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So, is new media only reinforcing old stereotypes?


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I see alot of debate between Pakistani & Indian about Kashmir issue however some Kashmiris may just have Pakistani flag in their profiles like me:pakistan:
Just wondering I am the only Kashmiri member on the forum, I hope not. Doesn't matter if your from Azad, Jammu, Aksai we are all Kashmiri. Also, please don't start discussing whether Azad is Azad, Aksai is Kashmir etc..., not the point of the thread (with all respect).

For any Kashmiris, I have some general question to get the ball rolling:

Are you in India/Pak/Kashmir?

If abroad which country?

The Buddhists, Hindu's are Kashmiris too, why do we only hear of Muslim Kashmiris? All our ancestors have eat the wheat of the same soil.

Should Kashmir be independent?

Kashmiri pride over nationalistic pride?
 
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First tell about yourself - are you living in Pakistani side of the Kashmir or Indian side of the Kashmir? i know you are in UK but what about your family and relatives?

and i am not Kashmiri - I am Punjabi by birth
 
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How free is my Valley?

Saadia Gardezi (The Friday Times, Pakistan)

The “Azad” in AJK smacks of oxymoronic rhetoric. Azad Jammu and Kashmir (AJK) is neither a free territory, nor a province of Pakistan. Muzaffarabad has always been under the control of Islamabad and the curtailment of the freedom of expression is constitutionally protected. Without meaning to refer to the new name just bestowed on an old province, let me ask, what’s in a name?

Here is what.

There are a number of reports that describe the human rights violations in Indian Occupied Kashmir but it is hard to come by reports of violations on Pakistan’s side. The Pakistani government often pretends that the only problems faced by Kashmiris are in India. The official position that there are no human rights violations in AJK is a naïve and disingenuous position that needs to be challenged. According to the Freedom House World Freedom Reports, in 2008 Pakistan-administered Kashmir was given the status “Not Free”. This index awards a score of 1 to a “free country” based on ratings of political rights and civil liberties. These ratings are averaged, ranging from 1 to 7, i.e. countries or disputed territories with scores from 1 to 2.5 are considered Free, 3 to 5 are Partly Free, and 5.5 to 7 are Not Free. In 2008, this index gave AJK a Political Rights Score of 7 and a Civil Liberties score of 5. The scores for AJK have improved to a 6 and a 5 respectively in 2010. In comparison, Indian Occupied Kashmir has better scores of 5 for political rights and a 4 for civil liberties, and a status of ‘partly free’, which ironically is exactly equivalent to Pakistan’s national score and status!

According to Brad Adams, Asia Director at Human Rights Watch , the “Pakistani authorities govern Azad Kashmir with strict controls on basic freedoms… The military shows no tolerance for dissent and practically runs the region as a fiefdom.” The presence of an elected local government is a mere formality. In 2006, Human Rights Watch (HRW) reported that the federal government in Islamabad, the army and the ISI control all aspects of political life in AJK. Torture is routinely used in Pakistan, and this practice is also common in AJK. HRW also documented incidents of torture by the intelligence services and other agencies and individuals acting at the behest of the security establishment but knows of no cases in which members of military and paramilitary security and intelligence agencies have been prosecuted or even disciplined for acts of torture or mistreatment.

The Human Rights Commission of Pakistan (HRCP) has also articulated tight controls on freedom of expression as a key pillar of government policy in AJK. While militant organizations promoting the incorporation of Indian-administered Jammu and Kashmir State into Pakistan have had free reign to propagate their views, groups promoting an independent Kashmir find their speech curtailed. Publications and literature favouring independence are banned.

Pakistan has prevented the creation of an independent media in the territory through bureaucratic restrictions and coercion. Looking at the freedom of expression in AJK, before 2005, the only radio allowed to operate was the Azad Kashmir Radio, a subsidiary of Radio Pakistan. Similarly before the earthquake telephone landlines were limited and being strictly monitored and a very limited mobile telephone service was operational. HRW reports that all telecommunications stations were controlled by the Special Communications Organization (SCO), a functional unit of the Pakistani army. Only after the earthquake did the government allow private mobile phone companies to operate in Azad Kashmir when it was pointed out that the loss of life could have been lessened had people and rescue workers had this technology as they did in affected areas in NWFP (as it was then called).

