What's new

Kashmir | News & Discussions.

So, is new media only reinforcing old stereotypes?


  • Total voters
    44
All kuffars who are happy to create a divide dont understand that muslims are unitied in dealing with external threats..during the creation of Pakistan a Sunni majority country the biggest support came from Shia bearucrats and businessmen of North India and Bombay while the largest opposition was sunni hardline party Jamat E Islami?? Even Jinnah belonged to the Shia sect!!! Shocking isnt it??

This divide and rule legacy has not been wiped from Indian mentality yet they talk about "soverginty" and "freedom"

Sunnis, Shias....we all are MUSLIMS.

By the way, most Muslims on earth belong to the SUNNI sect..beware india!!!

Indian muslim population is Shia majority and many of them belong to biddati sub-sect of shia'sm despite that such claims will not sit well with mainstream Shias.
 
these hindus have a serious problem, what gives them the right to stick their nose in our religious matters especially when they have not a atoms size knowledge of our religion, its history and its teachings!

I'm a Sunni and i don't have a problem with Shia's at all, i might not share the same religious views as them but that doesn't mean i hate them or want to kill them! Keep trying but you won't divide us!
 
Last edited:
Many of the mainstream Indian shia I have met reject Indian Shi'sm preachers and scholars calling them "sold" and "government agents" due to their anti-pakistan stand in religious preaching.

I got this experience first hand after seein and India shia (from Hydrabad) colleuge of mine glued to religious shi'sm websites with .pk domain.

The indians are trying to play the divide and rule game because they think by wooing Shia's they can get stronger footing in energy rich central asia and persia.
 
First get one person who is non Muslim to say they want to separate from India. It is purely a religious movement, where some people just cannot tolerate a secular society.

Here, I made your life easier..

Jagjit_singh_chauhan.jpg

Jagjit singh chauhan

800px-Flag-of-Khalistan.svg.png

Khalistan Khālistān (Punjabi: ਖ਼ਾਲਿਸਤਾਨ) is on actually proposed Sikh homeland. The Khalistan movement is a movement in Indian Punjab to create "The Land of the Pure" as an independent Sikh state in all Punjabi-speaking areas, which include Indian Punjab, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh and some other Punjabi speaking parts of states like Gujarat and Rajasthan..[9]


800px-Front_Nacional_Democratic_Bodoland.svg.png

The National Democratic Front of Bodoland, also known as NDFB or the Bodo Security Force, is a separatist movement that is predominantly christian which seeks to obtain a sovereign Bodoland for the Bodo people in Assam. The founder of the organization, Ransaigra Nabla Daimari, alias Ranjan Daimari, continues to lead the organization.


in&

Both the National Liberation Front of Tripura and the All Tripura Tiger Force, which claim to represent the Tripuri people, an economically disadvantaged community.[8]. The NLFT, founded in 1989, aims for independence for Tripura. The NLFT is currently proscribed as a terrorist organization in India.

The Arunachal Dragon Force (ADF), also known as the East India Liberation Front, is a violent secessionist movement in the eastern Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh. The ADF seeks to create an independent state resembling the pre-British Teola Country consisting of area currently in Arunachal Pradesh as well as neighboring Assam.

I think this much is enough...:chilli:

We think Indian Muslims are different from Pakistanis and less susceptible to fanaticism. It is interesting that within Pakistan, the only group openly and violently opposed to Taliban and terrorism are UP and Bihar migrants who form Karachi’s secular Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM) party.

Doesnt MQM has its own histoy of worst terrorism in Pakistan and the infamous "body bags". Isnt there a warrant on its founder who has escaped to UK and has taken up UK citizenship??? MQM is violently opposed to Puktoons..it has never confronted talibans with weapons even when some taliban commanders were operating from its constituency. Isnt religious fanatism an invention of Indian muslim and his school of thought?? Moulana Modoodi??
 
Last edited:
i disagree with shia sunni differentiation.

The point is that only the valley muslims are pro-independance(not pro-pakistan ). The shia majority Kargil region is pro-India.

And the Gujjars and Bakerwals who are mostly sunni muslims but live in border regions are mostly pro-India as well. Infact, most of them get guns and training as part of village defence committes.


@somebozo

You seem to have a lot of misinformation about India, 85-86% are sunni muslims in India.

