JF-17/FC-1 Thunder Fighter

[Adux]

Stuck in Sichuan: Pakistani JF-17 Program Grounded
Posted 25-Jan-2007 09:02
Related stories: Asia - Central, Asia - China, Asia - India, Engines - Aircraft, Events, Fighters & Attack, New Systems Tech, Northrop-Grumman, Partnerships & Consortia, Russia
Also on this day: 25-Jan-2007 »

FC-1/ JF-17
(click to view full)The military world has no shortage of irony. The defense industry has its moments too, as Pakistan just discovered. An aircraft whose development was driven by military sanctions from the US and Europe is now derailed by military sanctions. This leaves the Pakistani Air Force dependent on an alternative from... America. Meanwhile, the Chinese are left with no export launch customer for a plane they may now have to reluctantly buy themselves, instead of the favoured and more capable J-10. Somewhere in Delhi, champagne is pouring - but first, a bit of background.

The JF-17/FC-1 is a sub-$20 million fighter designed as a co-operative venture between Pakistan and China to replace F-7P (MiG-21+) and Mirage 3/5 aircraft in Pakistan's fleet. China also has options to produce them, but has made no firm decisions and seems unenthusiastic. It's a comparable peer for India's still-under-development LCA Tejas, Taiwan's ****-1 Ching Kuo fighters, and South Korea's T/A-50 Golden Eagle supersonic trainer & light fighter. Sino Defense reminds us that the JF-17/FC-1 'Xiaolong' has a long history...


Chinese J-7E
(click to view full)The site recalls that China signed a $550 million agreement with Grumman in 1986 to modernise its J-7 fighter (MiG-21 copy) under the "Super-7" upgrade project, with US and British firms competing to provide the engine and avionics. The project was canceled after the Tienanmen Square massacre, but Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation managed to continue the programme with its own resources, and the project was re-branded as FC-1 (Fighter China-1). US sanctions related to Pakistan's nuclear program and Chinese-Pakistani use of ballistic missile components led Pakistan to seek helps from its Chinese ally. A joint development and production agreement was signed in June 1999, with China Aviation Import and Export Corporation (CATIC) and Pakistan each contributing 50% of the estimated $150 million development costs.

The Pakistan Government had hoped to sign a deal to acquire 150 JF-17/FC-1 fighters in 2007, with 8 aircraft in service by year's end. China had reportedly even bought 100 Klimov RD-93 engines from Russia for installing on JF-17s, with an option to contract another 400 engines.

There's only one problem: Russia has just refused permission for the transfer of its RD-93 engines, derived from the RD-33 that equips the MiG-29. The decision comes only a few days after a visit to India by Russia's Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Sergei Ivanov, during which a number of joint defense projects were discussed and agreements were signed. These include the MRTA transport aircraft, and reportedly a "5th generation fighter" project, even as the MiG-29OVT/MiG-35 is touted as the likely winner of the multi-billion MRCA fighter contract.


PAF F-16A drops Mk.82s
(click to view full)Coincidence? Not a chance. Replacement with another engine? Unless it's a very close copy, that requires re-work of the entire fighter design and takes years. Just ask the J-10 project team.

Bottom line? Pakistan's ongoing F-16 fleet upgrade and expansion program with the USA has just become much more important - giving the USA a larger lever to use over Pakistani behaviour vis-a-vis Afghanistan, al-Qaeda, et. al.

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com...akistani-jf17-program-grounded/index.php#more

 

[Neo]

Dude, this is old news and there's still no official news from the Chinese or Pak government.

We've been over this in length already.

 

[Adux]

Well, THe third party in this the Russian Government, who supplies the engines, have announced they wont, so it is an official news

 

[Neo]

As far as I remeber Moscow didn't forbid the sale but asked China to respect the EULA, there's a difference.

I'm still convinced that its all a PR stunt to keep India happy and go for the Mig-29OVT MRCA deal.