It has been widely reported that refugees from Jammu and Kashmir are discriminated against and mistreated by the authorities. Kashmiri refugees and former militants from India, most of whom are secular nationalists and culturally and linguistically different from the people of AJK, are particularly harassed through continuous surveillance, arbitrary beating and arrests and restraints on political expression. Pakistani military bases in AJK are usually placed in close proximity to highly populated civilian areas supposedly because of a lack of space. But many Kashmiris told HRW that the Pakistani military uses the bases to keep a close watch on the population to ensure political compliance and control.

Freedoms of association and assembly are restricted and constitutionally repressed. Article 4(7)(2) of the Azad Jammu and Kashmir Interim Constitution Act of 1974, states: ‘No person or party in Azad Jammu and Kashmir shall be permitted to propagate against, or take part in activities prejudicial or detrimental to, the ideology of the States accession to Pakistan’. In recent years anti-government demonstrations have been violently suppressed and examples of these incidents are not hard to find. In 2005, at least ten people were killed when the police fired on a group of Shia students, after which curfews were imposed in Gilgit to prevent demonstrators from assembling. In 2006 police detained leaders of the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front, including Amanullah Khan, after they attended a peaceful rally in Rawalpindi against the construction of the Bhasha Dam. Khan was detained for a week and was not permitted to receive visitors during that time, according to the U.S. State Department’s human rights report. In October 2008, police baton-charged dozens of people demonstrating against the proposal to move the capital of Azad Kashmir from Muzaffarabad. Three people were arrested but released the same day. In November 2008, the police blocked activists of the pro-independence APNA who were protesting in favor of truck services across the line-of-control from entering a town near the line-of-control.

In 2007, the European Union (EU) passed Emma Nicholson’s Kashmir report with an overwhelming majority and adopted it as an official EU document. This kind of report sits squarely in the grey area of the AJK problem. It has been touted in the media as being anti-Pakistan and there are Kashmiris who find it pro-Kashmiri rights and some call it dubious. The key problem with this report is that it fails to acknowledge Indian repression in Kashmir and portrays a benign image of a “pro-people” India.

The EU report titled ‘Present situation and future prospects’ was critical of the fact that the Pakistan side of Kashmir was governed through the Ministry of Kashmir Affairs in Islamabad, that Pakistan officials dominated the Kashmir Council. This report also highlighted the facts that at the time the Chief Secretary, the Inspector-General of Police, the Accountant-General and the Finance Secretary were all from Pakistan. Nicholson disapproved of the provision in the 1974 Interim Constitution, which forbids any political activity that is not in accordance with the doctrine of Jammu and Kashmir as articulated by Pakistan, and obliges any candidate for a parliamentary seat in AJK to sign a declaration of loyalty to that effect.

Looking at the rule of law, the whole system of law and order seemingly rests on the control by the army and Islamabad. A clear illustration was given at the time of the 2005 earthquake when the AJK governmental structure collapsed. Analysts noted how, in the aftermath of 2005 earthquake the local government system was exposed. To quote Akbar Zaidi, “the local government system and its elected bodies are part of the rubble along with the entire physical infra-structure of the area.”

Due to the limited mandate of the AJK Legislative Assembly, the elected political leaders of Azad Kashmir essentially remain ostensible heads of the territory while the real power resides in Islamabad with the Ministry of Kashmir and Northern Areas (KANA). Naturally this requires an obedient AJK administration. Since the early 1990s, the decision-making authority and management of the Kashmir issue has been under the Pakistan military, the ISI and ISI backed militant organizations.

In this unique case of “self-rule”, under the constitution, the elected representatives are acquiescent to the Kashmir Council controlled by Islamabad. The High Court and Supreme Court Judges can only be appointed by approval of the Ministry of Kashmir Affairs in Islamabad. The Minister of Kashmir Affairs can dismiss the Prime Minister, as can the Chief Secretary – another Islamabad appointee. Under Article 56, the President of Pakistan can dissolve the Legislative Assembly.

Adding to the already dismal situation of human rights in AJK is the instability of the Northern Areas and the migration of these people into AJK. It can be argued that the appropriation of land in the Northern Areas by non-Kashmiri migrants with the tacit encouragement of the federal government and army has diminished economic opportunities for the local population. An externality of this has been an increase in sectarian tension between the majority Shia Muslims and the growing numbers of Sunnis in AJK and 2009 and 2010 have seen increasing tension and sectarian violence.

