MiG-29SMT Fulcrum upgrade, what will be performance improvements ??

[trident2010]

The Mig-29, Fulcrum NATO-codename, is a single-seat, highly maneuverable fighter aircraft designed to engage airborne targets such as aircraft, UAVs and cruise missiles. It features a limited air-to-surface/ ground strike capability. The Mig-29 is the Soviet counterpart to US F-15, F-16 and F/A-18 aircraft. More than 1,300 Mig-29s have been produced for 27 countries worldwide.

The Mig-29 aircraft features an integrated fire control system comprising the aircraft radar, and Infrared Search and Track (IRST) device, and a helmet-mounted sight. It can accommodate medium range R-27 and short range R-73 air-to-air missiles, bombs, and rockets as well as a built-in 30mm GSh-301 gun. The Mig-29 is able to outperform any existing western aircraft in a short range engagement employing the combination of R-73 missile, helmet-mounted sight and IRST.

The Mig-29 Fulcrum avionics are not as sophisticated as its NATO counterparts aircraft such as the Mirage 2000, F-15, F-16, and F/A-18. In the event of an air-to-air engagement at medium range NATO-aircraft shall have advantage over the Soviet Mig-29. However in a dogfight the Mig-29 will outperform NATO-aircraft easily. In the ground strike role the Mig-29 doesn't match NATO-aircraft capabilities.

The Mig-29SMT is an upgraded version of the proven Mig-29A Fulcrum. It is able to act as an air superiority fighter and a strike aircraft employing precision-guided weapons. The Zhuk-ME multimode radar system is the core of the integrated weapon system supplied to the Mig-29SMT aircraft. In addition, an advanced glass cockpit and the HOTAS concept has been provided to this revamped aircraft. Six underwing and one ventral pylons will carry missiles, bombs, and external fuel tanks required to fulfill the mission.

India is having 69 Mig-29S which will be upgraded to Mig-29SMT. What will be the performance enhancements we can expect. Also where does it stands in terms of generation (3, 4, 4.5) after these upgrades?

 

[KEETARP]

India is having 69 Mig-29S which will be upgraded to Mig-29SMT. What will be the performance enhancements we can expect. Also where does it stands in terms of generation (3, 4, 4.5) after these upgrades?

Trident - IAF never had Mig29S , we always had Mig29B in different batches .
NATO uses A/B/C as version
while Russians used Bort 12 / Bort 13 designation and of the Russians is correct to follow

Many enhancements -

First lets look at the shortcoming of previous Mig29-B-12s
a) RD33 and Short Legs (Fuel consumption was high + highly visible exhaust fumes, and the sheer number of fuel pumps were higher, with the last one being one of the principal causes of fatal airborne flameouts in case maintenance procedures were not strictly adhered to).

All improved with
RD-33-3/MK through incorporation of FADEC, TTSL of 4,000 hours
and short legs improved by in-flight refuelling and addition of extra fuel tank .

b) Early in IAF service - we had problems with engine spares and maintenance as every-time Engine had to be sent to Russia . Now with production of Engine in-house , situation will improve .

c) Hard-points increased with now
4 under each wing , total 9 with 13 stations
Maximum combat load now is 5500 KG

d) IRST from UOMZ - Can't tell improvement in Range ?
Open Architecture with all Mil1553 buses to support weapons of Foreign origin

e)Non-Russian components are -
-VOR/ILS/MKR unit,
-TACAN, (Tactical Airborne Navigation System)
-Comms suite,
-operational data link, - Israel built same as Su30mki
from TADIRAN SpectraLink compatible with Phalcon AWACS
-RWR, active jamming pod and internal jammer, - DARE and HAL built
-IFF and ATC transponder, - THALES / French origin
-laser designation pod, - Litening 3 from ISRAEL
-and the video recording system. from Israel
-HMD and HUD - Topsight Thales

 

[Donatello]

When are the IAF Mig-29s scheduled to retire? I mean aren't those airframes already too old?

 

[trident2010]

Trident - IAF never had Mig29S , we always had Mig29B in different batches .
NATO uses A/B/C as version
while Russians used Bort 12 / Bort 13 designation and of the Russians is correct to follow

Many enhancements -

First lets look at the shortcoming of previous Mig29-B-12s
a) RD33 and Short Legs (Fuel consumption was high + highly visible exhaust fumes, and the sheer number of fuel pumps were higher, with the last one being one of the principal causes of fatal airborne flameouts in case maintenance procedures were not strictly adhered to).

All improved with
RD-33-3/MK through incorporation of FADEC, TTSL of 4,000 hours
and short legs improved by in-flight refuelling and addition of extra fuel tank .

b) Early in IAF service - we had problems with engine spares and maintenance as every-time Engine had to be sent to Russia . Now with production of Engine in-house , situation will improve .

c) Hard-points increased with now
4 under each wing , total 9 with 13 stations
Maximum combat load now is 5500 KG

d) IRST from UOMZ - Can't tell improvement in Range ?
Open Architecture with all Mil1553 buses to support weapons of Foreign origin

e)Non-Russian components are -
-VOR/ILS/MKR unit,
-TACAN, (Tactical Airborne Navigation System)
-Comms suite,
-operational data link, - Israel built same as Su30mki
from TADIRAN SpectraLink compatible with Phalcon AWACS
-RWR, active jamming pod and internal jammer, - DARE and HAL built
-IFF and ATC transponder, - THALES / French origin
-laser designation pod, - Litening 3 from ISRAEL
-and the video recording system. from Israel
-HMD and HUD - Topsight Thales

Thanks for the detailed reply.

