J-35 Fighter Latest Video: Test flight progressing well! A major boost to the Chinese military

[beijingwalker]

J-35 Fighter Latest Video: Test flight progressing well! A major boost to the Chinese military​

 

[MirageBlue]

What are the odds that the PAF will want a J-35 based variant that is modified to not have the naval related design aspects like folding wing, heavier landing gear and arrestor hook?

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

What are the odds that the PAF will want a J-35 based variant that is modified to not have the naval related design aspects like folding wing, heavier landing gear and arrestor hook?

It depends on China and how much it wants to prioritize a land-based export variant of the J-35. I think it'd be a pretty big opportunity for them as they'd have the only real ITAR-free next-gen fighter option on the market. IMO a land-based J-35 would easily throw the doors open into the Algerian, Egyptian, Saudi, Emirati, Thai, and Pakistani markets.

 

[MirageBlue]

It depends on China and how much it wants to prioritize a land-based export variant of the J-35. I think it'd be a pretty big opportunity for them as they'd have the only real ITAR-free next-gen fighter option on the market. IMO a land-based J-35 would easily throw the doors open into the Algerian, Egyptian, Saudi, Emirati, Thai, and Pakistani markets.

To a great extent, the KF-21 Boramae will be more attractive to a lot of these nations, given that will not want to antagonise the Americans by going with a Chinese fighter. Many of the nations you've mentioned (Thailand, SA, Egypt) are already US markets and the Thai are actively looking to acquire some F-35 even though it is overkill for their needs.

Algeria is definitely going to be offered the Su-76 Checkmate. Pakistan remains the brightest potential customer for a J-35..

Tell me frankly do you really believe that Project Azm will be a clean sheet design with most if not all development done in Pakistan? Keep in mind that all 5th gen designs are costing billions of $ in development itself, leave aside acquisition. And so far nothing has been revealed in terms of a clean sheet design, for CFD analysis, FEM analysis, Wind tunnel testing (for which I believe no facilities exist in Pakistan) nor all the various programs that would be needed for stealth shaping, coatings, avionics, etc. There's no Iron bird type facility either, no landing gear testing facility, no anechoic chambers, no lightning test facility, etc..so all that needs to be set up from scratch. It will take decades AND cost a lot.

Which is why I am pretty sure that there will be a Pakistani variant of the J-35. Most likely under the name of Project Azm that's what'll be developed, with some Pakistani specific avionics and ejection seat.

I'm only bothering to debate with you since you're one of the more sensible chaps here. Far too many are simply not worth discussing anything with.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

To a great extent, the KF-21 Boramae will be more attractive to a lot of these nations, given that will not want to antagonise the Americans by going with a Chinese fighter. Many of the nations you've mentioned (Thailand, SA, Egypt) are already US markets and the Thai are actively looking to acquire some F-35 even though it is overkill for their needs.

Algeria is definitely going to be offered the Su-76 Checkmate. Pakistan remains the brightest potential customer for a J-35..

Tell me frankly do you really believe that Project Azm will be a clean sheet design with most if not all development done in Pakistan? Keep in mind that all 5th gen designs are costing billions of $ in development itself, leave aside acquisition. And so far nothing has been revealed in terms of a clean sheet design, for CFD analysis, FEM analysis, Wind tunnel testing (for which I believe no facilities exist in Pakistan) nor all the various programs that would be needed for stealth shaping, coatings, avionics, etc. There's no Iron bird type facility either, no landing gear testing facility, no anechoic chambers, no lightning test facility, etc..so all that needs to be set up from scratch. It will take decades AND cost a lot.

Which is why I am pretty sure that there will be a Pakistani variant of the J-35. Most likely under the name of Project Azm that's what'll be developed, with some Pakistani specific avionics and ejection seat.

I'm only bothering to debate with you since you're one of the more sensible chaps here. Far too many are simply not worth discussing anything with.

AZM is dead from what I understand.

The PAF will roll its NGFA requirement into an existing overseas project. So, what you say is a possibility. The only real options the PAF has are the J-35 and TFX/MMU.