So is the human rights and law and order situation of AJK worse than that at the east of the line of control? Answers can range from “yes” to “maybe” to “no”. The truth is that this is a loaded question, and this sort of a comparison is hard to make. Reports and perspectives of AJK from the Indian side refer to AJK as Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. It is indeed true that there is a lack of consideration of human rights on both sides. Yet the facts are blurred by the political biases of both sides, and neutral reports become emotionally charged. External reporting by international watchdogs like Amnesty International or Human Rights Watch are a step behind. Research by organizations like the HRCP and reporting by local news channels is only just making headway.

The 2006 Human Rights Watch report on Kashmir quotes a Muzaffarabad resident, “Pakistan says they are our friends and India is our enemy. I agree India is our enemy, but with friends like these, who needs enemies?”

AJK is yet to operate as a ‘free’ territory given the way we control it. Yet, understandably, we are loathe to accept this reality and our mainstream media is usually silent about this. Our rhetoric on AJK remains inflated and questionable.

'How free is my valley' from TFT

Nice article. Gives a true picture of 'Azad' Kashmir
 
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Iam a kashmiri. All of my family is from kashmir. Azad Kashmir

---------- Post added at 07:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:31 PM ----------

I would add the kashmiri flag next to the pakistan and american flag but this site doesn't have a ajk flag.
 
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This is the most retarded report i have ever read. My entire family, my entire clan which numbers in the hundred of thousands lives in ajk. While living in the U.S. my mom and dad call back to akj almost everday. If their was any problems we would know about it. This reporter is saying that their is no freedom in ajk???? Pakistani goverment not letting the ajk saying anything???? Then how in the hell was he able to write this article. This newssite is based out of lahore. He is wrting about it right now isn't he?????? anyone stopping him from writing this paper. ?????????????
 
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i don't know what valley he is refering to but ajk is as free as any other part of pakistan. Well it enjoys better freedom then balochistan and the northern areas
 
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Quiet diplomacy working: Pillai | Greater Kashmir

‘Consolidating Separatist Point Of View’

GK NEWS NETWORK

New Delhi, May 20: Government of India Thursday said the quiet diplomacy on Kashmir initiated by the Home Minister P Chidambaram is working well and it was “yielding results.”
“Quiet diplomacy initiated by the Home Minister is yielding results,” Home Secretary G K Pillai said in an interview with All India Radio.
He said the process (quiet diplomacy) was helping in consolidating the points of view of the groups who are not part of the mainstream politics in the state. In response to a question regarding the Prime Minister Dr Manmohan Singh’s forthcoming visit to the state, Pillai said; “continuation of the internal dialogue process on Kashmir is of paramount importance.” He said the reports of five Working Groups on Kashmir set up by the Prime Minister are under consideration of the Government.
Pertinently, while the separatists have been repeatedly denying being part of any such covert process, the state Congress president Prof Saif-ud-Din Soz other day also echoed the views similar to that of the Home Secretary on “quiet diplomacy”.
“Quiet dialogue (with separatists) is on,” Soz told reporters here on Wednesday and added that the leaders (Hurriyat) must be in touch with them (the Government of India). Soz even credited himself for having contributed “in a small way in the process.”
He had, however, refused to elaborate on what kind of dialogue was on between the Government of India and the separatists. The announcement regarding Government of India’s willingness to workout a unique solution of the Kashmir issue through ‘quiet dialogue, quiet diplomacy’ was made by Chidambaram in Srinagar last year.
Speaking to journalists on
the sidelines of an All-India newspaper editor’s conference here on 14 October 2009, Chidambaram had said; “India is not afraid of dialogue and is willing to talk to all shades of opinion in the state for a solution through quiet dialogue. The solution will be announced after the contours of the political solution assume a definitive shape.”
The Home Secretary, in his interview today said that Pakistan was not happy with this process (quiet diplomacy) and infiltration from across the Line of Control continues. Expressing concern over growing infiltration, he said that Jammu and Kashmir police is now taking lead in dealing with the militants.
Pillai said the central paramilitary forces and army would vacate all the school buildings and stadia etc in Jammu and Kashmir by the end of this year.
The Home Secretary said this year 1.50 lakh policemen are being recruited in the country and as per the UN norms 8 lakh policemen are needed for better policing against the sanctioned strength of 3 and half lakh in the country.
 
