It's official: Video evidence of surgical strikes won't be released

[sathya]

We can release the video, as and when we want, ie to put pressure on Pakistan army or government whenever it is suitable to us..

Video proof is already a asset. No need to use it without significant gain.

Those who are stubbornly refusing now will be the ones to put pressure on their side later..

We trust our side, they trust their side..

Let us see which government or army is lying to their countrymen... In due course of time..
Off course the intention for hiding or lying is for the sake of that country.

 

[Counterpunch]

It's official: Video evidence of surgical strikes won't be released

The government has decided for now it will NOT release any evidence of the surgical strikes and the damage caused to the terror launch pads in Azad Kashmir, arguing that doing so would push the Pakistan Army into a corner.


Top sources in the government told The Indian Express that "war is not in India's interest at this point' but "that does not, however, mean that we won't fight and win a war if it is forced upon us'.


Highlighting the diplomatic success of the surgical strikes, sources said that no country has objected to India's action, including Pakistan's closest ally, China. Most statements have been in India's support, including from the Islamic world.The military operations, sources said, were timed after the United Nations General Assembly meeting was over in New York to avoid complications "which would have diverted our attention and diplomatic energies".


The announcement that Abu Dhabi Crown Prince Sheikh Mohammed bin Zayed Al Nahyan would be the chief guest at the next Republic Day celebrations -- it was made after the strike '" was also part of the government's diplomatic strategy.Sources said the United States was not informed by the government before the Army carried out the surgical strikes.


The telephone call between National Security Advisor Ajit Doval and his American counterpart, Susan Rice, that morning also did not mention any specific details about the military operations although he dropped adequate hints that some military activity may have taken place on the Line of Control (LoC), sources said.


"We will never be strategically subservient to any country, including the United States. That has been our policy since Nehru's time; it was what even non-alignment was about. We have worked closely with various world powers over the years, but we will never give up our decisional autonomy," sources said.


The success of the surgical strikes, sources said, had removed the sense of helplessness that had gripped the country after every previous terror attack. The biggest gain has been the demonstration of national will, along with the decisional autonomy and capability to exercise options, sources said.

Ah! that logic again!
How mature of them to think of their counterparts across LoC now and saying just airing of the footage can lead to a war now. As if it would not have lead to a war already if the Indian Army was caught in the act of so called Surgical strikes "lasting a couple of hours on a hostile territory heavily guarded and mined". If any one contends that it went undetected and thinks the world buys this stuff then he might as well declare himself Mayor of the Moon and the World shall not question him

 

[manojb]

The Osama operation was acknowledged by Pakistan and the rest of the world, and not to mention that Osama really stopped putting out any videos after that. So it's likely he is dead.

The Indian "surgical strikes" on the other hand, only India is claiming they happened. Pakistan even brought international observers to the LOC to show that there was no difference to before.

Had there been no crashed halo no one would believe US seals breached pakistan. OBL is likely dead, no one seen his dead body he might be locked up somewhere. . Just the word of Obama.
They were not observerthey were journalist took a joy ride on military plane at pak military discretion.

@Topic good that India decided not to show any proof it works for us. Let enemy keep guessing our capabilities. 200km stretch, 4 location, 7 camps , simultaneous attack 30+ terrorist dead, no casualties at our end. Job well done, jai hind.

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Not sure what made you say that...precisely my point is that Army has given a go ahead with the rider to refrain from releasing certain sections...so yes there are concerns of so called tactics being released, however there are enough sections that can be released without an issue...precisely why i brought geo-politics in mind....Now let me get into the other points...

Those "certain sections" can be easily edited and presented to the world. whats stopping it from happening? Specially when Pakistan is "rubbishing" Indian claims. You got Pakistan cornered, what you are waiting for? Elections? Ok fair enough, pardon my ignorance I am not clued up on Indian internal politics, when are elections due in India? I am not going anywhere, I hope you stay around till the election on this forum!?

• That is your POV...As far as we are concerned strategic strikes is a reality and Pakistan as usual living in denial...and world powers supported our move that's why enough statements from various corners that India reserves the right to respond to terror attacks.

• So as per you surgical strike didn't happen..PA still went ahead and did enough firework on Indian side and suddenly our Army developed cold feet and not responding...that's why Audio/videos is coming from your side and our's is silent...fair enough...