 

[MastanKhan]

Tell me frankly do you really believe that Project Azm will be a clean sheet design with most if not all development done in Pakistan? Keep in mind that all 5th gen designs are costing billions of $ in development itself, leave aside acquisition. And so far nothing has been revealed in terms of a clean sheet design, for CFD analysis, FEM analysis, Wind tunnel testing (for which I believe no facilities exist in Pakistan) nor all the various programs that would be needed for stealth shaping, coatings, avionics, etc. There's no Iron bird type facility either, no landing gear testing facility, no anechoic chambers, no lightning test facility, etc..so all that needs to be set up from scratch. It will take decades AND cost a lot.

Which is why I am pretty sure that there will be a Pakistani variant of the J-35. Most likely under the name of Project Azm that's what'll be developed, with some Pakistani specific avionics and ejection seat.

I'm only bothering to debate with you since you're one of the more sensible chaps here. Far too many are simply not worth discussing anything with.

Hi,

Actually---the 5th gen are the easiest to design. You already have copies in front of you.

5th gen aircraft have very few design choices---for an optimal design---all 5th gen aircraft will look pretty much like the other aircraft with some on the fringe.

For the rest of the stuff---yes---that is not easy---takes a lots of resource.

That is why the Korean aircraft would stay as a 4.5 gen aircraft even though the design is 5th gen.

 

[MastanKhan]

J-35 Fighter Latest Video: Test flight progressing well! A major boost to the Chinese military​

Hi,

Very smart thing done by the chinese to keep focus on the J20 and delay the development of the J35 .

The J35 developed today will have tomorrow's EW package and weapons.

It would be far more advanced than what it would have been if it was developed earlier.

 

[PakAlp]

To a great extent, the KF-21 Boramae will be more attractive to a lot of these nations, given that will not want to antagonise the Americans by going with a Chinese fighter. Many of the nations you've mentioned (Thailand, SA, Egypt) are already US markets and the Thai are actively looking to acquire some F-35 even though it is overkill for their needs.

Algeria is definitely going to be offered the Su-76 Checkmate. Pakistan remains the brightest potential customer for a J-35..

Tell me frankly do you really believe that Project Azm will be a clean sheet design with most if not all development done in Pakistan? Keep in mind that all 5th gen designs are costing billions of $ in development itself, leave aside acquisition. And so far nothing has been revealed in terms of a clean sheet design, for CFD analysis, FEM analysis, Wind tunnel testing (for which I believe no facilities exist in Pakistan) nor all the various programs that would be needed for stealth shaping, coatings, avionics, etc. There's no Iron bird type facility either, no landing gear testing facility, no anechoic chambers, no lightning test facility, etc..so all that needs to be set up from scratch. It will take decades AND cost a lot.

Which is why I am pretty sure that there will be a Pakistani variant of the J-35. Most likely under the name of Project Azm that's what'll be developed, with some Pakistani specific avionics and ejection seat.

I'm only bothering to debate with you since you're one of the more sensible chaps here. Far too many are simply not worth discussing anything with.

Project AZM is most likely a variant of J35 because Pakistan doesn't have the technology/money to build a 5th generation jet from scratch. It will be similar to Jf17, a Pakistani spec jet, Pakistan will have the freedom to incorporate any types of weapons on it, similar to Jf17, weapons from Turkey and South Africa and some Pakistan made (if there are). If we think about it Turkey and China spent billions on their 5th generation project and how much has Pakistan spent? Next to nothing so far, if tomorrow Pakistan announces 10B AZM project then I would be excited.

Lucky for Pakistan we will have the TFX available, aswell as the Turkish MIUS unmanned jet. So one will be Chinese/Pak spec fighter and one western one. I would love the J20B with unmanned drones, it would be a deep strike offensive plane which we all want.

 

[PakFactor]

AZM is dead from what I understand.

The PAF will roll its NGFA requirement into an existing overseas project. So, what you say is a possibility. The only real options the PAF has are the J-35 and TFX/MMU.

@JamD and others in a sense confirm it’s dead the man power depleted basically.

