Israeli sources: Iran missile strike a ‘flop,’ with most missing target

[OldTwilight]

well , how can you turn pure military discussion to pure military discussion !?

 

[Iranm]

You also say: "Having economic activities by IRGC is not IRGC's fault. It is a nationwide problem where people are doing things that may cause conflict of interest. And that is not limited to Iran." wait what?! Under Mr. Khomainie this did not happen. So I am not sure why it "could" happen now. Also, does Artesh have business interests? Not heard that yet, but you may know better.

From what I have heard Artesh with new commander is changing too. They are trying to make Artesh also powerful in economy too. They are investing and trying to make their own money. But I'm sure it won't be as freely and strong as IRGC's.

 

[OldTwilight]

From what I have heard Artesh with new commander is changing too. They are trying to make Artesh also powerful in economy too. They are investing and trying to make their own money. But I'm sure it won't be as freely and strong as IRGC's.

Artesh Real problem is "Sarbazi" , their sole purpose become to "how to use free solders" ...

 

[Arminkh]

I disagree... I have been very consistent: give credit to IRI where it's due, remain skeptical of IRI's claims until and unless verified.

Thanks for the background info. To respond to your statements about Queen of England:
England, UK, is a constitutional monarchy. It's not a monarchy in its pure sense. The Queen is a the head of state but not the head of government (this is very similar to IRI). She can NOT however dismiss, reject, object to, or any way undermine the business of parliament, the people's chamber. She is limited by the constitution and only acts within the constraints of the written laws. This is where IRI differs from England: The Velayate Faghih is "absolute" in the extend of power it has and exercises, just like absolute monarchy. Again, if Iranians are fine with that who am I to say otherwise. But please drop pretensions of democracy.

You also say: "Having economic activities by IRGC is not IRGC's fault. It is a nationwide problem where people are doing things that may cause conflict of interest. And that is not limited to Iran." wait what?! Under Mr. Khomainie this did not happen. So I am not sure why it "could" happen now. Also, does Artesh have business interests? Not heard that yet, but you may know better.

Lastly you say" Your current president and many of your senators are good examples of politicians who have economical interests and are steering your country towards where is more beneficial to them not necessarily thinking about the nation as a whole." Couldn't agree with you more. But 6 years from today, I can go to the polls and vote for "whomever" is running and is closest to my political orientation, without prior "arbitrary" vetting by any single body.

I don't want to derail this thread. And please don't teach me about what the Queen can do or cannot. After all, I'm also a Canadian and know exactly what her authorities are. She can reclaim her full control whenever she wants, at least in theory. Did you know the house that I have bought here actually belongs to her majesty and I have only bought the title? Theoretically she can reclaim her land from me whenever she wants. In Iran, when you own a land you own it. Nobody can take it from you. There have been Shah eras land lords that fled after the revolution but then came back and claimed all their properties that were confiscated by the government and even sold to third parties.

If Iranians were not fine with what is going on, they would do something about it just like they did with Shah. And there is not only one version of democracy. Iranians get the good ideas and change it according to their taste and culture regardless of whether the rest of the world likes it or not. IRGC is Iranian version of Organized Military. IR is Iranian version of democracy. Good or bad, that is how we have been able to safeguard our unique identity and not dissolve into other invading cultures like what happened to Egypt.

IRGC was brought to economic realm by the late Rafsanjani who was considered to be a moderate revolutionary politician. He started so many different major construction projects in Iran that the private sector couldn't simply keep up. So they thought instead of leaving IRGC earth work machinery to sit under the sun, let's make use of them and that's where it all started. It also was another way of funding the armed forces in addition to what is shown in the budget. Back then, it sounded like a great idea. And yes Artesh does too through Sanaye Defa which owns companies like SAIRAN and SANAM.

I see you have already given up the hope to bring in another president after Trump's first term is over. And yes, in theory you should be able to vote for whomever you want. I'd say good luck with that as you also have a vetting process which is not as bold and upfront as that of Iran. Your vetting process is done by your cartels and economic masters since none of your politicians have the amount of money that is necessary to be spent on campaign to even make them heard let alone get them to the last two candidates. So before you even hear the name of your candidates, choice have been made by your billionaires and you will only see their candidates and have to choose between apple and orange with the same predictable behavior that we have seen for the last century. Honestly, do you think Hillary was any better than Trump?