• Try to comprehend the point before accusing other of making school boy errors...Before surgical strikes the only thing that Pakistan had to worry about was how to facilitate entry from launch pads...as India had no option but to make noises and rely on diplomacy...After surgical strikes stakes has been raised for Pakistan as well...how?? - Mind it no party wants to get into war like situation...Now India has brought unpredictability of surgical strikes...Pakistan won't be able to ignore/deny it next time and will have to respond in kind...the issue with that is they then can't control how India will respond and things can go out of hands...So in short now Pakistan will also feel the same pressure that India was feeling after terror attacks like Mumbai/Pathankot etc...

• Obviously that Kashmiri politician is sitting in the same room where Army is making up these videos...Also video morphing is a technique that only IA knows...Pakistan and its army have no clue about how it is done....I know it all...please tell me something new...

• Statements from world, India deserve the right to respond, by whom? Russian ambassador to India? Last time I checked he was reprimanded by Moscow for his lose talk. Who else? Who has endorsed your claim of surgical strike?
• We went ahead with our punitive actions all across loc (I am sure you have seen the footage of firework on this forum ) , because we repsonded to the "ceasefire violation" by India which we had back in 2003. We acknowledged that our two soilders were martyerd in Indian shelling, where is your acknowledgement of your loses? Or do you believe your defense minister that your Army acted like Hanumans?
• Your point is not in confirmy with ground realities, as we speak, Your forces have already been hit many times ever since the claims of surgical strike. If that was the intention of restrain to Pakistan, that hasnt worked at all. So what next? Another Sir J kal strikes by hanumans in coming days?
• You can ask the chap, he is under your controlled territory, nothing to do with us.

 

[coffee_cup]

Oye Modi, where is the evidence..

Sir G Kal...

 

[Taimoor Khan]

check your entire history of conflicts with india...you may get a different answer...

And? Your military establishment vetoed Siachin deescalation when it was agreed upon by your civilian government.

Care to share some instances...Given Army functions very differently in your country you have such misconceptions...Civilian govt. has clear dictats and Army has to follow it....During Kargil our Army wanted to cross LOC and use gains there as bargain chip...however was ruled out and had to fight battle on much harder geography...does that prove anything...

See above. There is one thing called wishful thinking and capacity and capability.

Indian govt. openly declared that we have gone ahead and done surgical strikes...Our DGMO made that announcement and also shared that with his counterpart...We went ahead and informed all the major power of the world about it...We also made it public that we have video proofs....Do you think we raised stakes at this level without any substance?? ...Please ponder over it...

Tomorrow if ISI make a claim that they kidnapped Modi's wife, raped her and then left her in their place, I am sure world would ask about the proofs, Modi's wife herself will be like , what the f***?

You informed the major powers? does it mean anything? feeling insure? When we did the proper surgical strike in Kargil which lasted for weeks, we didnt inform anyone. Your point is?

Exactly, when you said you got proof of video, Pakistan is saying lets bring it on.

We dont live in bollywood my friend, come to real world.

 

[The Eagle]

After many variations in recent past, who knows soon they may release a filmed Op from Leepa etc to once again satisfy the people like it is evident from first day that India said we have the video and will release then continuous changing statements while Indian Foreign office lastly termed it as Counter Terrorist Op yet the news came that no video, so wait for it, soon it will be an acceptance as proven with no so called strikes.

Rest about the so-called drama of not embarrassing the PA or don't want to corner is like India ever missed a chance to blame and defame Pakistan Army. Look at the recent blame of Marked Weapons in Uri that NIA denied any marking, says a lot that how GoI would ever miss to defame but as said, no strikes, no video hence no proof yet excuses. India never miss chance to blame Pakistan for anything yet such change of heart, I mean really and the few would buy it indeed it is good face saving tactic. The same could be sold in India but wait, many who questioned the authenticity of such strikes are already painted as traitors that speaks volume how India will ever discount Pakistan in such moment. The thing is, it is replied and rebutted by every mean that GoI claims were only for public consumption that their people bought proving it success sell out so we are happy for that too due the people of India but doesn't matter for us as we know the reality what happened.

