Is it Military Coup in USA inevitable?

[Penguin]

You are right that they have weapons, but why would they stand against their own Military? for this kinda democracy? on the other hand as I have shared a link in which 42% republicans favored the Military coup if the American constitution was in any kinda danger.
Read this one out please;
http://www.ips-dc.org/americans-ever-back-u-s-military-coup/

Of course, you fail to see that this poll result is entirely in line with the views of Americans about their relation with (central) government and even their constitutions. So, really it says about .... nothing.

Says Americans, the problem with us is that we do not look in a right direction, the frustration of US Citizens is mostly censored by the Zionist controlled media, their are surveys and polls that do not even make it to the publishing firms. And the reason of it? I have to even explain this to you, the reason behind this is that if US Citizens lose hope in their democratic system the entire Country will face a chaos, besides volcano don't erupt in seconds, it takes time. Read this out;
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/the-united-states-frustration-poll-shows-voters-are-fed
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-il...across-the-us-against-phony-democracy/5391058
I know the above articles are 2 years and 3 years old, but than you will be surprised that how quickly things are changing, https://www.dailystormer.com/poll-america-is-getting-fed-up-with-democracy/

For someone who has already shown to not be able to read a poll result properly (i.e. suggesting a trend when the research doesn't include trend data), your choice of references is rather... well... predictable and - in my view - at least partially of poor quality.

The fact that a pre-election poll says US voters are disstatisfied says not a whole lot because one would expect voters and politicians and media to put emphasis on that, at such a point in time. "We don't like where the country is going, we distrust the federal government, we're sick of politicians", for anyone that has looked as US political history, these are these as old as the USA itself. But it always the same in the US: they want a lot from government but they don't want to pay taxes and don't trust government. And they have two-party system that is so gridlocked nothing big ever gets done proper anymore. Interestingly, voters in 2015 has more disdain for Republicans than for Democrats (while, if you recall that other poll, Republicans were more prone to support a coup than Democrats): go interprete that for us please. By the way, isn't MSNBC Zionist controlled? So, how come you would/could trust this report anyway?

As for Global Research, lets see what folks have to say about it:

• Globalresearch is an "anti-Western" website that can't distinguish between serious analysis and discreditable junk — and so publishes both. It's basically the moonbat equivalent to Infowars or WND.
• While some of GlobalResearch's articles discuss legitimate humanitarian concerns, its view of science, economics, and geopolitics is conspiracist — if something goes wrong, the Jews West didit! The site has long been a crank magnet: If you disagree with "Western" sources on 9/11, or HAARP, or vaccines, or H1N1, or climate change, or anything published by the "mainstream" media, then GlobalResearch is guaranteed to have a page you will love.
• The website (under the domain names globalresearch.ca(link), globalresearch.org(link), globalresearch.com(link), and sister site mondialisation.ca(link)) is run by the Montreal-based non-profit The Centre for Research on Globalisation (CRG) founded by Michel Chossudovsky,[2][3] a former professor of economics at the University of Ottawa, Canada.[4]
• Whenever someone makes a remarkable claim and cites GlobalResearch, they are almost certainly wrong.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Globalresearch

And what about "The Daily Stormer"?

• The Daily Stormer (TDS) is a neo-Nazi and white supremacist "news" and commentary website founded by Andrew Anglin,[3] which associates with the alt-right.[4] Despite the similar name, the site is not connected with Stormfront, although both names are likely allusions to the brain-explodingly vile Nazi tabloid Der Stürmer
  
  ,[5] which Rightpedia claims is the predecessor of TDS.[6]
• TDS and its Führer support Russia and its Slavic untermensch glorious leader Vladimir Putin, and endorsed Donald Trump for president.[7][8] According to the SPLC, white supremacist endorsement of Trump is unprecedented, as the movement is generally skeptical of all politicians.[9] Anglin also endorsed Jeremy Corbyn in the June 2017 UK general election.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/The_Daily_Stormer

In addition to clealy anti-semitic cartoons, the link you posted states (quote verbatim): "the people’s only remaining hope is hard-core Nazism."

Which puts your claim of a Zionist Regime in the US in proper perspective, I think....

Come on dude, don't tell me you live in a cave somewhere in between North Pole and South Pole, you want me to provide you everything in here so that you don't have to use your precious brain?

So, you really don't have an answer to my question, do you... which is most probably because there is no Zionist Regime in the USA to begin with (well, unless you believe that Global Research and the Daily Stormer are really good and reliable news sources).

Well that's the difference between you and me, I dig deeper for the reliable news and you simply assume things that don't give meaning to your life. So you want me to tell you the details of my source? If What I provided to you today is not enough, than you just leave this forum, trust me their are plenty of other forums that would just suit your personality.