So if we see the upgrades then is it safe to say that it will then belong to 4th generation? I don't want to start vs debate but with which version/block of Mirage, F-16 and F-18 it will come close to?

 

[trident2010]

When are the IAF Mig-29s scheduled to retire? I mean aren't those airframes already too old?

Not any time soon.

Mig-29 and F-16 both got into production on around 1980. And both aircrafts still in active service in various airforces. After upgrade to Mig-29SMT, the capability of Mig-29 will increase considerably. These upgrades along with Mirage 2000 upgrade to Mirage-2005 Mk2 and MRCA will buy time IAF needed to induct LCA Mk2 and FGFA.

 

[KEETARP]

When are the IAF Mig-29s scheduled to retire? I mean aren't those airframes already too old?

Pneumbra

IAF mig29 have only clocked airframe life of roughly 3500-3000 Hours .

Russian engineer's did FSFT on Mig29B model {Full-Scale Fatigue Testing (FSFT)} and found that air-frame life of almost 2500 hours is left.
IAF decided to get TTLE Total Technical Life Enhancement (TTLE) since TTLS is supposed to be 5000-6000 hrs

Just to add - Recently Russian Migs were found to have cracks in air-frame after relatively short-span of 4000hrs .
But IAF rechecked its fleet for fatigue and crack problems were supposed to be not coming in future

which version/block of Mirage, F-16 and F-18 it will come close to

Its difficult to compare jets ,
and Mirage upgrade is even more extensive than Mig29 .
Roughly Mig29smt will fall somewhere between F16 - Block40 to 52.
Mirage 2000-5 will better in defensive suite with ICMS3 upgrade ,
Rafale's modular processor will always be handy for integration and even though RDY-2/3 is better in performance still Mirage lacks in BVR range , bcoz of MICA v R77 range .
I would put in terms of combat potential Mirage2000-5 = Mig29smt .

 

[Kinetic]

I would put in terms of combat potential Mirage2000-5 = Mig29smt .

Upgraded M2k will be more capable than upgraded Mig-29. IAF spending $ 880 mn for upgrading 70 Mig-29 while $ ~2 billion for 50 Mirages. The new Mirages will get almost all the systems of Rafale and few things more from out side. After upgrade Mirages will become true multi-role fighters with advanced and long range sensors.

 

[KEETARP]

That's true Kinetic , M2k leads in Multi-role
But BVR operation in Mirage is limited by MICA which is out-ranged by R77 , and that too by some margin .
T/W ratio of Mig29 will be better in all envelope , since Mirage is not getting Engine upgrade
Frontal OLS and Archer+ HMD combo with Maneuverability of Fulcrum . Its advantage Mig29 .

And now with Zhuk-M + Litening Pod , Mig29 will have capability to launch Stand-off A2S weapons / PGMs .

All that in less than 20mill .

 

[brahmastra]

views of the IAF pilots about Falcrums.

 

[Kinetic]

That's true Kinetic , M2k leads in Multi-role
But BVR operation in Mirage is limited by MICA which is out-ranged by R77 , and that too by some margin .
T/W ratio of Mig29 will be better in all envelope , since Mirage is not getting Engine upgrade
Frontal OLS and Archer+ HMD combo with Maneuverability of Fulcrum . Its advantage Mig29 .

And now with Zhuk-M + Litening Pod , Mig29 will have capability to launch Stand-off A2S weapons / PGMs .

All that in less than 20mill .

You are rite. Mig-29 is more maneuverable than M2K and M-77 will give it slightly upper hand in BVR but we don't know details of M2K upgrades. IAF spending $ 40 million for upgrading single Mirage while with some more we can buy all new Mig-29SMT or SU-30MKI. I think there are something more under the M2k deal.

 

[KEETARP]

I think , few months back DMLA and I discussed that Mirage package , Let me search and pull it up .
Mirage package has significant amount of weapons package as well
MICA+ASRAAM / A2S

And Kinetic - When you compare the cost of Avionics , Displays - Russians always provide very competitive price .
I Remember back in 2005 Turkey upgraded their F16 ( Only some avionics not even radar ) at 10mill per piece .

 

[KEETARP]

There it is -

For possible upgrade /

http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-...-quietly-signs-big-bang-deals.html#post761302

That is m2000-5 package , Indian version will differ slightly

And Here is missile pricing -
http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/29921-news-mirage-2000-upgrade-12.html#post777997

 

[Sri]

I think , few months back DMLA and I discussed that Mirage package , Let me search and pull it up .
Mirage package has significant amount of weapons package as well
MICA+ASRAAM / A2S

And Kinetic - When you compare the cost of Avionics , Displays - Russians always provide very competitive price .
I Remember back in 2005 Turkey upgraded their F16 ( Only some avionics not even radar ) at 10mill per piece .

Does Mirage deal have ASRAAM 120c/d?

Tx

 

[Kinetic]

I think , few months back DMLA and I discussed that Mirage package , Let me search and pull it up .
Mirage package has significant amount of weapons package as well
MICA+ASRAAM / A2S

And Kinetic - When you compare the cost of Avionics , Displays - Russians always provide very competitive price .
I Remember back in 2005 Turkey upgraded their F16 ( Only some avionics not even radar ) at 10mill per piece .

Thanks for the info. I also thought same, without weapons and lifetime logistics support included putting that much huge money is worthless.

 

[கார்த்த&]

c) Hard-points increased with now
4 under each wing , total 9 with 13 stations
Maximum combat load now is 5500 KG

Are hard-points and station different..? Please clarify the bolded part.

Thx