Japan imposes sanctions against Russia under US pressure — Tokyo Governor

[Raphael]

The enemy of my enemy is my friend. For Japan, China is a rotting corpse, and the smell is already spreading into all directions. To contain Chinese aggression, Japan has to ally with US and Russia at the same time. It is a complex relationship but Japan knows what they are doing. They will be independent power alongside Turkey.

No matter how many times you get banned, it seems you still refuse to take the mod's advice and get the psychotherapy you need. Now you're projecting your schizophrenic delusions on China. In reality, Turkey is the rotting kebab. It sold itself out like the cheapest whore, allows American nukes to be stationed in its country (think of them as Americans' phallus), and still can't even leverage any of its concessions or influence to join the EU .

Now that Kurdistan is emerging and solidifying, at USA's great approval, Turkey's usefulness as America's pawn and regional foothold is totally over. USA will always prefer white Indo-Aryan speaking countries to nomads, whenever possible. USA will wholeheartedly support Kurdistan ripping off Turkey's eastern provinces, and then the ISIS that Turkey ironically created and supported will finish off the remaining rump state at USA's quiet behest, because USA will want to redirect ISIS' attention away from KSA and oil-produces areas of Iraq. I'm afraid your fortrified yurts won't be able to repel ISIS this time, just like a millenia ago when their ancestors forced your ancestors to stop worshiping Tengri, become their slave, and worship their Allah.

edit: spoke too soon, banned again.

 

[Aepsilons]

Guys, let's get back on track.

@TaiShang , I'll give you a reply this afternoon. After work

 

[mike2000]

You have over-calculated the situation here....It's all about mentality of Japanese people....They have stood united and productive when their is call from their Nation( A thing which everyone should learn from Japanese)...Right now ppl don't think their is need to get ride of USA but when they realize it then it will happen in no time....Japanese r good with innovation and the nation who innovate is powerful enough to raise against all odds.
It's just the Hirshima and Nagasaki incident which is hunting them....but no fear last long.

well said bro, i agree with some of your points. but i disagree with most

Japan is not going to get rid of the U.S anytime soon. In fact the Japanese people in large are favorable for U.S troops/military bases remaining in their country. So i disagree with your point that 'Right now ppl don't think there is need to get rid of USA but when they realize it then it will happen in no time'. Are you joking? So you think right now Japanese people are naive/stupid? what makes you think soon they will REALIZE they dont need the U.S?lool I dont see any reason to believe they are naive/stupid in wanting the U.S today but not wanting them tomorrow.

The thing is, Japan doesnt have a choice anyway, I have to remind you that its not as if Japan choosed to have troops on its soil or be surbodinate to the U.S. Its Japan who started the war in Asia, so of course after loosing the U.S occupied them, in fact the U.S has been quite lenient towards Japan, and has helped rebuilt Japan after the war. Imagine Russia/China had been the one to occupy Japan after the war, do you think Japan will be as propserous as it is today? Also the U.S spared many Japanese war criminals(even the emperor who was the head/leader of Nazi Japan akin to Hitler) who should have been executed at point blank. Also the U.S didnt de Nazify Japan like it did with Germany, so war crimes denial wasnt outlawed/criminalised like in Germany. So instead Japan should be thankful to the U.S, im sure many Japanese people know this, thats why they are so supportive of the U.S

So Russia and China can keep on whinning all they want, Japan will remain under the U.S for a long long time to come. Russia and China will efectively be contained by Japan-U.S alliance.

 

[senheiser]

its funny how he considers south korea more of a military thread than Russia

Japan has the tech, Japan has the economy, Japan has geography and allies IMHO.

What does China have? Nothing IMHO. Economy is slowing down while 80% of the country is living off couple of bucks per day. Rapidly aging population. No allies in the region. Biting the hand that feeds them and biting the hand that buys cheap crap.

It is obvious Japan will be the victor on the long term. Probably China will start a war or it will quite buckle and split up in multiple smaller states. There is no way I see which China can save itself from this path. All production is leaving China. Chinese had their best time IMHO.

GDP per capita, PPP (current international $) | Data | Graph

chinas gdp per capita is a third of japan now and will soon surpass turkey

 

[kolinsky]

its funny how he considers south korea more of a military thread than Russia

chinas gdp per capita is a third of japan now and will soon surpass turkey

Thanks for Abe, 3 year before, our gdp per capita is 1/6 of japan.