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

The recent operation in Kashmir in which they took 3 days to clear a building from only two Mujahideen and building was totally destroyed should be enough eye opener for them and How big lies are being sold to Indians in the name of surgical strike.

If india wanted, they can demolish building within seconds, but they had other agenda, of maximum coverage and act as victim. There is something called psychological media war. Hope you get it .

 

[Mugwop]

I used to despise these hindu supremacists on this forum but after reading this I feel sorry for them. Their politicians are making a fool out of them and these guys keep defending their lies over and over pathetically.
USA wasn't scared to lose a stealth helicopter during the OBL raid and these indians don't wanna reveal their tactics.

You know what the funniest part is that they can edit and cut out the tactics part from the so called video and show atleast 10 seconds of evidence but they won't even do that. Heck they won't even show the so called video to their own people.

 

[deckingraj]

And? Your military establishment vetoed Siachin deescalation when it was agreed upon by your civilian government.

Do you have any proofs to back your claim?? Is there anything out there which says that was the case?? Do you think Military simply veto civilian govt out of blue?? Is it that easy?? I have given you an example where Military fought as hard as a battle like Kargil when they clearly wanted to open a different front and yet you are talking about speculations like military vetoed GOI?? I have dozens of such examples that i can share to back my claim....do you have anything else?? Of-course military will never want to move out of Siachen...bcoz if PA moves in they will never be able to move them out(the same way you have never been able to move us out)....Now Civilian govt. need to take that risk...not the other way around!!

See above. There is one thing called wishful thinking and capacity and capability.

So PA has the capability and capacity to come in several KM inside LOC however IA does not have the capacity and capability to open a new front in the same LOC...fair enough

Tomorrow if ISI make a claim that they kidnapped Modi's wife, raped her and then left her in their place, I am sure world would ask about the proofs, Modi's wife herself will be like , what the f***?

The above rant is disgusting and shows your maturity level...anyways there is a difference b/w individuals and nations..!!

You informed the major powers? does it mean anything? feeling insure? When we did the proper surgical strike in Kargil which lasted for weeks, we didnt inform anyone. Your point is?

Yes you didn't inform anyone because you live in denial...though unlike India you got the flak from everyone around the world and nobody bought your lies...yet you kept on harping that and unfortunately some poor souls who gave up their lives for their country were denied even a proper burial in their homeland....and your point is??...Now coming to the discussion when you inform about something to the major powers of the world then that means there is something concrete behind it...making tall claims in front of home audience is one thing...involving world powers is another...no??

Exactly, when you said you got proof of video, Pakistan is saying lets bring it on.We dont live in bollywood my friend, come to real world.

when you live in denial nothing on this earth is going to good enough...anyways tell me ...how would you prove the authenticity of the videos should GOI releases them...the next thing would be videos are fake, morphed and what not....so once again lets for a second assume that surgical strikes happened...give me one good logical reason for GOI to actually release them...what are we going to gain by that....

 

[deckingraj]

Those "certain sections" can be easily edited and presented to the world. whats stopping it from happening?

Now you are repeating the same stuff...i think we both agree that after editing cetain sections videos can be released...

Specially when Pakistan is "rubbishing" Indian claims. You got Pakistan cornered, what you are waiting for? Elections? Ok fair enough, pardon my ignorance I am not clued up on Indian internal politics, when are elections due in India? I am not going anywhere, I hope you stay around till the election on this forum!?

There are always elections in India..my stay on this forum has covered many elections in India and Pakistan so rest assured i am not going anywhere...

There is no incentive for GOI to corner Pakistan...In fact it is counter productive to corner them...let me know if you want more explanation on this...

Statements from world, India deserve the right to respond, by whom? Russian ambassador to India? Last time I checked he was reprimanded by Moscow for his lose talk. Who else? Who has endorsed your claim of surgical strike?

So now Russian Ambassador to India is lose talker...fair enough...Here are some more links for your reference...

"Every country has a right to self-defence... We do empathize with the Indian perception that they need to respond militarily,"
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...fence-slams-Pakistan/articleshow/54834627.cms

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/us-b...n-for-linking-afghan-peace-to-kashmir-1473450

"There are two clear norms in international law governing this issue. The first norm is that every state is under a legal obligation to make sure that there is no terrorism emanating from the territory it controls. Secondly , there is a clear international norm that any state has the right to defend its territory from international terrorism."