Moreover just speaking against GoP makes them government agents? IS the GoP or Pakistan some holy thing that it can't be criticised?
Get over it for God's sake.
 
@EjazR
I am not speaking on everyone behalf i clearly mentioned my findined limited to my experience only. Agree Pakistan is not a holy cow and among 1billion people one will find many nay and yay..
 
i disagree with shia sunni differentiation.

The point is that only the valley muslims are pro-independance(not pro-pakistan ). The shia majority Kargil region is pro-India.

And the Gujjars and Bakerwals who are mostly sunni muslims but live in border regions are mostly pro-India as well. Infact, most of them get guns and training as part of village defence committes.

Who are you to talk about an entire group of people. You are a south indian what the hell would you know about Gujjars.

Im a Muslim Gujjar, and everyone who knows me knows that im very anti-india. The man who came up with the word PAKISTAN and was one of the founding fathers of the Pakistan movement, Chaudhry Rahmat Ali, was a Muslim Gujjar. Theres a large population of Gujjars in Pakistan, even cities in Pakistan are named after us like Gujranwala in Punjab Province of Pakistan.

Give Muslim Gujjars in India Occupied Jammu and Kashmir a referendum, most would chose Pakistan on the spot.


You seem to have a lot of misinformation about India, 85-86% are sunni muslims in India..

Since when did india become a Muslim majority country? Only 13.5% of india's population is Muslim.

More than 80% are hindus in india.
 
@Omar

I am talking about Gujjars and Bakerwals of India not Pakistan. It is better you first learn about them rather than make statements that make no sense.

Why would Pakistani Gujjars be pro India?

and second, out of the muslim community in India 85-86% are sunni. Now cheer up.
 
Since when did india become a Muslim majority country? Only 13.5% of india's population is Muslim.

More than 80% are hindus in india.

EjazR
Re: What ails Kashmir? The Sunni idea of ‘azadi’
@Omar

and second, out of the muslim community in India 85-86% are sunni. Now cheer up.

80% of muslims in INDIA are sunnis
 
@Omar

I am talking about Gujjars and Bakerwals of India not Pakistan. It is better you first learn about them rather than make statements that make no sense.

First of all Jammu and Kashmir is not india. Its a disputed territory recognized by the UN and the entire international community as a disputed territory. Secondly, Muslim Gujjars all over the world are the same people. We have the same blood, same religion, same traditions, same history, same names. We are exactly the same, no matter if we are in India Occupied Jammu and Kashmir or in Azad Kashmir or in Punjab province of Pakistan. We are the same. You are a south indian and got absolutely nothing to do with Muslim Gujjars.
 
OK Omar if that makes you happy good for you.

Delusions is not reality. Hope you can understand that.

The reality is that Geelani "saab" actually said that Gujjars are not muslims. Just because they don't support his "movement".

That the valley sepratists shouted slogans like Gujjar Gujjar hai hai just because they are pro-India.

Just two articles for you to read, and you will find many more if you want to

Is it a sin to be a Gujjar?
Gujjar, Bakerwal students reject Geelani’s statement
 
Last edited:
This man..go figure...I love him..he also very much look like of my Kashmiri friend aka Malik jee!

kashmirmalik.jpg
 
And here is a writer that explains why

Across LoC: Gujjars In Identity Crisis By Zafar Choudhary
By Zafar Choudhary

09 February, 2007
Countercurrents.org

The third largest ethnic group –after Kashmiri speaking Muslims and Dogra Hindus –Gujjars are a unique tribe with their own cultural and linguistic identities. Over the years, even politically they have emerged as significant entity influencing the winning prospects of any party in more than 20 of 87 assembly constituencies in Jammu and Kashmir. Since early 1990s, after their inclusion in Scheduled Tribes –a provision of the Constitution of India which provides for reservation in jobs and other welfare benefits –this tribe has undergone a significant improvement in their socio-economic profile. A struggle is currently on for political reservation as they are seeking reservation of assembly constituencies proportionate to their population.