 

[kolinsky]

well said bro, i agree with some of your points. but i disagree with most

Japan is not going to get rid of the U.S anytime soon. In fact the Japanese people in large are favorable for U.S troops/military bases remaining in their country. So i disagree with your point that 'Right now ppl don't think there is need to get rid of USA but when they realize it then it will happen in no time'. Are you joking? So you think right now Japanese people are naive/stupid? what makes you think soon they will REALIZE they dont need the U.S?lool I dont see any reason to believe they are naive/stupid in wanting the U.S today but not wanting them tomorrow.

The thing is, Japan doesnt have a choice anyway, I have to remind you that its not as if Japan choosed to have troops on its soil or be surbodinate to the U.S. Its Japan who started the war in Asia, so of course after loosing the U.S occupied them, in fact the U.S has been quite lenient towards Japan, and has helped rebuilt Japan after the war. Imagine Russia/China had been the one to occupy Japan after the war, do you think Japan will be as propserous as it is today? Also the U.S spared many Japanese war criminals(even the emperor who was the head/leader of Nazi Japan akin to Hitler) who should have been executed at point blank. Also the U.S didnt de Nazify Japan like it did with Germany, so war crimes denial wasnt outlawed/criminalised like in Germany. So instead Japan should be thankful to the U.S, im sure many Japanese people know this, thats why they are so supportive of the U.S

So Russia and China can keep on whinning all they want, Japan will remain under the U.S for a long long time to come. Russia and China will efectively be contained by Japan-U.S alliance.

He is not joking. If you know the history of Japan, get rid of U.S. is the first step, the second step is *** kicking phase. When Japan find they overcomes U.S., they will attack U.S. This story happened thousand time in japanese history. That is their mentation. U.S. has to keep strong, otherwise japs are who draw a point to U.S. era with no mercy.

Although I donot believe Japan will start wars in the future. From all statistics, starting war is not a choice before 2020, because japs are not prepared from troops to ammunition. And after 2020, there is no change for japs to win a war against China. All in all, japs defence industry is malformed. it costs at least 20 year to rebuild. The glory of empire was and is month in the water.

 

[mike2000]

Japan has the tech, Japan has the economy, Japan has geography and allies IMHO.

What does China have? Nothing IMHO. Economy is slowing down while 80% of the country is living off couple of bucks per day. Rapidly aging population. No allies in the region. Biting the hand that feeds them and biting the hand that buys cheap crap.

It is obvious Japan will be the victor on the long term. Probably China will start a war or it will quite buckle and split up in multiple smaller states. There is no way I see which China can save itself from this path. All production is leaving China. Chinese had their best time IMHO.

Bro im pro Japan myself. But dont you think you are overeacting/emotional?
Lets be realistic and not let our emotions take over us. Its true Japan has the tech(though it has been severely damaged these past decade by south Korea, Taiwan and China to some extent and it seems it will keep getting worst in coming years if Japan doesnt take appropriate measures).

China kight slow down giving it has been growing over 10% now for over 3 decades. However, this slow down isnt really a slow down for any major country in todays world. Many will still die for that growth rate. As i said before in another thread, The main problem for us in the west/Japan with China is that China is not the U.S.S.R , nor is it Japan in the 80s(when it was 'rising'), nor is it Germany. China main advantage is its huge population/market//landmass/resources as well. With its demand/market alone, it can form the largest companies in the world(bigger than even U.S ones) even if they are not operating in other countries. So this gives them ample resources/economic of scale to invest more in R&D and subsequently improve their products which with time can start competing globally. This is the main reason why our companies in the west/Japan/South Korea etc keep rushing/pleadingm to invest in China despite all the talk of manufacturing moving out of China and bla bla bla. Businessmen dont care about Politics or democracies or allies bullshit, they will invest anywhere they think will give them the best ROI. So im afraid China will keep drawing FDI/companies worldwide.

Also China is still relatively poor/low gdpper capital. So this gives them huge room for growth., In fact they havent even reached half their potential to be honest, yet they are already the world largest importer(and will overtake the U.S in 2-3 years from now). So in this regard its difficult for us to contain them. since we also make lots of money with our business there. We would even try sanctioning them~(even lightly) economically like we did with Russia( since the stakes/interdependence are just too high). So this complicates matters. So no unfortunately for us, China wont collapse, slow down a bit they may(which every country does at some point), but they wont collapse. They will keep growing at a healthy rate though say 6% in coming years/decades, since they still have quite alot of catch up to do economically/gdp per capital wise before they can reach their true potential like Japan did over 2 decades ago. Japan has reached its peak, im even impressed with its rate of growth, since being so developed/high gdp per capital, it still manages to grow at 1-2% which is an achievement by itself. China will find it difficult to grow at such rates when they reached Japans development level.