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...-on-surgical-strikes/articleshow/54707006.cms

We went ahead with our punitive actions all across loc (I am sure you have seen the footage of firework on this forum ) , because we repsonded to the "ceasefire violation" by India which we had back in 2003. We acknowledged that our two soilders were martyerd in Indian shelling, where is your acknowledgement of your loses? Or do you believe your defense minister that your Army acted like Hanumans?

Have you ever seen IA hiding their casualties?? I know how many we lost without a single bullet fired in 2002 stand off...do you know how many you lost.....?? Heck do you know how many you lost in Kargil?? The point is this talk about punitive actions on LOC is just bull crap...There is no such thing...for every cease fire violations there is no holding back by either side....however in d1ck measuring competitions they mean a lot...I hope you have nothing to do with 1 PA = 10 IA brigade...

Your point is not in confirmy with ground realities, as we speak, Your forces have already been hit many times ever since the claims of surgical strike. If that was the intention of restrain to Pakistan, that hasnt worked at all. So what next? Another Sir J kal strikes by hanumans in coming days?

Either you are not getting the point or dont want to...One single surgical strike is not going to change things for good....What has that proved is that India has called the nuclear bluff and won't shy away from using Military options...The million dollar question is - will india be able to keep the pressure on or not..that my freind only time will tell...

You can ask the chap, he is under your controlled territory, nothing to do with us.

The don't quote him...There are enough nut cases your side as well...I certainly don't take their words as gospel truth...

 

[Avyator]

That's fine, good decision in fact. Indians know what happened, those Indian politicians who want to deny to score cheap political points will continue denying (although the parliamentary briefing should be enough), and as for Pakistanis, well, nothing will convince them.

If you release footage they'll just say it's made up. And frankly, even those Pakistanis who are secretly convinced the strikes took place will put on a brave face and deny it in front of us. So in that case, better not to release sensitive footage which could give away important information.

 

[xyxmt]

Me so depressed, me ordered a container of pop corns, now me do what with dat?

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Do you have any proofs to back your claim?? Is there anything out there which says that was the case?? Do you think Military simply veto civilian govt out of blue?? Is it that easy?? I have given you an example where Military fought as hard as a battle like Kargil when they clearly wanted to open a different front and yet you are talking about speculations like military vetoed GOI?? I have dozens of such examples that i can share to back my claim....do you have anything else?? Of-course military will never want to move out of Siachen...bcoz if PA moves in they will never be able to move them out(the same way you have never been able to move us out)....Now Civilian govt. need to take that risk...not the other way around!!

Unless you been living under the rock, its been discussed all over as to how Indian military establishment vetoed Indian government agreement back in the days of Musharraf to deescalate the Siachin conflict. It was Kasuri, then Foreign minister who mentioned that an agreement was reached between GOP and GOI only to be torpedoed by Indian military.
You dont want to move out becuase you are stuck there. You moved in a completely no man land being a smart arse and eventually got your arse stuck in there when Pakistan responded.

So PA has the capability and capacity to come in several KM inside LOC however IA does not have the capacity and capability to open a new front in the same LOC...fair enough

Not only come several KMs inside but stay there for weeks. We have proven it without any shadow of doubt, where is your proof?

The above rant is disgusting and shows your maturity level...anyways there is a difference b/w individuals and nations..!!

Sorry if I stepped on some tails here. Just trying to knock some sense in you.

Yes you didn't inform anyone because you live in denial...though unlike India you got the flak from everyone around the world and nobody bought your lies...yet you kept on harping that and unfortunately some poor souls who gave up their lives for their country were denied even a proper burial in their homeland....and your point is??...Now coming to the discussion when you inform about something to the major powers of the world then that means there is something concrete behind it...making tall claims in front of home audience is one thing...involving world powers is another...no??

Denial? of what? We dont need a certificate of approval from world to do what is in the our national interest. We act. And those souls took plenty of souls from your side who your state was struggling to find coffin for. Involving world powers for what purpose? showing that you as a nation are insecure? We didnt make tall claims, our actions did all the talking. Its simply quite pathetic on how a simple LOC ceasefire violation has been turned into some sort of surgical strike. If anything, Kargil was a surgical strike.

