Featured Madrassahs and Mosques Announce Protest on Govt Decision to Reveal Sources of Income

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Meanwhile USA can fund gender studies (= leftist theology) in Pakistan and no one bats an eye. Great!

1. We know that the US is funding programs of study
2. We know which programs the US is funding
3. We will know which institutions/students get what funding


So what's wrong with requiring the same of religious organizations?

 

[krash]

Can I see a screenshot of your Internet Banking? Just to make sure that you don't get any money from MI6. It's for the safety of every PDF poster!

The government can actually demand a screenshot of your bank statement if it deems it necessary. Furthermore, you are not a public institution, mosques and madrassahs are. Every single other institute, public and private, is legally required to disclose their sources of income. Stop opposing it just because a rabid mullah started wailing about it.

Or hey, let's let IK, NS, and Zardari all be able to not disclose their sources of income either.

You're local mosque wasn't in Model Town, Lahore by any chance was it?

Literally the same story on my end.

Which block? Mine in E block used to be a simple but beautiful building. Now it's an ugly showroom of tiles of every color. They had to spend that money somewhere, I guess. The mosque also owns and runs the shops around it like a mafia. Doesn't end there. It also runs two schools that it has built on the mosque's empty land. Why would a mosque need all this?

The maulvi sahab, though, is a good man. Still rides his old bike.

 

[El Sidd]

The government can actually demand a screenshot of your bank statement if it deems it necessary. Furthermore, you are not a public institution, mosques and madrassahs are. Every single other institute, public and private, is legally required to disclose their sources of income. Stop opposing it just because a rabid mullah started wailing about it.

Or hey, let's let IK, NS, and Zardari all be able to not disclose their sources of income either.



Which block? Mine in E block used to be a simple but beautiful building. Now it's an ugly showroom of tiles of every color. They had to spend that money somewhere, I guess. The mosque committee also owns and runs the shops around it like a mafia.

is charity defined as income?

 

[krash]

is charity defined as income?

Yes. Yes it is.

 

[El Sidd]

Yes. Yes it is.

and can you force someone to open a bank account?

 

[krash]

and can you force someone to open a bank account?

Who is being forced to open a bank account?

 

[El Sidd]

Who is being forced to open a bank account?

Mosques and Madressahs.

They are being forced into opening bank accounts. The ploy is to have them commit to usury

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Which block? Mine in E block used to be a simple but beautiful building. Now it's an ugly showroom of tiles of every color. They had to spend that money somewhere, I guess. The mosque also owns and runs the shops around it like a mafia. Doesn't end there. It also runs two schools that it has built on the mosque's empty land. Why would a mosque need all this?

The maulvi sahab though is a good man. Still rides his old bike.

N-Block.

And the same, marble and tile everywhere. Took forever too.

No shops around this one. It's on a corner plot (the size of 4 normal plots) so surrounded by other houses and a park.

Mosques and Madressahs.

They are being forced into opening bank accounts. The ploy is to have them commit to usury

Why can't they use the 'Islamic banking' channels that have been opened at almost all major banks?

The fact that the Islamic banking, as outlined by some of our Ulema in Pakistan, is a complete fraud and waste of time and resources is another matter.

 

[krash]

Mosques and Madressahs.

Provide proof.

They are being forced into opening bank accounts. The ploy is to have them commit to usury

Is it really? Just by opening a bank account? I have bank accounts and I opted out of collecting any interest. What are you talking about?

I'm sure you have bank accounts and credit cards. Do you pay or receive interest? If you do then boy can I save you from hellfire.

 

[El Sidd]

Why can't they use the 'Islamic banking' channels that have been opened at almost all major

If all banks were islamic, even then no one can be forced to open an account with them.

The fact that the Islamic banking, as outlined by some of our Ulema in Pakistan, is a complete fraud and waste of time and resources is another matter.

Government has Islamic Ideology Council and the platform of Federal Shariah Court to challenge any such practice.

 

[El Sidd]

“We are ready to give expenditure details of madrassas but will not open our accounts in banks.”

Provide proof

it is there in OP. Iqra.
Its a federal institution not some rabbi

Is it really? Just by opening a bank account? I have bank accounts and I opted out of collecting any interest. What are you talking about?

I'm sure you have bank accounts and credit cards. Do you pay or receive interest?