By the way are you Turkish? I have been to Instabul, its a magnificent city. with great history/culture. Turkey is one of the few muslim/middle eastern countries i admire, due its strive for industrialisation/self reliance/moderate islam. Kudos to Turkish people.

 

[Aepsilons]

Reading this thread, I can't help but see the concern about a militarization of the Asia-Pacific region. Militarization is a natural phenomena and shouldn't been seen in unkind light when in regards to Japan. After-all , Japan has not conducted or shown any ambitions that would demonstrate hegemonic designs. Ours is a merely defensive nature. Japan's defense expenditure is one of the lowest in the world, statistically speaking, only 0.9% of our GDP goes towards national defense. There's nothing to be alarmed about. It's not like Japan enacted a law that raised defense expenditure to say 4-5% of the GDP.

Come on ladies and gents, let's be pragmatic.

@TaiShang ,

Thank you for this:

Yes, I agree with you that normalization seems to be the general consensus, and as we see greater economic cooperation, we can hope for more political rapprochement. I would also like to say that Prime Minister Abe had conducted a cabinet reshuffling leading to appointment of 5 women to the cabinet, as well as more individuals who have a pro-China approach. We can expect a greater policies that will be considerate of the Chinese sensibilities and hopefully, we can move past these minor squabbles. China remains integral to Japanese economy, and tho I have my particular reservations on Chinese policies (more so territorial issues), in general, I do see China in a positive light.

These articles are a worthy read:

Japan's Shinzo Abe appoints pro-China MPs in bid to mend fences with Beijing | World news | theguardian.com

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/03/japan-politics-idUSL3N0R40A820140903

 

[kolinsky]

Reading this thread, I can't help but see the concern about a militarization of the Asia-Pacific region. Militarization is a natural phenomena and shouldn't been seen in unkind light when in regards to Japan. After-all , Japan has not conducted or shown any ambitions that would demonstrate hegemonic designs. Ours is a merely defensive nature. Japan's defense expenditure is one of the lowest in the world, statistically speaking, only 0.9% of our GDP goes towards national defense. There's nothing to be alarmed about. It's not like Japan enacted a law that raised defense expenditure to say 4-5% of the GDP.

Come on ladies and gents, let's be pragmatic.

That is not true, Japan's defense expenditure is once more than 1% of GDP.

If Japan want to be seen in a kind light, just tell Abe, donot show off his war criminal grand father in law. I mean may be U.S. is not 100% right in the ww2, but logically you cannot say japs are right. It is impossible for Angel Merkel to say her grand pa is a huge hitler fan, Just stop this stupidity.

I

 

[Aepsilons]

That is not true, Japan's defense expenditure is once more than 1% of GDP.

The defense expenditure of Japan remains lower than 1% of the total GDP of the nation. It fluctuates , but it remains at this level. There is actually a constitutional clause that specifically states that Japan's defense expenditure is to remain less than 1% of the GDP. In extreme circumstances, the defense expenditure may be increased to 3%, and during war time, it may be increased to as high as 5% of the GDP. Japan is not at war now, and considering that it has remained largely a power for peace and development for the last 70 some years, it will remain so.

 

[kolinsky]

The defense expenditure of Japan remains lower than 1% of the total GDP of the nation. It fluctuates , but it remains at this level. There is actually a constitutional clause that specifically states that Japan's defense expenditure is to remain less than 1% of the GDP. In extreme circumstances, the defense expenditure may be increased to 3%, and during war time, it may be increased to as high as 5% of the GDP. Japan is not at war now, and considering that it has remained largely a power for peace and development for the last 70 some years, it will remain so.

That is not true, the japanese government challenged once to have more than 1% of the total GDP. For this challenging, Japan lost the turst.

The military expenditure of US is about to 4% for years. That is not a problem, but i donot believe Japan can set such a high military expenditure for the state debt sake. The problem is not how long it lasted, the problem is how much is japanese government willing. Due to abe, will you remain so??? that is a good question. If you say japanese people donot support the government, I will say I donot observe that.

 

[Aepsilons]

So Russia and China can keep on whinning all they want, Japan will remain under the U.S for a long long time to come. Russia and China will efectively be contained by Japan-U.S alliance.

The Japanese and American strategic alliance is alive and strong, despite what detractors might like to believe in this forum.
I actually served in the JMSDF and have trained with American sailors in many joint exercises, I can speak as a former military personnel that the level of professionalism and trust both Japanese and American servicemen have for each other is above par. True we were once rivals and enemies in the last Great War, but if History teaches us anything, yesterday's enemy can be one's best friend. For example during the American Revolutionary War of 1776-1781 and the American-British War of 1812, the United States saw the British as its number 1 existential threat, and feelings of anti-British sentiment was prevalent throughout the young republic, at the time. But now, through various partnerships together, Britain and America are an example of a cohesive and dynamic alliance system. The same goes for Japan and the United States. We worked with America during the Cold War, and we will continue to work with the Americans in the present and in the immediate to long term future -- in addressing any exigencies.

