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Is it time for Britain’s unarmed police to be given guns?

Zarvan

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Print edition | Britain
Jun 29th 2017
https://www.economist.com/node/21724422/comments
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WITHIN eight minutes of three terrorists beginning their murderous rampage at London Bridge in June, armed police had shot them dead. But not before the criminals had killed eight people and injured many more. Officers were already at the scene but, unarmed, they had been unable to stop them. In March Keith Palmer, an unarmed police constable, was killed trying to stop Khalid Masood’s attack at Westminster. These recent “marauding” terrorist incidents have provoked debate in Britain about whether more of its police should carry guns.

The National Police Chiefs’ Council will consider the question at its next meeting in July. Among the options to be discussed are increasing the number of armed response vehicles and handing more officers Tasers or giving guns to those at key locations, though the council does not plan to make policy proposals.


Britain is unusual in how lightly it arms its police. It is one of only five members of the OECD, a group of 35 mainly rich countries, that does not routinely give officers guns. Because of its particular history, police in Northern Ireland are commonly armed. But in England and Wales only around 5% of the 123,000 officers carry guns. The number of firearms operations declined by 36% between 2009 and 2016, possibly as a result of wider use of non-lethal weapons such as Tasers by the police.

Armed officers open fire rarely. In the eight years to March 2016 police discharged their guns during just 40 incidents. Since 1990, 67 people have been killed in police shootings in England and Wales. In America, where guns are widespread among both the police and the general population, almost 1,000 people were killed by the police last year alone. Britain spends more time training its armed officers not to fire their weapons than to shoot, says Peter Neyroud, a former chief constable.


Could arming the police more widely make both them and the public safer? The number of officers in England and Wales has fallen by 18% since 2010. With fewer coppers, giving those that remain guns would be literally another weapon in their arsenal in responding to crime.

But arming officers can also make them more likely to take risks and engage in dangerous situations, according to a study by Ross Hendy, a researcher at the University of Cambridge and policeman in New Zealand, where police are generally unarmed. Guns enhance officers’ sense of safety but not necessarily their actual safety. In Norway police generally keep guns in their cars (although those in big cities are temporarily carrying weapons, in response to the threat of terrorism) but must ask for permission to use them. That means a delay of a few minutes before any shots are fired. Such delays allow officers to consider how best to approach the situation and to call for back up. On average, seven officers were present at each incident involving firearms in Norway, compared with only three in Sweden, where police routinely carry guns.

A widespread roll-out of firearms in Britain is unlikely in the near future. Armed officers volunteer for the role and are highly trained. Their number has fallen in recent years and recruiting more is proving hard. Training large numbers of coppers to use guns would be expensive, and police budgets have been cut. And police have mixed feelings about carrying guns; about a tenth of officers in London say they would rather quit their job than do so.

This article appeared in the Britain section of the print edition under the headline "Tooled up"

https://www.economist.com/news/brit...isittimeforbritainsunarmedpolicetobegivenguns
 
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German, French, Belgian police carry guns. Did that prevent the terror attacks in those countries? Did that prevent additional casualties? Difficult questions, imho. Different situations lead to different attack patterns, I would think.
 
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German, French, Belgian police carry guns. Did that prevent the terror attacks in those countries? Did that prevent additional casualties? Difficult questions, imho. Different situations lead to different attack patterns, I would think.

You can also look at the non terrorism factor,but everyday policing.
How to subdue,arrest (or whatever) a dangerous or violent individual when you are unarmed ? How to protect the general public when you aren't protected yourself ?

Maybe not arm all the British Police,but deploy in good numbers non-lethal weapons like tasers + Increase the number of armed response officers for more serious situations. I've read that in some parts of the UK,officers could wait nearly 30 minutes if not more for an armed response team to show up.

This would probably avoid the kind of situations where nearly a whole Police station has to be deployed to contain a single man armed with a machete or a knife while waiting probably dozen of minutes for an armed response team (or even a taser-armed officer) that would quickly resolve the situation. This would avoid diverting important ressources that could be much needed elsewhere.


 
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Absolutely "No" guns please. My nephew has joined South Yorkshire Constabulary. He is adament that guns are a "no, no". There is a balance sheet to be looked at. Pro is the fact that when incidents happen not having a gun is bad, bad news. However in a country of 60 million people terrorist incidents are far and between. More people die in UK by falling down stairs in accidents then terorist related incidents. Indeed contrary to what people think UK is now safer, yes safer from terrorist incidents then when I was a young man in 1980s when every week the IRA were bombing UK. We did not arm the police then and damned if we are now.

What you got to remember is where criminals have or might use guns is usually known via intelligence and those operations use armed response teams. That leaves a average bobby very low chance of running into a situation when he needs a gun or where gun will save his life. Of course you can isolate few incidents but you can't plan on few exceptions. On the contrary having guns will increase the number of guns in circulation. That will increase the chance of accidents. Also having guns will encourage gun culture. Most altercations with police in UK involving lot of talking, some shouting and some pushing or tussles. Policemen are forced to rely on their partners, their skills in de-escalating situations. Put guns into the mix and all too often a mundane incident might end with somebody dead. That is not what we want.

And Met Police is the most gun ho in UK. It probably is the closest force we have to American style police although of course that is unfair comparison. Rest of the forces are far more relaxed.

officers could wait nearly 30 minutes if not more for an armed response team to show up.
Have a look at how many officers are killed in UK and or civilians shot. That tells you the real situation, yet we have the lowst numbers of officers in recent times because of budget cuts. After 2010 police recruitment was frozen and only has been opened up. Numbers of armed officers are at historic low.
 
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