, in any case I would limit tolled roads to highways. All cities can be for common use.

Okay .. from mumbai to Pune, there are 4 tolls on old national highway ... each charging different tolls
atleast standardize the thing

All this only reinforces my point that giving cash is better than subsidizing. Think about it.

agreed but govt would be worrying about bogus accounts and transaction
Do we have the cash to throw away ?

 

[Bang Galore]

govt choose the other route, but you do have a point, but this amount would be approximately collected and there would be a deficiency in collection

Of course there would be a deficiency, this collection is a fixed charge not one based on consumption but alteast would go some way in reducing the subsidy bill.

 

[janon]

agreed but govt would be worrying about bogus accounts and transaction
Do we have the cash to throw away ?

Presently we are throwing away a lot more cash on subsidies. Direct cash transfer decreases the amount of money we need to throw away.

Subsidies are paid for by the govt too, you know.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Presently we are throwing away a lot more cash on subsidies. Direct cash transfer decreases the amount of money we need to spend.

what all do you propose to bring under subsidy ??
Food and fuel ?

 

[tango87]

come to this side of the country
Again around the world roads and highways are toll-less, why not eleminate road taxes if you are going to toll commuters anyways?


mismanagement, some serious whacking needed here


with the corruption levels and faith in our babus, this doesn't sound right *period*


these have nothing to do with govt, apart from monorail and allowing slums in the cities[/quote]
are you kidding me!!! so who is gonna look after the poor???governments job is to look after the society as a whole not just the rich..i suppose you have never traveled in general class of a train!

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

are you kidding me!!! so who is gonna look after the poor???governments job is to look after the society as a whole not just the rich..i suppose you have never traveled in general class of a train!

we are talking about railways station not trains, trains would be obviously subsidized

 

[janon]

what all do you propose to bring under subsidy ??
Food and fuel ?

They are already subsidized, and that is costing the nation a lot more than what they should cost. The point is to decrease food subsidy or eliminate it altogether, and instead give monthly payments to poor people and let them buy food with that money. That's what the US does with welfare payments. Presently, to give ten rupees worth of food to a person, the country spends twenty rupees (the cost of food plus the cost of maintaining the inefficient PDS.) If direct transfer is used, then giving ten rupees t that person will enable him to buy ten rupees worth of food. Better for him, better for the country.

Fuel for private vehicles should not be subsidized at all.

 

[Bang Galore]

what all do you propose to bring under subsidy ??
Food and fuel ?

Food & fuel are wasteful subsidies. There is presently a scheme in Karnataka allowing for rice at Rs.1/kg. That rice is either resold commercially or siphoned off by eateries. essentially the state is subsidising private eateries.

Kerosene ends up being used for adulteration.

Best way to deal with it is by direct cash transfers. Then both kerosene & rice would be sold only at market prices & there would be no interest/profit in diversion.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

They are already subsidized, and that is costing the nation a lot more than what they should cost. The point is to decrease food subsidy or eliminate it altogether, and instead give monthly payments to poor people and let them buy food with that money. That's what the US does with welfare payments. Presently, to give ten rupees worth of food to a person, the country spends twenty rupees (the cost of food plus the cost of maintaining the inefficient PDS.) If direct transfer is used, then giving ten rupees t that person will enable him to buy ten rupees worth of food. Better for him, better for the country.

Fuel for private vehicles should not be subsidized at all.

@Bang Galore
the problem is rapid inflation, govt cannot keep a count on it, when its subsidized it is available at a flat rate through the year, this helps the poor plan better. This cover the most poor not all so i don't think we should mind this scheme

i was referring to LPG & kerosine

 

[janon]

@Bang Galore
the problem is rapid inflation, govt cannot keep a count on it, when its subsidized it is available at a flat rate through the year, this helps the poor plan better. This cover the most poor not all so i don't think we should mind this scheme

i was referring to LPG & kerosine

If there is inflation, the amount of welfare payment can also be increased. That would still be a better option than subsidizing the food, which costs more, and also contributes to inflation.

i was referring to LPG & kerosine

Those shouldn't be subsidized either. Instead, pay money to each household and let them buy what they want with it - food, kerosene or whatever. The govt does not need to bother what they buy with the money. Cash will give people power to purchase whatever they want, there is no need to go into individual items.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

If there is inflation, the amount of welfare payment can also be increased. That would still be a better option than subsidizing the food, which costs more, and also contributes to inflation.