 

[serenity]

I find it is unlikely for China to develop a land based J-35 just for export. It will costs a lot of time and money to modify the naval one to land based and PLAAF itself will probably not buy any because it will have much shorter range and less payload than J-20 as stealth aircraft and if taking weapons on wings then it is really throwing away its main expensive advantage.

J-10 makes sense as a low cost fighter because it is single engine. Engine factor makes up majority of operational expenses and readiness. Mig-29 was not much cheaper to operate than Su-27.

J-35 land based would have similar operational cost to J-20 but some are saying more modern subsystems due to being developed 10 years after J-20. Well no because J-20 is continuously upgraded even if designations don't reveal. Any technology subsystem that is worthwhile to change the assembly for it is done. Any that is not worthwhile of changing is not going to add so much capability to justify another line of 5th generation fighter. This is not a F-22 to F-35 comparison because the J-20 is constantly being built and has not had production stopped like F-22 which justifies the USAF for F-35. Besides that production stoppage of F-22, F-35 is actually single engine unlike a hypothetical J-35. So operational costs factor is totally different.

Furthermore, China has multiple 6th generation technology projects going different paths, the main manned 6th generation fighter project is all flying wing to reduce number of surfaces but geometry changes. There was one study that showed aspects on how the geometry changes for flight speeds and altitudes. Generally speaking it is aiming for something like below.

Satellite catching seemingly a single engine prototype.

Years ago on Chinese forums, totally variable geometry models were shown in very rough detail for studies on how changing shapes suit next generation. It of course requires advancements in engine. Some say combined cycle engine type of which China has tested many types of but those are more for hypersonic and space delivery systems rather than manned fighter which others insist means combined cycle isn't useful for fighter due to size and weight of engines or limited agility sacrificed for wide range of speeds. Therefore variable cycle engine like ADVENT is required before 6th gen. China's variable cycle engine projects are more secretive except to say and admit there are at least one project which everyone knows so how developed it is is totally unknown.

As the aim is to have 6th generation ready for low scale production before 2030, what is the point of J-35 for PLAAF?

As for other paths, the currently used is J-20S twinseater being a man in the loop for UCAVs such as Dark Sword and even strike type UCAVs such as GJ-11 and CH-7.

GJ-11 prototyping was done over a decade ago and flying around a decade ago. Actual use is as secretive as PLA guided ordinance footage and photos (very restricted). CH-7 prototype we have but none for actual use. Dark Sword is considerably more secretive.

CH-7 is secretive but it's competitor that lost prcurement competition is allowed to be shown.

So there's proper UCAV path, improvement on 5th gen path like image below just to increase stealth further and then the full 6th gen of totally radical variable geometry. Not much space for J-35 in PLAAF.

 

[applesauce]

Project AZM is most likely a variant of J35 because Pakistan doesn't have the technology/money to build a 5th generation jet from scratch. It will be similar to Jf17, a Pakistani spec jet, Pakistan will have the freedom to incorporate any types of weapons on it, similar to Jf17, weapons from Turkey and South Africa and some Pakistan made (if there are). If we think about it Turkey and China spent billions on their 5th generation project and how much has Pakistan spent? Next to nothing so far, if tomorrow Pakistan announces 10B AZM project then I would be excited.

Lucky for Pakistan we will have the TFX available, aswell as the Turkish MIUS unmanned jet. So one will be Chinese/Pak spec fighter and one western one. I would love the J20B with unmanned drones, it would be a deep strike offensive plane which we all want.

no way any theoretical pakistan variant of the j-35 would be anything like the jf-17.
the jf-17 program is shared, with pakistan having basically full rights to the jet and do modifications as you please, with any exports in a profit sharing arrangement with a good amount of production able to be completed by Pakistan itself .

that framework for the j-35 on the other hand has long since sailed (Pakistan had like 10 years to jump in on the project ... and didn't). its nearly completely developed. if sold, pakistan would have no rights to its production(unless paid for, but that'll be very expensive) and limited rights at best to modifications and no profit sharing because its fully chinese.
it'll be more along the lines of the j-10CE and not the jf-17.