I let my case rest here. Have a nice day.

well , how can you turn pure military discussion to pure military discussion !?

I'm sorry. I won't continue this debate anymore.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Artesh Real problem is "Sarbazi" , their sole purpose become to "how to use free solders" ...

Well its not only army that uses conscripts IRGC and Police Force also use them and I doubt its the problem with the army .

 

[OldTwilight]

Well its not only army that uses conscripts IRGC and Police Force also use them and I doubt its the problem with the army .

well , both Police and IRGC don't train them as actual solders ... IRIGC use Saberin and Active Bassiji and Police use them for trivial matters ...

My brother was a solder in Army and they trained him for 5-6 month and then he only serve them 11 month !!! ( his term was 17 month with some extra days as punishment ) ... see 5-6 month training for 11 month work !? this is wast of money and times .... they wasted my brother life as well ....

 

[Hack-Hook]

well , both Police and IRGC don't train them as actual solders ... IRIGC use Saberin and Active Bassiji and Police use them for trivial matters ...

My brother was a solder in Army and they trained him for 5-6 month and then he only serve them 11 month !!! ( his term was 17 month with some extra days as punishment ) ... see 5-6 month training for 11 month work !? this is wast of money and times .... they wasted my brother life as well ....

the backbone of police force at borders is those conscript. if controlling borders is trivial then I don't knew what is important.
and in case of war you think who would have performed better the guys who trained for 40 day or the ones who trained 5 month.
by the way what work you expect army need to ask from conscripts at peace time. what is better than occupying those young conscript with training ?

 

[OldTwilight]

the backbone of police force at borders is those conscript. if controlling borders is trivial then I don't knew what is important.
and in case of war you think who would have performed better the guys who trained for 40 day or the ones who trained 5 month.
by the way what work you expect army need to ask from conscripts at peace time. what is better than occupying those young conscript with training ?

no wonder why we losing 10 solders in every terrorist attack

 

[Hack-Hook]

no wonder why we losing 10 solders in every terrorist attack

Well mainly because they are trained only for 40 day and sadly in those 40 today they mainly learn how to drill and nobody tell them how to act in ambush .

In short they are trained for tehran not border.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

Well mainly because they are trained only for 40 day and sadly in those 40 today they mainly learn how to drill and nobody tell them how to act in ambush .

In short they are trained for tehran not border.

Even if you have highly trained soldiers you are still going to get heavy casualties in an ambush. Such is the nature of an ambush!

 

[OldTwilight]

Even if you have highly trained soldiers you are still going to get heavy casualties in an ambush. Such is the nature of an ambush!

actually , if they had armour vehicle in most ambush , the number of casualties could be 1/10 current number ...

they sen poor "Sharestani" youth to border and keep Tehranis in good area , so who are sitting in Tehran don't feel responsibility for equip our border guards with basic equipment because they don't care ....

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

actually , if they had armour vehicle in most ambush , the number of casualties could be 1/10 current number ...

they sen poor "Sharestani" youth to border and keep Tehranis in good area , so who are sitting in Tehran don't feel responsibility for equip our border guards with basic equipment because they don't care ....

Before you were talking about training and that is what I was responding to, now you switching to equipment and I agree with you. I think its a real shame that a country with Iran's manufacturing capacity has not produced Armoured vehicles like the Rakhsh apc in large numbers for use with the Border Guards.

 

[mohsen]

Israeli spokesman for Arab media confirms Iran's precision attack on ISIS:

https://twitter.com/x/status/877898761116282880

translation:
Iran launched an accurate surface-to-surface missile this week toward targets in Syria. ISIS has received a painful blowback from that.

 

[OldTwilight]

Before you were talking about training and that is what I was responding to, now you switching to equipment and I agree with you. I think its a real shame that a country with Iran's manufacturing capacity has not produced Armoured vehicles like the Rakhsh apc in large numbers for use with the Border Guards.

you can't except untrained solders be able to use specialized equipment ... should I explain this kind of obvious facts for you !?

 

[SOHEIL]