So now Russian Ambassador to India is lose talker...fair enough...Here are some more links for your reference...

"Every country has a right to self-defence... We do empathize with the Indian perception that they need to respond militarily,"
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...fence-slams-Pakistan/articleshow/54834627.cms

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/us-b...n-for-linking-afghan-peace-to-kashmir-1473450

"There are two clear norms in international law governing this issue. The first norm is that every state is under a legal obligation to make sure that there is no terrorism emanating from the territory it controls. Secondly , there is a clear international norm that any state has the right to defend its territory from international terrorism."

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...-on-surgical-strikes/articleshow/54707006.cms

Yes every country has the right for self defense just like we defended the LOC when India violated the ceasefire and repulsed the attack.

Everyone agree in Pakistan that America and India are on same page when it comes to geopolitics and the claim of so called Surgical strikes at the time when Russian troops were engaged in exercise with their Pakistani counterparts is very intriguing indeed. Understand the geopolitics. Talks and ambiguous statements are however cheap without any proofs. It was all well planned but the execution however went pear shaped. But for the intention, we will give 10 out of 10 to India.

when you live in denial nothing on this earth is going to good enough...anyways tell me ...how would you prove the authenticity of the videos should GOI releases them...the next thing would be videos are fake, morphed and what not....so once again lets for a second assume that surgical strikes happened...give me one good logical reason for GOI to actually release them...what are we going to gain by that....

Who in right frame of mind will rubbish the videos if they are authentic? Everything can be checked, terrain matched and what not.

There are always elections in India..my stay on this forum has covered many elections in India and Pakistan so rest assured i am not going anywhere...

There is no incentive for GOI to corner Pakistan...In fact it is counter productive to corner them...let me know if you want more explanation on this...

You were of the view that Modi regime is holding the proofs till the time of elections. I said, that fine, we can both wait till the time of election. Dont change the goal post now shall we?

Have you ever seen IA hiding their casualties?? I know how many we lost without a single bullet fired in 2002 stand off...do you know how many you lost.....?? Heck do you know how many you lost in Kargil?? The point is this talk about punitive actions on LOC is just bull crap...There is no such thing...for every cease fire violations there is no holding back by either side....however in d1ck measuring competitions they mean a lot...I hope you have nothing to do with 1 PA = 10 IA brigade...

I am not into d|ck measuing contest here. BUT as your esteemed DGMO mentioned that there were NO indian casualites during this so called surgical strikes, for which DG ISPR challenged the Indian side as to why they are hidding their casulities. What we are trying to get here, that when the whole drama was based on a lie, how can it be taken as truth?

Either you are not getting the point or dont want to...One single surgical strike is not going to change things for good....What has that proved is that India has called the nuclear bluff and won't shy away from using Military options...The million dollar question is - will india be able to keep the pressure on or not..that my freind only time will tell...

TBH, when did Paksitan called this nuclear "bluff"? We did surgical strike in kargil for weeks, knowing fully that India is a declared nuke power. Indians forces are been hit many times since you declare the so called surgical strike. Neither your own status as nuke power or your claim for surgical strike is making iota of difference to Pakistan. Pardon my french, but Pakistan is saying, who give a f***.

 

[deckingraj]

Unless you been living under the rock, its been discussed all over as to how Indian military establishment vetoed Indian government agreement back in the days of Musharraf to deescalate the Siachin conflict. It was Kasuri, then Foreign minister who mentioned that an agreement was reached between GOP and GOI only to be torpedoed by Indian military.

It looks like you have some comprehension problems....Try to read it slowly before hitting the reply button...I clearly said that IA is against moving outof Siachen....I gave the reasons as well...It is foolish for GOI to ignore IA apprehensions however if they chose to then that is the end of matter...Do you get it?? This is not Pakistan who we are talking here...IA knows its boundary very well..History is there to prove it as well....if you don't wanna look or ask then can't help...

You dont want to move out becuase you are stuck there. You moved in a completely no man land being a smart arse and eventually got your arse stuck in there when Pakistan responded.

and you were saying that i was living under a rock!!