 

[mike2000]

Reading this thread, I can't help but see the concern about a militarization of the Asia-Pacific region. Militarization is a natural phenomena and shouldn't been seen in unkind light when in regards to Japan. After-all , Japan has not conducted or shown any ambitions that would demonstrate hegemonic designs. Ours is a merely defensive nature. Japan's defense expenditure is one of the lowest in the world, statistically speaking, only 0.9% of our GDP goes towards national defense. There's nothing to be alarmed about. It's not like Japan enacted a law that raised defense expenditure to say 4-5% of the GDP.

Come on ladies and gents, let's be pragmatic.

@TaiShang ,

Thank you for this:

Yes, I agree with you that normalization seems to be the general consensus, and as we see greater economic cooperation, we can hope for more political rapprochement. I would also like to say that Prime Minister Abe had conducted a cabinet reshuffling leading to appointment of 5 women to the cabinet, as well as more individuals who have a pro-China approach. We can expect a greater policies that will be considerate of the Chinese sensibilities and hopefully, we can move past these minor squabbles. China remains integral to Japanese economy, and tho I have my particular reservations on Chinese policies (more so territorial issues), in general, I do see China in a positive light.

I agree completely with you my friend Nihonji. Of course ideally, it will be good for East Asia to be United and live happily ever after.lol

However reality is different though. China and Russia are trying to stop what they consider western/U.S hegemonism/ kick the U.S out of Asia/Eastern europe and reduce U.S influence as much as possible worldwide. So of course the U.S having military bases in Eastern europe, Japan/south Korea/australia/philippines soon, will obviously rattle China and Russia and cause frictions(thats not mentioning the issues and problems China/Russia have with their neighbours.lol). So any talk of 'Asia/East Asia unity' is with all due respect all but laughable.

As a simple example, i will like to ask will Japan rather have the U.S as the dominant power/hegemon in Asia or have China as the leader in Asia? Of course im sure Japan and many other Asian countries will rather have a western Country/U.S as the dominant power/leader in Asia without any doubt.

So any talk of Asia unity/partnership is all but wishful thinking. I personally know the animosity you people have for each other. . I don't think that will change anytime soon. But i admire your thinking though.

 

[Aepsilons]

The military expenditure of US is about to 4% for years. That is not a problem, but i donot believe Japan can set such a high military expenditure for the state debt sake. The problem is not how long it lasted, the problem is how much is japanese government willing. Due to abe, will you remain so??? that is a good question. If you say japanese people donot support the government, I will say I donot observe that.

The United States is a global hyper power with interests and assets throughout the world, she fields the largest naval force the world has yet seen, so thus it necessitates the maintenance of a military expenditure of 4% of the GDP.

We Japanese have no designs of the like, so thus we merely maintain a respectable military expenditure of only 1% of the GDP. It is very small, only $60 billion per year. This is enough to meet our security needs as well as defense and patrol of our entire maritime border.

 

[mike2000]

The Japanese and American strategic alliance is alive and strong, despite what detractors might like to believe in this forum.
I actually served in the JMSDF and have trained with American sailors in many joint exercises, I can speak as a former military personnel that the level of professionalism and trust both Japanese and American servicemen have for each other is above par. True we were once rivals and enemies in the last Great War, but if History teaches us anything, yesterday's enemy can be one's best friend. For example during the American Revolutionary War of 1776-1781 and the American-British War of 1812, the United States saw the British as its number 1 existential threat, and feelings of anti-British sentiment was pervasive throughout the young republic, at the time. But now, through various partnerships together, Britain and America are an example of a cohesive and dynamic alliance system. The same goes for Japan and the United States. We worked with America during the Cold War, and we will continue to work with the Americans in the present and in the immediate to long term future -- in addressing any exigencies.

Wow, so you served in JMSDF? Never knew that. How old were you when you enroled? Kudos.

Yes i agree with your point. Yesterday ennemies can surely be tomorrows friends. But im not sure if this will apply to China and Japan anytime soon.lool
The U.S can do so since its a a multi cultural country and isn't homogenous. o the U.S isn't bound with emotional/historical baggage that the U.S unlike most Asian countries. so the U.S can easily make allies with even countries it suffered heavy wars/casualties with like Japan, Vietnam, Philippines etc.