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Oh so now the dead are now Van Winkles?

I guess the same mentality comes from the Indian soilders who commit these crimes against humanity.



http://muktadhara.net/page35.html

I happen to check this link and I am stunned.......don't think I can sleep well for days. My GOD ..........

The reason why I post this here is that I feel, just like me, lot of people have not undertood what people went through.


Quote some

John Hastings, A Methodist missionary worked in Bangladesh for 20 years.

(from Newsweek)

General Tikka Khan was briefed not only by General Yahya Khan but also by Mr. Bhutto then riding the crest of a popularity wave as the new savior of Islam. Gen Tikka in turn briefed his Army Senior Commanders and picked up a staff who would understand why a Muslim Massacre by a Muslim Army, Hindu slaughter, why all intellectuals were to be killed in cold blood, why all young Bengali Muslim girls were to be raped, not to satisfy lust but as a religious duty to produce a new generation of blue-blooded true Muslims.

When the Sheikh had finally turned down all sentimental arguments, pleading for still further sacrifices on the part of Bangladesh in the interest of Islam (as understood in Punjab), Bhutto made his appearance in Dacca for no reasons at all. He had arrived to strengthen the shaky hands of Yahya Khan, the Martial Law Administrator, and to advise him what action to take with hell raisers like Mujeeb.”

“ The first major slaughter appears to have taken place on 23 March, 1971, a day before the talks were ended and Gen Yahya flew back to Islamabad. On this day thousands of people started collecting near Chittagong port. mostly they consisted of innocent laborers. There was no government order prohibiting assemblies. Without warning, automatic fire was opened upon them and soon the e whole area was littered with dead bodies. The dead were later found to be over four thousand. Their bodies were thrown into the sea.

On 25 march 1971, the Pakistan forces entered Dacca University and went straight for Jaggannath Hall, which was a hostel for Hindu students. Over one hundred students were butchered mercilessly in their rooms.

Next morning Army units again arrived. They gathered all those who were wounded the previous day including Dr GC Deb, the Head of the department of philosophy, Dacca University, and ordered them to collect all the dead bodies from different rooms and pile them up in the courtyard of the hall. It was a difficult and painful task for bleeding and disabled persons but orders had to be complied with. After this painful task was over, all the wounded including Dr GC Deb were lined up close to the dead bodies and shot dead mercilessly.

On 25 March 1971, all the hutments of poor people, mostly Muslim rickshaw pullers of Babupara Basti (slum) near New Market, Dhaka, were set ablaze with incendiary bombs. Machine guns were already in position to mow down any one who tried to escape from being burnt alive. No one was to be spared. Children and women met their fate along with their men folk. Over one hundred thousand were burnt in this inferno. They were all Muslims. Their only fault was that they formed a part of a large mass of people who wanted to earn enough to be able to live their miserable lives.

1. On 26 March the same treatment was meted out to Muslims occupying huts along the railway line between Nikhot and Hatkhola. Incendiary bombs and Machine guns took a heavy toll of people who had no chance even to see the butchers of the Army.

2. In Naya Bazar Basti, in old Dhaka city, on the same day, Muslim Awami League supporters were given the same treatment, but their young girls were removed to Army camp for rape as a measure of mercy.

3. On the night of 25 March, Pak forces attacked East Bengal Rifles HQ in Chittagong. This formation consisted of loyal Bangalees who had served as a Pakistan Army for about 25 years. But they were not to be trusted any more since they were known to be sympathetic to Mujib’s movement for autonomy. About a thousand men who were under training to serve Pakistan were lined up and machine-gunned.

4. Curfew was first clamped down on Sylhet town on 25 March 1971 about which none of the inhabitants were given any notice. An old man was coming out of the mosque after prayers when he was shot dead. The Army men then asked his two sons to remove the dead body. As soon as they came near the dead body they were both shot dead also. This pile of three bodies was allowed to rot in open view as a lesson for others who might venture out to the mosque for prayers.

5. Another instance is quoted of whole rows of praying Muslims in a Mosque, being machine-gunned, with the remarks that they were not true Muslims and hence not entitled to pray in mosque.