Now that you've exposed some of the results of your digging deeper for reliable news, I (and many poster with me, I dare to presume) do not feel reassured of your ability to find (f)actual news. And rather than engage in discussion, you would attempt to shoo me away to another forum, so you can remain here and spout junk undisturbed by the musings of normal, rational thinking people

You are hearing about it, because you don't look in a right direction, I explain you how, CIA is divided on Syria and Iraq issue, CIA is divided on Iran's issues, and North Korea Issue, CIA is divided on Qatar and gulf crisis, CIA is divided on Afghanistan issue, and CIA is divided on the issue of South China sea and Russian new Sanctions, you need to study hard dude, I highly recommend you. I asked for a debate, not for a questionnaire.

And yet you distinctly appear to be dodging debate (see your reply above this one)
As for 'studying hard', "dude", I have already achieved the highest educational degree possible, which implies I've learned to do research proper. You claim all sorts of things but you can't back up your claims with supporting material (well other than the Daily Stormer and Global Research, which frankly aren't very good material).

Yes I certainly do.

Well, in that case, cre to explain how (since it's all secret CIA stuff)?

If you don't think it's a serious thread you don't have to follow it, simple is that; why would you waste your time?

I don't have to. But bandwidth taken up by BS is annoying. Besides, it is not just my right but also my duty as forum member to assist in quality control by make good contributions and pointing out (really) bad ones.

Read all what I have just shared it with you, find it out yourself.

In short, another example of an unsubstantiated claim.

Have a nice day now, y'all!

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Yes I agree that majority of Americans own the guns, but what if their isn't a resistance at all, what if the American People want to have this happen? Look at the American world around you, and look at the people; read this and you probably will get an idea that what exactly I am talking about; remember I never said it will happen quickly, but what if Military takes over, would their be a resistance from the Public?
https://newrepublic.com/minutes/139047/millennials-hate-democracy

Needing the military for a change of government is ridiculous. That's like needing the military to settle a who-crashed-into-whom car accident. How is bringing in the military going to help figure that out?

Plus the US should be thought of as fifty countries. Like the EU. We all have our own local governments (with own police forces) that take care of most of the day to day stuff.

So it's like saying the military takes control of the EU.
What good would a military taking over that building do? It's not like anybody is going to listen to them.

 

[simple Brain]

Of course, you fail to see that this poll result is entirely in line with the views of Americans about their relation with (central) government and even their constitutions. So, really it says about .... nothing.

First of all the article I shared was just to give the audience a view, if things are discussed in society it makes the headlines, people talk about it and printing media certainly publish things about it. Now let me clarify you something that you have probably missed, and that is People in US back in 1995 ignored the view of Military coup by 98% in 2015 43% hypothetically agree to support the coup if American constitution is violated by the politicians. This is a huge number and it was back in July 2016, in July 2017 the situation is worse.
Now all we have to do is to find out that whether or not American Politicians are indeed violating the constitution and threatening the Judiciary with dire consequences?
Now read out this news just for an example, and not to forget Donald Trump is a Politician, or else, otherwise you consider him a guitarist.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...se-violation-richard-blumenthal-a7789456.html
Whether if it is against one man his business interests or the entire Political elite, it is getting into the brains of US Citizens that indeed their constitution is under attack by the elite. And if you still don't get it, than read this, come back than we will have a debate. If you do not read this and you still come back and argue with me because you hate the idea that Military coup could happen even in United States than I am afraid I have to block you, because you should listen to yourself, you even annoy yourself with your baseless statements. Read it please, it will help you to find out that why I opened this debate?
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/6/1608071/-Politicians-Being-Played-Like-Puppets

Needing the military for a change of government is ridiculous. That's like needing the military to settle a who-crashed-into-whom car accident. How is bringing in the military going to help figure that out?

Plus the US should be thought of as fifty countries. Like the EU. We all have our own local governments (with own police forces) that take care of most of the day to day stuff.

So it's like saying the military takes control of the EU.
What good would a military taking over that building do? It's not like anybody is going to listen to them.

So it means you have forgotten the Article Six, Section 2 of the US Constitution.

"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

And don't forget the fourteenth amendment.