I am not a mosque nor madressah.

Point is, you wanted to open a bank account and you wanted to opt out in dealing with interest. You were not forced to open any of them.

I am forced to pay interest on many things as devised by modern financial system.

Anyone who is taking public money is answerable to the public.

Charity funding has to be 100% transparent - that is a basic principle of charity finance.

From charity givers not receivers.

 

[krash]

it is there in OP. Iqra.
Its a federal institution not some rabbi

The mullah alleged that. Provide proof that he is correct. Afham.

I am not a mosque nor madressah.

Doesn't matter.

Point is, you wanted to open a bank account and you wanted to opt out in dealing with interest. You were not forced to open any of them.

Neither is the mullah or the mosque or the madrassah. Unless you can prove otherwise.

Btw, if the government does deem it necessary for mosques and madrassahs to have bank accounts then it most definitely has the right to force them into having bank accounts.

I am forced to pay interest on many things as devised by modern financial system.

Not by having a bank account.

 

[El Sidd]

Provide proof that he is correct.

I am open for proofs to prove him wrong

Btw, if the government does deem it necessary for mosques and madrassahs to have bank accounts then it most definitely has the right to force them into having bank accounts.

the right with which it can force it lies in gunpowder and manpower. not moral authority

Doesn't matter.

It really does. Unless you want me to treat my body as a temple and my conscience as God.

Not by having a bank account.

You may not earn interest on those bank accounts but the banks do.

 

[krash]

I am open for proofs to prove him wrong

That is an idiotic statement. I didn't say that, Hitchens did. Otherwise please proceed to proving that you do not sniff glue out of a rancid sock when no one can see you. In case the point wasn't clear enough, the one who makes the claim has the burden of proof.

"what may be asserted without evidence, may be dismissed without evidence." - Says Hitchens and his Razor.

the right with which it can force it lies in gunpowder and manpower. not moral authority

Naive argument. The state holds every right over everything and anything pertaining to the state's and its people's welfare. It also holds every right over the documentation of the bank notes that are issued under its authority. It is in fact its responsibility to ensure that no institute, man, woman, or corrupt mullah does or can do anything to harm any other. And if it needs to employ gunpowder and manpower to do that then it better, as did the Prophet (S.A.W) when destroying Masjid al-Dirar.

The state holds the only authority over a mosque and a madrassah. If not, then who does? A random mullah? Who holds the mullah accountable?

It really does. Unless you want me to treat my body as a temple and my conscience as God.

I don't have time for nonsense.

oh boy! people do not know the difference in usury and a rather unsuccessful attempt at inflation proofing (forget about profit-making).

I have a story for you from someplace called dadyal, mirpur Ajk.
ایک حرام خور خاندان ایک کمزور کسان سے چالیس سیر آٹا ادھار لیتا ھے اس شرط پر کہ اگلی فصل کے بعد واپس کرے گا. کئی سال گزر گئے. اب وه آٹے کی قیمت چالیس روپے دینے آگئے مگر اب اتنا آٹا چار سو کا ملتا تھا. کسان کے اعتراظ پر اس کو سود خوری کے الزام میں مارا پیٹا گیا. چالیس کی بجائے چار سیر لو ورنہ تم سود خور هو

There's a fair bit of debate on that without any consensus. Since, it's a religious debate, we'll stay out of it.

 

[El Sidd]

That is an idiotic statement. I didn't say that, Hitchens did. Otherwise please proceed to proving that you do not sniff glue out of a rancid sock when no one can see you. In case the point wasn't clear enough, the one who makes the claim has the burden of proof.

"what may be asserted without evidence, may be dismissed without evidence." - Says Hitchens and his Razor.




Naive argument. The state holds every right over everything and anything pertaining to the state's and its people's welfare. It also holds every right over the documentation of the bank notes that are issued under its authority. It is in fact its responsibility to ensure that no institute, man, woman, or corrupt mullah does or can do anything to harm any other. And if it needs to employ gunpowder and manpower to do that then it better, as did the Prophet (S.A.W) when destroying Masjid al-Dirar.

The state holds the only authority over a mosque and a madrassah. If not, then who does? A random mullah? Who holds the mullah accountable?




I don't have time for nonsense.

I have changed my views in light of this post.

They should all be forced into financial transparency for the greater good of society as moral obligation.

I take back my argument.