its time for kiyani to takeover?

[WaghaBorder]

This post clearly demonstrates the problem in Pakistan. Only in Pakistan would the army be considered independent of the government. The army is a part of the state & its actions would in normal course be accepted as part of the state's response. The fact that so many see it as seperate from the state is a telling indictment of how skewed the thinking in Pakistan has become .

Very well pointed out.

This is Pakistan.

 

[ice_man]

And at what cost?? for people of Pakistan to rot in their own country? the economy is in shambles and all construction projects are at a standstill. While the incumbent President HOLIDAY's in Europe the country faces it's worst flooding in recent history.

I mean, compare the response of this democratic government with Gen. Musharraf's response to the earth quake and other calamities.

What has democracy given us? 500% increase in corruption? if that's democracy, I'm better off with the democratic dictatorship that represents the people and not jageerdars (royalty of Pakistan).

give democracy 20 years uninterrupted! so that the "INNOCENT" act done by PPP,MQM,ANP & PML is finished once and for all!! give all of them a chance ONE LAST TIME!! so that the whole act that dictators have fck*d the country is finished for life!!!

we need our democracy to mature! and for that we need to give it time to carry on uninterrupted!! look at MQM it just terrorised karachi the whole of 90s! but then NAIMATULLAH came and started developments!!

what happened next time MQM came they did more to hold on to power!! at the end of the day people of karachi benefited! if these leaders know they can come back again they will work but currently they all come thinking BUSS EK HI MUKAA HAI KHAAO LOO SUUB KUCH!!

 

[ice_man]

This post clearly demonstrates the problem in Pakistan. Only in Pakistan would the army be considered independent of the government. The army is a part of the state & its actions would in normal course be accepted as part of the state's response. The fact that so many see it as seperate from the state is a telling indictment of how skewed the thinking in Pakistan has become .

not really! turkey has had its fair share of coups so has many other countries! so from Julius Ceaser to Muharraf coups have been common doesn't make pakistani thinking skewed!

however, from a spineless corrupt democracy autocracy is better! but having said we need to give democracy an unhindered run!

 

[RescueRanger]

My one request to Indian... Please stay out of this thread. Many Thanks!

 

[r4rehan]

JALDI AOO KIYANI SAHAB :|

shayad ap hi theek hoo hamare Mulk ke liye coz Zardari Kambhakhat tu bhaga howa hai mulk se jab mulk ko SADAR ki Pakistan ki sab se zyada zarorat hai ,,,,,,,,,,, aprox 2000 People have been dead in pakistan but our ledar making fun and doing tafri out side of Country ,,, and Every Politiciin is making money and playing with the life of Common man like KARACHI....

here in KARACHI innocent UrduSpeaking and Pathanz are killing by Politician's Agents. MQM and ANP are fighting with each other but niether MQM's people are dieing not ANP's People but a Common man is being fuel of this WAR


ARMY(Mujahideen) now u can save our Balochistan our Karachi our K.P.K our whole country plz do something and try to rule like HAZRAT ABU BAKAR SIDDIQ (R.A) HAZRAT UMAR FAROOQ BIN KHATTAB (R.A) HAZRAT USMAN GHANI BIN AFFAN (R.A) and Sheer-e-Khuda HAZRAT ALI (R.A)

<(_|_)| Ap ko Tufeeq de ke ap log ALLAH K Nizam ko yahan nafiz ul amal karen AMEEN


<(_|_)| AKBAR

 

[Bang Galore]

Respecting ResueRanger's sentiment, this is my last post on this topic

not really! turkey has had its fair share of coups so has many other countries! so from Julius Ceaser to Muharraf coups have been common doesn't make pakistani thinking skewed!

however, from a spineless corrupt democracy autocracy is better! but having said we need to give democracy an unhindered run!

I wasn't discussing coups or military rule, just pointing out that in the post I was referring to, the army's actions is thought of as independent of those of the Pakistani state.

The army receives budgetary allocation from the government & does not spend its own money doing rescue work. It's fairly routine in India for the army to be called out during natural calamities. However, it is never seen as an independent body doing its own thing but as an organ of the state performing the duty of the state. The army's response is the response of the state.