Not only come several KMs inside but stay there for weeks. We have proven it without any shadow of doubt, where is your proof?

?? Why do we need to give a proof?? WHY??

Sorry if I stepped on some tails here. Just trying to knock some sense in you.

by loosing your sanity and puking garbage like an illetrate person...sure

Denial? of what? We dont need a certificate of approval from world to do what is in the our national interest. We act.

however India needs approval from you or world by showing proofs?? Make up your mind....

And those souls took plenty of souls from your side who your state was struggling to find coffin for.

And yet they were abandoned...Also when you don't even know how many you lost how do you know who took more chaps??

Involving world powers for what purpose? showing that you as a nation are insecure? We didnt make tall claims, our actions did all the talking. Its simply quite pathetic on how a simple LOC ceasefire violation has been turned into some sort of surgical strike. If anything, Kargil was a surgical strike.

Involving world powers is important because as a responsible country you need to explain your position...Unlike Pakistan which just moves in and then get flak from everyone....If you say kargil was a surgical strike then i can only laugh at your ignorance...you don't even know the meaning of surgical strike and debating with me....

Yes every country has the right for self defense just like we defended the LOC when India violated the ceasefire and repulsed the attack.

Everyone agree in Pakistan that America and India are on same page when it comes to geopolitics and the claim of so called Surgical strikes at the time when Russian troops were engaged in exercise with their Pakistani counterparts is very intriguing indeed. Understand the geopolitics. Talks and ambiguous statements are however cheap without any proofs. It was all well planned but the execution however went pear shaped. But for the intention, we will give 10 out of 10 to India.

Don't ask for something if you can't digest it...Why waste time?? You asked for countries other than Russia who supported our claims and when i shared that you are giving me all this...China troops are also engaged with India and that too in Ladakh...does that mean anything more than that??

Who in right frame of mind will rubbish the videos if they are authentic? Everything can be checked, terrain matched and what not.

really? When you guys can deny the whole freaking Kargil operation and put it on Mujahideen then what a mortal video will do..and who is going to verify it and do the terrain mapping?? You?? Your army has shared video evidence of Indian casualties...IA rubbished it and called them morphed...who is going to verify that?? I believe my army and you yours...no??

You were of the view that Modi regime is holding the proofs till the time of elections. I said, that fine, we can both wait till the time of election. Dont change the goal post now shall we?

As said you have some serious comprehension problems...this is what i wrote...
If I was Modi and ready to take all the above risks then i would be releasing the video evidence a month or so before UP elections...
Let me make it easy for you...
All i am saying is that if I was Modi i would have released it after calculating ROI...not saying that I believe Modi will....

I am not into d|ck measuing contest here. BUT as your esteemed DGMO mentioned that there were NO indian casualites during this so called surgical strikes, for which DG ISPR challenged the Indian side as to why they are hidding their casulities. What we are trying to get here, that when the whole drama was based on a lie, how can it be taken as truth?

Dude...what are you challenging...Surgical Strikes or Casualties...Allow me to clarify.....PA stance is that it was cross border firing...two PA person died in it and in retaliation scores of Indian...PA went ahead and claimed their dead one's...India is not...and as per your video evidence was not able to retrieve those bodies....Now given cross border firing is a routine I fail to understand why PA is upfront in claiming their dead where as Indian are running with tails in legs...Something is not making sense here...no??

TBH, when did Paksitan called this nuclear "bluff"? We did surgical strike in kargil for weeks, knowing fully that India is a declared nuke power. Indians forces are been hit many times since you declare the so called surgical strike. Neither your own status as nuke power or your claim for surgical strike is making iota of difference to Pakistan. Pardon my french, but Pakistan is saying, who give a f***.

Look if you are pretending to be ignorant then I can't help....Kargil is a perfect example that there is a scope of limited conflict within nuclear umbrella..and so does this surgical strikes...However Pakistan has been harping about using Nukes at the drop of hat all the time...Their not declaring "No First Use" Policy, deployment of tactical nukes raise enough doubts...Mind it No-one wants a nuclear war...this is the bluff and is a brilliant one..2002. standoff...26/11 are prefect examples of uncertainty on this side... Strategist in India have been raising it for a long time...GOI finally called it!!