When you put in money for food, you are capping their consumption, sounds a bit cruel
money would be debited once a year, price swings are monthly, would be tough , onion prices in jan -feb could be Rs.20/kg, june would be Rs.80/kg

 

[greatone]

They are already subsidized, and that is costing the nation a lot more than what they should cost. The point is to decrease food subsidy or eliminate it altogether, and instead give monthly payments to poor people and let them buy food with that money. That's what the US does with welfare payments. Presently, to give ten rupees worth of food to a person, the country spends twenty rupees (the cost of food plus the cost of maintaining the inefficient PDS.) If direct transfer is used, then giving ten rupees t that person will enable him to buy ten rupees worth of food. Better for him, better for the country.

Fuel for private vehicles should not be subsidized at all.

The method of cash handouts was tried before and it did not work.
Poor people simply buy alcohol and other drugs, party for a few days/weeks and go back to being poor again.
Many slum dwellers put the free houses they are given by the govt. up for rent and go back to living in slums because they are used to the slums.
To them, living in conditions that would appall us is pretty normal

You can't use direct transfer of cash to eliminate poverty.If it were that easy, we would have done it already.
We need to change the society and that needs sustained efforts over time.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Those shouldn't be subsidized either. Instead, pay money to each household and let them buy what they want with it - food, kerosene or whatever. The govt does not need to bother what they buy with the money. Cash will give people power to purchase whatever they want, there is no need to go into individual items.

Cash subsidy here makes sense, aadhar works on these lines

 

[janon]

When you put in money for food, you are capping their consumption, sounds a bit cruel
money would be debited once a year, price swings are monthly, would be tough , onion prices in jan -feb could be Rs.20/kg, june would be Rs.80/kg

Money can be debited once a month. This is the age of computers. Paying people enough money for food needs will end up being cheaper than subsidizing the food. After all, what does subsidizing mean? The govt is paying the producers and distributors, who are free to jack up prices. On the other hand, if govt pays to the consumers, then the producers and distributors will try to keep prices down, to reap maximum profit.

Whether you pay people money, or subsidize their food, you end up paying. In the former case, you only pay for the item. In the latter, you pay for the item, plus the overhead costs.

The method of cash handouts was tried before and it did not work.
Poor people simply buy alcohol and other drugs, party for a few days/weeks and go back to being poor again.
Many slum dwellers put the free houses they are given by the govt. up for rent and go back to living in slums because they are used to the slums.
To them, living in conditions that would appall us is pretty normal

You can't use direct transfer of cash to eliminate poverty.If it were that easy, we would have done it already.
We need to change the society and that needs sustained efforts over time.

That's precisely why things should not be subsidized. When housing was paud for by the govt, they gave that away to other people and lived in slums. When foodgrains are subsidized, they end up being sold to bakeries and eateries for a higher price. It is when govt subsidizes something, that that thing gets misused and sold for higher prices on the black market. If govt paid people money and left them free to do what they want with it, then they cannot sell that money for a higher amount of money. If they buy alcohol with that, it's their fault, isn't it? They deserve to go hungry in that case.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Money can be debited once a month. This is the age of computers. Paying people enough money for food needs will end up being cheaper than subsidizing the food. After all, what does subsidizing mean? The govt is paying the producers and distributors, who are free to jack up prices. On the other hand, if govt pays to the consumers, then the producers and distributors will try to keep prices down, to reap maximum profit.

currently, subsidized products are available on govt shops, hence they are not in regular circulation
the inflation is due to demand and supply of regular market supply
Govt of India are going to transfer food that it cannot hold in its warehouses, instead to letting it rot they will sell it, it is actually profitable lol