 

[Adux]

As far as I remeber Moscow didn't forbid the sale but asked China to respect the EULA, there's a difference.

I'm still convinced that its all a PR stunt to keep India happy and go for the Mig-29OVT MRCA deal.

maybe, but defence and prime ministers dont do PR stunts, its always the lower rung of the beaurcracy. In the article they have explictly stated that engines wont be allowed to be exported, So it confirms,

 

[Neo]

Wait till the MRCA deal is signed within six months, we need RD-93 much later than that.

 

[Cheetah786]

Well, THe third party in this the Russian Government, who supplies the engines, have announced they wont, so it is an official news

Adux when ever India finally decides to buy those 126 fighters.And the contract is signed.then this game will really heat up.
and what good has come out of this is that Chinese have started working on there own engine for j-10.and in the long run thats excellent news.short term pains long term gains.but by denying china russia is also alienating china.like it or not india is moving towards usa.i wonder whom uncle putin will wanna piss off.

but from the same indian website you getting this from i also get this.

Pakistan's recent November 2006 purchase of 500 AIM-120C AMRAAM missiles is creating counterpressure on the subcontinent, and reportedly has India looking for 120km BVRAAMs (Beyond Visual Range Air-Air Missiles). Missiles with this notional head-on range would far outstrip the 60km of the AIM-120C, and even the 60-90km (36-54 miles) reported for the Russian AA-12/R-77 'AMRAAMski' that India already deploys. Indeed, this figure would be closer to the ramjet-powered Meteor under development via MBDA.

"There are moves also to start indigenous development of such long-range missiles by DRDO with possible foreign collaboration," a DRDO source reportedly said.

Indian defense procurement is full of announcements and 'confirmed' purchases that end up wildly late, or lose in limbo

(funny how if it isn't a Muslims country every thing even though admitted foreign help is indigenous. )

 

[Adux]

if you are waiting for Indian babu's to to sign the MMRCA, its going to be atleast another 3-4 years...Tough luck
Please dont shoot the messenger, .

We have a thread on missiles, lets take it there, I am not the greatest FAN of DRDO,

 

[Keysersoze]

I have read through a report that the alternate engine is going through it's first test phases. It can be used within a year and if needed it can be used if Pak needs it in a hurry. (unlikely) year and a half for full testing. So the delay is almost nothing in real terms. The airframes would probably not even be ready before the engines are there....

 

[Neo]

Thanks Keyser, thats is exactly the case. :thumbsup:

 

[HAIDER]

I am waiting for 23 March...much dust will be cleared by then. If no JF17 on March 23rd, then its in trouble.
Well, their is possibility, Moscow won t provide engine to Pakistan, because India has already sign production of mig 29 engines.
I would say its 50/50 chances.

 

[kidwaibhai]

I have read through a report that the alternate engine is going through it's first test phases. It can be used within a year and if needed it can be used if Pak needs it in a hurry. (unlikely) year and a half for full testing. So the delay is almost nothing in real terms. The airframes would probably not even be ready before the engines are there....

where did u read this. i would really want to know :flag:

 

[Adux]

I am waiting for 23 March...much dust will be cleared by then. If no JF17 on March 23rd, then its in trouble.
Well, their is possibility, Moscow won t provide engine to Pakistan, because India has already sign production of mig 29 engines.
I would say its 50/50 chances.

You would definitly see a JF-17 on march 23, but that doesnt mean it got the engine. It can be brought for the parade from China and then Flown back

 

[melb4aust]

You would definitly see a JF-17 on march 23, but that doesnt mean it got the engine. It can be brought for the parade from China and then Flown back

Well then my friend this thread "JF-17 program grounded" does'nt make any sense, if its grounded, why the hell are they gonna fly the bird on 23 march then,

I would have to say, use this :stupid:

Accept one thing either, "grounded" or its gonna "fly on 23rd march"....... simple

 

[Adux]

heheh melby....wats up

The person who article , gave that title///not me