Since Jammu and Kashmir has been a single geo-political entity before the division of 1947 which separated lakhs of siblings across two sides of Jammu and Kashmir on Indian and Pakistani side, Gujjars too suffered enormously on this account. Ever since the plight of Gujjars in the Pakistan administered Kashmir has been a subject of keen interest. After the Pahari-Punjabi speaking Rajput Muslims, Gujjars are the second larget ethnic group in Pakistan administered Kashmir. With the establishment of communication links between two parts of the formerly undivided state –the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad and Poonch-Rawalakote bus services –a reality check on both sides reveals that the Gujjars in Pakistan administered Kashmir are the verge of loosing the distinct identity.


Pir Panchal region is considered the home to the Gujjar Tribe in Jammu and Kashmir state. Although their scattered inhabitations and houses are also existing in Kashmir valley, Jammu, Udhampur, Kathua and Doda district on this side of Line of Control; a sizeable Gujjar population lives on the other side of Line of Control particularly in Mirpur, Bhimber, Kotli, Plandri, Rawala Kote, Bagh and Muzaffrabad district of Pakistan administered Kashmir. Their main concentration, however, is on the slopes and foot hills of Pir Panchal.

In several parts of Jammu and Kashmir, the Gujjars are flourshing with their cultural flavour, traditional heritage and Gojri linguistic atmosphere. Majority of Gujjars migrate from their native villages to upper reaches, Dhoks, Margs and Pastures of Panchal range during summer season, where they relish natural live, tribal system, traditional food and melodious folk songs. This natural atmosphere, location-disadvantages and aloofness from the modern life although made this community economically backward but their unique tribal culture and distinct heritage remain preserved which is rarely available elsewhere in the world.

Due to the happenings of 1947 which divided Jammu and Kashmir into two parts through the line ran cutting across the heart of Pir Panchal region; conflicts with Pakistan during 1965 and 1971; shelling and firing from across LoC and militancy related activities, this tribal community remained the main victim of this unfavourable scenario. About 17,000 families of Gujjar tribes had crossed LoC during this period and migrated to PaK leaving behind their blood relations on this side which made it difficult for their to settle on other side of line. They had very limited source of income for survival. On the other hand the Gujjars already existing in PaK were also economically weaker as compared to the other communities. Therefore this community was not in apposition to walk with the other ethnic groups residing there who have full control on administration, trade and agriculture. No doubt that religious affinity and malice propaganda from the other side had attracted them but in the modern world only religion is not a binding factor. The economic ties and social upliftments are considered the main factor which can lead the communities towards prosperity.

The Gujjars in PaK are not in majority and they are considered economically weaker then the other tribes. Therefore they remain dominated by the other communities and so could not protect their cultural as well as linguistic identity. Now when the doors on LoC have been opened, the dividing families have started pouring in on both the sides. People to people contacts have been established after 7, November 2005 between the dividing families residing Poonch and Rajouri and other side of LoC. The hard facts started coming into fore. Most of the Gujjars who have visited their native places in Poonch and Rajouri have narrated hard realities about the conditions of Gujjars residing on the other side which are the eye opening for the same community living on the other side.

Choudhary Mohammad Sharief a Gujjar and shopkeeper in Trar Khal in PaK and originally native of village Kanuyian in Poonch who visited Poonch through trans-LoC bus service says that the Gujjar identity is on the brink of vanish on other side.

“The symbols of our culture like folk songs, folk music, traditions addresses and age old rituals are missing on the other sides which are well visible in Jammu and Kashmir”, says Sharief. Majority of Gujjars have forgotten the life of Dhoks and Mergs which forms the essential part of their heritage.

Abdul Ghani –a teacher also from Trar Khal and a native of Rajouri –says, “I am immensely pleased to see my relatives working on significant positions in the government and holding important positions in the political parties in Jammu and Kashmir”. However, he says, “I am equally sad when I put this scenario in comparison to the life we are leading in Azad Kashmir”. He adds, “I feel one major factor which has contributed to the welfare of Gujjars here in Jammu and Kashmir is the right to equal opportunities and avenues and further special privileges of reservation under the provisions of Scheduled Tribe”. Such privileges are not available to this community on the other side of LoC.

