Kafir concept

[Kaniska]

Hindus are ?
Hindus lol
Mushrik
Only those Hindus are kafirs who actually know what Islam is but still reject this message
while all others who has no knowledge of Islam are Mushrik/idol worshipper/polytheists/non muslims etc

Friends, i am getting conflicting answer...In a layman term, I respect Islam..like some asepcts of the religion. But i am a practicing Hindu...Does that mean, i will not be allowed equality in the world of Islam?

Please help us to understand in simple language rather than referring to your Holy books.

 

[Proudpakistaniguy]

Friends, i am getting conflicting answer...In a layman term, I respect Islam..like some asepcts of the religion. But i am a practicing Hindu...Does that mean, i will not be allowed equality in the world of Islam?

Please help us to understand in simple language rather than referring to your Holy books.

I have not got your questions about " Equality in the world of Islam" beause there is no such things as equality even among Muslims. Some Muslims are more closer to Allah than others which all depend on how much they love and obey their creator and his messenger. Its very much like relationship of parent and children. Parent love those childen more who obey and respect them as compare to those who go against theeir wishes

 

[Indus Pakistan]

i will not be allowed equality in the world of Islam?

No. It's that simple. And quite self evident. No religion will attribute equality on on believers as that very suggestion will undo it's own standing. In the Christian theology only Christians matter. In Judaism only Jews matter. Religions are exclusive. They preach on the basis that they hold the right path.

 

[Azadkashmir]

and Muslims have to fight against Kafir ?
literally and just their beliefs ?



Laws of land or religion ?

all Muslims have to fight or just the police and law department ?

This is kafir the money lender the usurer.

 

[Wolfhunter]

No. It's that simple. And quite self evident. No religion will attribute equality on on believers as that very suggestion will undo it's own standing. In the Christian theology only Christians matter. In Judaism only Jews matter. Religions are exclusive. They preach on the basis that they hold the right path.

Best post in the entire thread.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

I am inclined to muse over the Justice Munir Commission Report of 1953. Asked the simple question by the commission as to what exactly is definition of a Muslim, dozen of the most leading mullahs gave exactly dozen differant definitions. The commission made the telling observation that if the definition of any one Mullah was accepted by the state rest of the eleven Mullahs would be declared as heretics. And even more telling that if all the definitions were accepted it would mean all the Mullahs being declared as heretics. There would be no Muslims left.

@KediKesenFare @Wolfhunter @Sher Shah Awan @Cybernetics

Source: https://books.google.de/books?id=I2Wz4HEoOgYC&lpg=PA88&hl=de&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

The definition of being a Muslim and the definition of being a kafir are depending on the fundamental definition of Islam itself ultimately, which is quite ironic if you think about it. Two things that ought to be the opposite of each other are being defined by the same set of rules (Islam).

However, every religion claims the truth. So, basically, every non-believer could be considered as kafir. But this is not an unique character of Islam. For instance, in the eyes of the majority of the orthodox Jews, we non-Jews (goyim) are kuffar too.

As a Muslim we know, that it all depends on one's religious attitude towards kuffar. If you accept that even non-believers can do good deeds that Allah is demanding from us humans (such as supporting the poor, preserving the nature, exploring the creation of Allah etc.), the concept of kuffar changes dramatically.

Theoretically, a kafir could do more good deeds in his life than a sinful Muslim who harms the society he lives in. A kafir who helps Muslims and a Muslim who hurts other Muslims cannot be treated equally, hence, I choose Ibn Arabi's approach.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Source: https://books.google.de/books?id=I2Wz4HEoOgYC&lpg=PA88&hl=de&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

The definition of being a Muslim and the definition of being a kafir are depending on the fundamental definition of Islam itself ultimately, which is quite ironic if you think about it. Two things that ought to be the opposite of each other are being defined by the same set of rules (Islam).

However, every religion claims the truth. So, basically, every non-believer could be considered as kafir. But this is not an unique character of Islam. For instance, in the eyes of the majority of the orthodox Jews, we non-Jews (goyim) are kuffar too.

As a Muslim we know, that it all depends on one's religious attitude towards kuffar. If you accept that even non-believers can do good deeds that Allah is demanding from us humans (such as supporting the poor, preserving the nature, exploring the creation of Allah etc.), the concept of kuffar changes dramatically.

Theoretically, a kafir could do more good deeds in his life than a sinful Muslim who harms the society he lives in. A kafir who helps Muslims and a Muslim who hurts other Muslims cannot be treated equally, hence, I choose Ibn Arabi's approach.

Kedi, I really like reading your posts. I often think of quiting PDF because of the lack of fine thinking and run way retardness but then there are gems like you here. I think I am on the same wavelength as you. I have done lot of thinking about life and it's fundamental nature. Having been brought up in the West and quite adapt at it - the moment I walk out of my door I always try to fit into the wider society. But and this is the vital thing to keep in mind. Take away the gloss on my exterior I have a certain way of thinking. In my private life I am vastly differant from my neighbours. Lot of that has been informed by my Pakistan heritage and significant part of that has been informed by Islam.

I don't drink. I have on few occasions in my earlier times tested it but did not like it. It went against my acquired nature and I felt bad about drinking. The way I look at my parents, at my family is I think heavily informed by Islam. The problem with Western civilization and there is a lot going for it. I am not prone to complaining about because it has provided a lot to our world but I think it has lost something. It has turned people into mere consumer/producer. That has created a society empty of something. People are lost in the race of acquiring and working. Family as a basis of society has fractured. Increasingly human extistence is atomized.

However what I worry is the misuse of Islam in our time for political purposes. all too often Islam as just become a tool to leverage some benefit from. Or something to go around lecturing others. That is a tragedy.

 

[Pakistani E]

I am inclined to muse over the Justice Munir Commission Report of 1953. Asked the simple question by the commission as to what exactly is definition of a Muslim, dozen of the most leading mullahs gave exactly dozen differant definitions. The commission made the telling observation that if the definition of any one Mullah was accepted by the state rest of the eleven Mullahs would be declared as heretics. And even more telling that if all the definitions were accepted it would mean all the Mullahs being declared as heretics. There would be no Muslims left.

@KediKesenFare @Wolfhunter @Sher Shah Awan @Cybernetics

I always leave the edicts of kufr to the theologians and clerics. I can never understand why as a layman, I would ever consider the personal belief of others as something that would affect me.

All religious and even political, social ideologies etc consider themselves to have the answer to whatever question is being presented. There is honestly no way of knowing who is right or wrong at a universal level until death or day of judgement, depending on your personal belief, or maybe never.

People should concentrate on themselves and take whatever path they think will make them better humans. As long as they cause no harm to others, they are my equals.

 

[El Sidd]

Yes. People who do not are not followers of Abrahamic religions called kafirs. And no Muslims are not supposed to "fight" against kafirs. In times of conflict however war can be declared against other states/groups through Islamic legislation.

I am going to troll you.

Religious discussions are not allowed but since this thread is blessed as the kufars lol its flourishing.

Did God only speak to Abraham? Literalists may agree.

But god 'spoke' to those before Abraham as well. But God blessed Abraham with responsibilities and thus abraham is respect.

Kafir is those who negate or negated. Negated to what?

Gods words. Anyone who negates the Quran as not the literal word of god is a kafir as per basic core islamic logic.

Quranic definitions of words like Kafir Mushrik Munafiq Yahoud Nasara and Muslim are pretty damn clear.

The OP should have read before he asked as per the golden rule divinely given as first words given to Mohammad. Read ! Iqra

@WebMaster religious discussions are not allowed. @waz close this thread