6. On 27 March a house-to-house search was conducted in Sylhet town from where most people had run away to the countryside. All women left in the town were raped including one who was 60 years old. After committing rape on one girl, they chopped off her breasts. The poor thing collapsed and died on the spot.

7. On 31 March during day time Pahartoli locality of Chittagong town was attacked by the Pak Army in collaboration with Bihari refugees. About 3,000 Bangalees were killed and all women raped. About 500 beautiful girls were dragged to the cantonment and innumerable men used to rape them. One of these girls is reported to have remarked it is possible to stand the pangs of rape by so many beasts but impossible to bear the heat in body which results from excessive accumulation of semen.

8. About 40% population of Dinajpur district was of Hindus. Only a few could escape to India. The remainders were wiped out by the Pak Army. Some Hindus appealed to be concerted into Islam and spared the agony of torture to death. None was excused. All were shot dead and buried in one pit. On the report of one Sital Sarkar that Hindus of Singia village about 8 miles North East of Thakurgaon were still hoisting Bangladesh flag, the total Hindu population of that village consisting of about 1500 people was done to death in about half an hour and the dead bodies dumped in two large pits dug by the Hindus themselves.

9. Chittagong town perhaps suffered most. On 5/6 April the town was cordoned off, houses looted, women raped and after the rape naked women were marched to the river for a bath-- all tied with ropes like cattle. About 50 girls were taken to Ramgarh military cantonment where each girl was raped daily by about 10 to 15 men. At the time of rape the Pakistanis would shout “Joy Bangla” the war cry of freedom fighters and ask their miserable victims to shout for help to their father, “Sheikh Mujeeb.” Here all those affected were upper and middle class Muslims.

10. On 10 April 1971, Biharis(non-Bengali Muslim migrants from Bihar, India) observed what they called a ‘Revenge Day’ in Dhaka with the full cooperation of the Pak Army.

The area chosen in Dhaka lay between Mirpur and Syamoli, since it was mainly occupied by upper and middle class Muslim government servants. The whole locality was cordoned off by Pak forces. Non-Bangalees were then let loose to satisfy all their sadist tendencies. After loot and butchery they raped every women.

Killing continued while rape was being done. About 3,000 Bangalees lost their lives. No one knows the number of women who lost their honor besides lives. Those were some of the reasons for Biharis being denied Bangladesh citizenship.

11. There was yet another cruelty practiced which has no precedence in history. During curfew hours Pak soldiers used to collect all the young boys they could find in the houses. They were blindfolded and handcuffed and taken to hospitals where their total blood used to be drained off. After which their dead bodies were thrown into Buri Ganga River. This is reported to have been practiced at many places throughout Bangladesh.

12. One Kuti Sen, a Bengali Hindu, who had not been able to run away to India, was caught and handed over to the Muslim leaguers gathered in the local football field. A Pak Army Officer gave a lecture, which was explained, to the Bengali Muslim leaguers by an interpreter. The gist of the lecture was that all Hindus were agents of India and, therefore Muslims should kill them as an act of religious duty. Kuti Sen was tied with ropes, thrown on the ground and kicked to death by all present as an act of piety.

13. On recapture of Maulabi Bazar, then a sub -division of Sylhet district, in the third week of April, the town was looted and all suspects killed. All fair looking young girls were taken to Army camp and raped. Next morning they were brought naked to the local playground and compelled to dance before the leaders of the Muslim League throughout the day. Then they were taken to Shibpur Army camp and nothing was heard about them again.

14. On 1st April 1971, a most horrifying thing happened in Holati village under the Sabhar PS of Dhaka district:

The village was surrounded on all sides by Pak Army men accompanied by Biharis armed with daggers and spears. This was a pro-Awami League Hindu village. It was set on fire where even the cattle and domestic animals got burnt alive. Those who ran out were machine gunned as usual except some girls who were saved for sadistic pleasures. Babies were snatched from their mother and thrown up to fall on the pointed bayonets as an exercise in dexterity. The breasts of their mothers were chopped off and inserted into the mouths of the dead bodies. Those still alive were asked to shout ‘Joy Pakistan’. Most of them did as they were told by the sadist butchers. A boy aged six years, however, innocently said ‘Joy Bangla’ the slogan he was used to shouting. This enraged the Army men so much that they cut that boy into fifty pieces and gave one piece each to the Hindus still alive to eat. On their refusal they were all shot dead to the glory of Pakistan.