The thinking that leads to the army's actions being perceived to be outside of the state's response was what I said was skewed. How is democracy ever going to flourish if the state is not seen as a whole? Does the army do what it does on the orders of the civilian leadership or does it strike out on its own? If the answer is the former, than it is part of the state's response, if the latter;then you have serious problems that can't be blamed on the "powerless"civilian government

 

[NWO]

Kiyani is too smart to do something like that. He already stated that he's going to keep out of politics. This is good for his reputation. Asim bhai said it best: "Every military dictator was welcomed as a hero in Pakistan and then crucified as a villain."

 

[ajpirzada]

let the system work and hopefully it will get mature with each passing government.
at least we know we ll get an option to vote again in 2013. those who are tired can vote against. with dictatorship there is no such thing. u have to swallow everything and at all times.

 

[karan.1970]

let the system work and hopefully it will get mature with each passing government.
at least we know we ll get an option to vote again in 2013. those who are tired can vote against. with dictatorship there is no such thing. u have to swallow everything and at all times.

Apologies RR, but really wanted to respond here...

Absolutely. I said it elsewhere as well. Chosing wrong representatives is a part of a democratic process as well as a right of the electorate. If you dont make mistakes, and someone else always tells you the right and wrong, then how is it a democracy?? Like most things, democracy needs enough runway to prove itself..

Had to get this off.. Will shut up on this thread now..

 

[mehru]

No way. Army's reputation was badly damaged during Musharraf era. General Kiyani restored it with great difficulty and he is also very sensitive to public opinion. He will never do this.

As for the current Govt, we have to give time to this pathetic democracy. True they are abusing the power but with time i am sure that we will get good leaders.
Mid term elections is also an option but even that can derail democracy.

PS. Next time every Pakistani should vote for some new party rather than these usual jokers.

 

[GUNNER]

No. How many times do we have to go through the same cycle?

Democracy..coup..democracy..coup...democracy..coup !

It's like the favourite topic for the people of Pakistan after every two-three years of elections. And..after every five years of a coup, they want elections. Just goes to show that after 63 years, we remain a politically immature nation.

You don't like the government? Fine. You'll get a chance to elect a new one after five years. Go and vote.

If you want to have a change right now.. go out on the streets !

That's a process... Don't blame everything on the leaders.. They reflect the society who voted them in...May be not most of the people on this forum but they got votes..

It's not the job of the Army to run a country, if past coups have been any example.

And, Kayani is just the right man right now. He will not step in. He has made this clear to many within the Army. I don't want to disappoint the people clamoring for a milityary coup on this forum, but coup is not on the list of 'to-do-things' of Mr Kayani. There are more important issues that he needs to focus on.

 

[Peregrine]

General kiyani hasn't got the caliber to take over by imposing martial law, its simple as that. As far as the future of Pakistan is concerned, one has to bare in mind if Democracy really is the best form of government for Pakistan.
We don't have to get on the band wagon just because the Americans, British etc are doing it. We have to analyze our past, present & future for that matter. The hardliner pro democratic's conveniently brush off the facts that the democracy in Pakistan in more of an Aristocracy, where power lies in the hands of the few elites & that is how the so called democratic circle goes on in Pakistan. I am not sure if military will try to topple these thugs but if these politicians will continue to show indifference towards public's insecurities then i believe a revolution in the form of class struggle will be imminent.

 

[kursed]

We've already tried re-inventing the wheel 4 times (38+ years). It doesn't work. Give this argument a rest already.

Pakistanis should instead concentrate upon improving the state of their economy, law and order and livelihood of the down trodden. The act of switching between democracy and despotic regimes, after every few years, doesn't help. You only end up making a mockery of your country, its people and its constitution.

 

[laiqs@mi]

It's time that Kayani enforce a National-Govt. composed of intellectuals, competent & sincere ppl... while NOT being head of state himself so that he can stay focussed on country's security...

100%

 

[G W A D A R I]

Army should not go into politics. There is only 1 intitution in Pakistan which is trutworthy if army indulge itself into politics again I doubt corruption might test them so please keep your clothes clean and dont park your car in NO PARKING.
SABAR KA PHAL MEETHA
HOTA HE BAI.

LAST BUT NOT LEASET RESPECT THE CONSTITUTION. PLEASE.