Another Gujjar passenger who visited Poonch from Trar Khar -Mohammad Rauf is surprised to see the communal harmony, brotherhood and composite culture between Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs in this side but in *** even in Muslim community the Gujjars are not considered at par with the original habitants and landlords. As far as Gojri language is concerned, Rauf says, “no body dares to speak Gojri in Bazaras and public functions in any part of Pakistan administered Kashmir as it is spoken freely on this side. The regular publications of Gojri book like Sheraza, Mahro Adab, Shingra Ki Rani by the Jammu and Kashmir Cultural academy is marvelous contribution towards the mother tongue of Gujjars. Among the non-governmental organisations, the work of Gurjar Desh Charitable Turst, Gojri Anjumans and Gojri programmes from Radio are a serious and sustained contribution towards preservation of this ethnic and linguistic identity in Jammu and Kashmir.


On the other side of LoC, there is no such Government institution or civil society effort for the promotion of Gojri language and the Gujjar tribe. Even the Gojri writers of that side like Rana Fazal Rajourivi have got their books published through J&K Cultural Academy. “Except some individuals efforts no literary work for the development of Gojri language have been done in Azad Kashmir” says Rauf.

Another visitor, Choudhary Mohammad Bashir, who born in Surankote but migrated across LoC in 1965 and now working as District Qazi in Kotli District says that he feels isolated in Pakistan administered Kashmir because Gujjars inhibitions even in speaking their mother tongue and practicing their cultural ethos under pressure from other dominant communities. Unlike in Jammu and Kashmir, Gujjars in Pakistan occupied Kashmir do not use their surname ‘Choudhary’ as it identifies them and consequently earns them hatred of others.
An old Gujjar Master Abdul Latief of Bandi Abasspur in Pakistan administered Kashmir who had come to meet his relatives in the village Kalai of Poonch district is candid enough in saying that the ethnic, cultural and linguistic identity of Gujjars have been completely diluted on other side as he described this as State sponsored hatred against this tribe. “Their economic condition is vulnerable, most of the Gujjars are illiterate and working as land tillers and shepherds”, says Latief.

Apart from the economic disparities, the main problem faced by the Gujjars across LoC is the marriages of their children. On this account, the sufferings of Gujjars are so enormous that they are considered a sort of social outcaste and members of other communities do not enter into wedlock with the Gujjars. This social disparity has some in a serious problem for Gujjars who neither can marry their girls to boys of other communities and nor can get girls for their boys. A majority of the Gujjar visitors from Pakistan administered Kashmir have been making vehement appeals to the government and seeking support from the civil society that they should be allowed to have nuptial relations with their community members in Jammu and Kashmir. If this does not happen, the Gujjar tribe may face extinction in Pakistan administered Kashmir in the near future.


This state of affairs explains the condition of Gujjars in Pakistan administered Kashmir which have come to fore after opening of the trans-LoC links.

Author is Editor-in-Chief, Epilogue monthly current affairs magazine on Jammu and Kashmir and news portal Epilogue He can be reached at editor.epilogue@gmail.com
 
OK Omar if that makes you happy good for you.

Delusions is not reality. Hope you can understand that.

The reality is that Geelani "saab" actually said that Gujjars are not muslims. Just because they don't support his "movement".

That the valley sepratists shouted slogans like Gujjar Gujjar hai hai just because they are pro-India.

Just two articles for you to read, and you will find many more if you want to

Is it a sin to be a Gujjar?
Gujjar, Bakerwal students reject Geelani’s statement

I'm not going to read indian news sources who are trying to divide Muslims. They are trying to divide Gujars from Kashmiris like they are trying to divide Shias from Sunnis, but it will never work.

You have to meet real life people, not read biased news from a country that keeps most of its troops far away up north in a disputed territory for 63 years denying freedom to the inhabitants of the land.


All Muslim Gujjars regard Chaudhry Rahmat Ali as a hero and will always side with Pakistan. Once referendum is given to all people of Jammu and Kashmir, you will see that the majority of Gujjar Muslims, Kashmiri Muslims, Sunni Muslims, and Shia Muslims will chose Pakistan over india. I know that would be the worst nightmare for you knowing that bharati muslims will then suffer once again in the hands of angry hindu mobs.
 
This state of affairs explains the condition of Gujjars in Pakistan administered Kashmir which have come to fore after opening of the trans-LoC links.

Total B.S. Gujjars rule Pakistan. We are everywhere in every field in Pakistan. Why would we hurt our own people in Azad Kashmir. A Gujar from Punjab province of Pakistan is exactly the same as a Gujar from Azad Kashmir or India Occupied Kashmir. We may differ from other clans of Punjab but not with our own people.
 
Back
Top Bottom