The few young girls who were spared the mercy of death were told not to be afraid. “ We are not going to hurt you or kill you. You have been chosen to receive the good Muslim semen so that you give birth to true Muslims and not the bastards like Mujib” Those girls were dragged away to the Army camp at Tungi.

15. Here is another instance of the horrible tricks the Pak Army used to kill Bangalees. On 27 April 1971, the Pak Army decided to treat the derailment of a train at Goal Tek as an act of sabotage. Actually the railway track had given way due to erosion of the soft soil under the track. But while ravaging the Bangalees was the main agenda any excuse would do.

Four villages in the vicinity i.e. Goal Tek, Morkon, Pagar and Abdullapur were charged with sheltering the Mukti Bahini (Freedom Fighters) and committing sabotage. The villages were set on fire while the inhabitants were asked to gather along with their families in selected places in batches of about thirty. Here fathers and brothers were asked to rape their daughters and sisters in front of the gathering. On refusal all of them were butchered including women and children. They were all Muslims. In some places people were forced to jump into the fire and were roasted alive



Major General SS Uban: Phantoms of Chittagong

".........the Pakistan army [sought] out those especially likely to join the resistance -- young boys. Sweeps were conducted of young men who were never seen again. Bodies of youths would be found in fields, floating down rivers, or near army camps. As can be imagined, this terrorized all young men and their families within reach of the army. Most between the ages of fifteen and twenty-five began to flee from one village to another and toward India. Many of those reluctant to leave their homes were forced to flee by mothers and sisters concerned for their safety......" ( J. Rummel " Death By Government, p. 329.)

Rummel further describes (p. 323) a chilling gendercidal ritual, reminiscent of Nazi procedure towards Jewish males: "In what became province-wide acts of genocide, Hindus were sought out and killed on the spot. As a matter of course, soldiers would check males for the obligated circumcision among *******. If circumcised, they might live; if not, sure death."

"... In the dead region surrounding Dacca, the military authorities conducted experiments in mass extermination in places unlikely to be seen by journalists. At Hariharpara, a once thriving village on the banks of the Buriganga River near Dacca, they found the three elements necessary for killing people in large numbers: a prison in which to hold the victims, a place for executing the prisoners, and a method for disposing of the bodies. The prison was a large riverside warehouse, or godown, belonging to the Pakistan National Oil Company, the place of execution was the river edge, or the shallows near the shore, and the bodies were disposed of by the simple means of permitting them to float downstream. The killing took place night after night. Usually the prisoners were roped together and made to wade out into the river. They were in batches of six or eight, and in the light of a powerful electric arc lamp, they were easy targets, black against the silvery water. The executioners stood on the pier, shooting down at the compact bunches of prisoners wading in the water. There were screams in the hot night air, and then silence. The prisoners fell on their sides and their bodies lapped against the shore. Then a new bunch of prisoners was brought out, and the process was repeated. In the morning the village boatmen hauled the bodies into midstream and the ropes binding the bodies were cut so that each body drifted separately downstream......"
 
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Yawn. This is a Kashmiri thread not a Bangladeshi one, lets not forget the Partition Massacres, but that would dereail thread. Stick to the topic.
 
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As Zaki said, I live in UK but have to Azad Kashmir many times:)My family live in AJK, and have done for generations. I think I have some relatives in Jammu but they were disconnected due to seperation:(And indianrabbit, I said this was not a argue thread, post your opinions on another thread or make one, If I wanted I could rebutt your post and turn this into an arguement but that defeats the point of the thread.

Yeah, we need a Kashmiri flag on this foum unfortunatly I am not good at gfx.

@Patriot thanks for replying. I think I've seen civ post on here, not sure about Dabong.
 
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Yeah, we need a Kashmiri flag on this foum unfortunatly I am not good at gfx.

@Patriot thanks for replying. I think I've seen civ post on here, not sure about Dabong.

but why you need Kashmiri flag if you are willing to stay with Pakistan and consider yourself a Pakistani only?

Use the flag of Pakistan instead - like the way you are using
 
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