Japan offers to fund 81% of India's first bullet train worth $15 billion

[Rangila]

You missed a simple thing. Flights need atleast 45 mins pre checkin.... so overall total time would be more or less same.

People do not catch their trains right on the dot. They come 20-30 minutes early at the station which is the norm too.

 

[cloud_9]

Try buying a return airline ticket for tomorrow on the Mumbai-Ahmadabad sector and let me know how much it costs. The 1400- 2000 figure that you quoted can only be availed if you book at least a month in advance. If you need to travel in the next couple of days, Mumbai-Ahmadabad return flight would cost you no less than Rs 8000. Mind you this sector is not meant for tourists, where you can plan your travel 2-3 months in advance. The bulk of the traffic on this sector as I mentioned earlier, will be businessman and traders who need to travel regularly and on a short notice. Thats when the slightly expensive, but quick, reliable, comfortable and sure shot high speed rail service comes into the picture.

It is a huge $15 Billion project, and has only been the green signal after proper feasibility studies were conducted by both the parties. I don't think JICA or HSRC needs random nincompoops on the internet to tell them whether this project is economically feasible or not. The project once again, was initiated by the UPA government and has nothing to do with Modi or the BJP who has one only been in power for one, so you can shove that anti Modi vitriol.

Easy on the shoving bit ,Cowboy!
Ignoring your political diatribe.....have you read the feasibility studies ? Here's are the extracts from the JICA study.

The proposed Mumbai-Ahmedabad high-speed corridor is estimated to cost Rs98,805 crore and the one-way fare will work out to Rs2,800, about one-and-a-half times the cost of a first-class AC ticket of the Rajdhani Express on the same route.

The Japanese team working on its feasibility study has worked out its “fare box revenue” model, according to which the bullet train fare will be just one-and-a-half times more than the AC-I fares of other trains on the same route.

As per the team’s estimates, about 40,000 people are going to use the corridor every day by 2023 — when the bullet train service is expected to begin. The AC-1 fares for this sector in 2023 would serve as the reference for the bullet train fares.

The study found that pricing the tickets any higher would make the flights a more attractive option, and any lower would not support the maximum revenue generation. By keeping the fares low, the bullet train will be able to steer clear of a fare war with airlines, while also retaining the existing business of higher-class railway travel.

Being a nincompoop,I can't understand why are they basing their fare on a regular AC-1 ticket which is already subsidised and the investment is way less .I thought the ticket price should be based on the HSR investment figure?

For time being we will ignore the fact that the funding will be in Yen and Inflation will be in the green.

 

[anant_s]

why are they basing their fare on a regular AC-1 ticket which is already subsidised and the investment is way less .I thought the ticket price should be based on the HSR investment figure?

I think one key point here is the timeframe. 2023.
While we do not know how much the project is going to cost when completed, it is also true that airfares would also have gone up by 2023.
Another point, which i believe should be looked into is the fact that a lot of business travellers use road (NH 8), some of whom can be attracted to HST.
Ultimately it boils down to how many people having budget for one way travel in range of 2500-3500 will find HST option attractive and given growth of cities like Surat, Vadodara en route will also decide how much patronage these trains will get.
I'm not very sure of other locations, but given its length and passenger traffic potential, Mumbai Ahemdabad might be the best place to start such a highly capital intensive project.

 

[cloud_9]

I think one key point here is the timeframe. 2023.
While we do not know how much the project is going to cost when completed, it is also true that airfares would also have gone up by 2023.
Another point, which i believe should be looked into is the fact that a lot of business travellers use road (NH 8), some of whom can be attracted to HST.
Ultimately it boils down to how many people having budget for one way travel in range of 2500-3500 will find HST option attractive and given growth of cities like Surat, Vadodara en route will also decide how much patronage these trains will get.
I'm not very sure of other locations, but given its length and passenger traffic potential, Mumbai Ahemdabad might be the best place to start such a highly capital intensive project.

I think the question was why are we using a normal rail ticket as a benchmark which costs less per km to build & operate;not ignoring the fact that the benchmark point is already heavily subsidised ?Wouldn't the ticket be inheritingly subsidised ? Rail fares go up on the whims of the government and has no relevance to the running cost of Railways and we will be using that as our benchmark to regulate HSR ticket pricing.

Do you really believe HSR is only 1.5 times more expensive to build and operate than slow speed trains ?

 

[anant_s]

Do you really believe HSR is only 1.5 times more expensive to build and operate than slow speed trains ?

not really.
it would be naive to believe so.
One disconcerting thing about that 98000 crore value is a perspective that entire Western an Eastern Dedicated freight corridors with a combined length of 3000 kms+ is going to cost somewhere in range of 45000 crores. the project is expected to breakeven in 14 years.
In times when IR is facing heavy budgetary crunch, i'm not sure even with a soft loan, it actually is a right priority issue.

 

[cloud_9]

not really.
it would be naive to believe so.
One disconcerting thing about that 98000 crore value is a perspective that entire Western an Eastern Dedicated freight corridors with a combined length of 3000 kms+ is going to cost somewhere in range of 45000 crores. the project is expected to breakeven in 14 years.
In times when IR is facing heavy budgetary crunch, i'm not sure even with a soft loan, it actually is a right priority issue.

The only time it makes sense is,if you have $4 trillion just lying around in your FX reserves .

 

[dilipkumarlova69]

silly bhakts

 

[HariPrasad]

Ki

People here are quoting 0.5pc interest. Technically there are right. But you need to understand the loan is in dollar terms. There is the volatility of the currency markets to take into account. Therefore the money is hedged against currency fluctuations whose cost can be as high as 5pc.

Believe me rupee is going to be strengthen in long term.

 

[dilipkumarlova69]

Believe me rupee is going to be strengthen in long term.

not happening

 

[vayudoot]

Well waise to i love if it will run in delhi Mumbai coze i live in Delhi. But the fact is this if AMD-MUM (550km)cost $15 billion then think how much del-mum cost

40 Billion

 

[Post Colonnial]

Thank you Japan....Hopefully in the process, we will learn how to maintain clean public facilities, safe trains and courteous behavior. More than the funding, we can learn these traits from the Japanese.

 

[Agent_47]

Preliminary work on the above mentioned corridors has already begun.
View attachment 279050
http://www.dfccil.gov.in/upload/DFCCI_Annual_Report_2013_2014.pdf

In joint statement with Japan said they will fund next DFC which will be chennai - banglalore for around $5.5 billion.
(No goa)

 

[raktaka]

I think the question was why are we using a normal rail ticket as a benchmark which costs less per km to build & operate;not ignoring the fact that the benchmark point is already heavily subsidised ?Wouldn't the ticket be inheritingly subsidised ? Rail fares go up on the whims of the government and has no relevance to the running cost of Railways and we will be using that as our benchmark to regulate HSR ticket pricing.

Do you really believe HSR is only 1.5 times more expensive to build and operate than slow speed trains ?

LOL........ what kind of moron comes with this weird logic ?

How does it matter if the Indian Railway ticket is subsidised ? the HSR ticket will not be subsidised and that is the only thing that matter

 

[HariPrasad]

Delhi - Mumbai would be better.

Won't solve any purpose if connecting Mumbai Ahemdabad.

No this city route shall have India's 1st 3rd and 5th or 6th largest city in GDP by the time it comes in.

 

[trident2010]

Good news ! Once this project is completed and data comes through, then other cities can be added.
What India need is an extensive coverage of fast trains (200Kmph+).