 

[jhungary]

First of all the article I shared was just to give the audience a view, if things are discussed in society it makes the headlines, people talk about it and printing media certainly publish things about it. Now let me clarify you something that you have probably missed, and that is People in US back in 1995 ignored the view of Military coup by 98% in 2015 43% hypothetically agree to support the coup if American constitution is violated by the politicians. This is a huge number and it was back in July 2016, in July 2017 the situation is worse.
Now all we have to do is to find out that whether or not American Politicians are indeed violating the constitution and threatening the Judiciary with dire consequences?
Now read out this news just for an example, and not to forget Donald Trump is a Politician, or else, otherwise you consider him a guitarist.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...se-violation-richard-blumenthal-a7789456.html
Whether if it is against one man his business interests or the entire Political elite, it is getting into the brains of US Citizens that indeed their constitution is under attack by the elite. And if you still don't get it, than read this, come back than we will have a debate. If you do not read this and you still come back and argue with me because you hate the idea that Military coup could happen even in United States than I am afraid I have to block you, because you should listen to yourself, you even annoy yourself with your baseless statements. Read it please, it will help you to find out that why I opened this debate?
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/6/1608071/-Politicians-Being-Played-Like-Puppets



So it means you have forgotten the Article Six, Section 2 of the US Constitution.

"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

And don't forget the fourteenth amendment.

And you seems to forgot about 2nd Amendment (Not talking about the guns bits but the Militia Bits) and 32 USC 109

There are 3 different groups of Armed Organisation in the US, three group share about the same size and three group with 3 different executive power, they are the US Military, US National Guards (Army and Air) and State Militia (like State Militia , State Paramilitary Force or State Law Enforcement).

US Military is a federal force, while US National Guards is a go between and can be states or federally administrated. State Militia is a totally states organisation which cannot be call upon to the US Armed Force.

Normally for a coup to happen, there are only 1 State Force and 1 Non-State Force, when the Non-State Force growth and with or without help from some element of State Force, the Non-State Force would have been able to overthrow the State Force by either coercing or fight the state force.

But in the US, there are 3 organised Armed Force, all 3 with similar number, but with different power and ownership. Which mean all (YES, ALL) coup element are diminished to a non-starter. It's hard to imagine so let's make an example.

In a Civil war type situation, some States in the US wanted to start a military coup (South Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, and Texas) toward the federal government, they seize the Federal Asset within their states, and work with their local militia to start taking over, then the Federal government can call upon National Guards unit that were not affected to fill its rank, and then the states that align to the Federal Government will then be resist locally and making the Task all but impossible.

In a Federal Coup situation, the head of Federal Force (US Military) - SecDef starting its own coup, the head of the US military call upon all active element within the US military to join the coup (Which as SecDef, he/she does NOT have the power to do so), problem is, SecDef only control the active personnel, reserve (Which contribute to somewhere around 850,000 soldier. sailor, airmen and marine) and National Guardsmen are not under the control of SecDef, they were under the leadership of the President directly, so which mean the best scenario SecDef (or anyone above him) can muster about 1,200,000 active troop, facing off 850,000 reserve, 250,000 National Guardsmen and some 620,000 States Militia, State Trooper, LEA and so on.

US Military Structure is like that for a reason. Which prohibit any coup attempt from within or outside the government

The only way can technically to start a coup is by the Vice President to take charge of the Armed Force, which would take over 2/3 of active, reserve, guards and militia. But then one part of this is the 25th amendment by invoking A1 S2 C5 which mean this is technically a military coup, but in essence, it is a political coup, because that's where the VP get the Political Power first, then the military power.

 

[Oldman1]

U.S. citizens embrace Democracy in the states. They will never accept military coup of any kind. Perhaps it works in your country, but not in ours.

 

[simple Brain]

And you seems to forgot about 2nd Amendment (Not talking about the guns bits but the Militia Bits) and 32 USC 109

There are 3 different groups of Armed Organisation in the US, three group share about the same size and three group with 3 different executive power, they are the US Military, US National Guards (Army and Air) and State Militia (like State Militia , State Paramilitary Force or State Law Enforcement).

US Military is a federal force, while US National Guards is a go between and can be states or federally administrated. State Militia is a totally states organisation which cannot be call upon to the US Armed Force.

Normally for a coup to happen, there are only 1 State Force and 1 Non-State Force, when the Non-State Force growth and with or without help from some element of State Force, the Non-State Force would have been able to overthrow the State Force by either coercing or fight the state force.

But in the US, there are 3 organised Armed Force, all 3 with similar number, but with different power and ownership. Which mean all (YES, ALL) coup element are diminished to a non-starter. It's hard to imagine so let's make an example.

In a Civil war type situation, some States in the US wanted to start a military coup (South Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, and Texas) toward the federal government, they seize the Federal Asset within their states, and work with their local militia to start taking over, then the Federal government can call upon National Guards unit that were not affected to fill its rank, and then the states that align to the Federal Government will then be resist locally and making the Task all but impossible.

In a Federal Coup situation, the head of Federal Force (US Military) - SecDef starting its own coup, the head of the US military call upon all active element within the US military to join the coup (Which as SecDef, he/she does NOT have the power to do so), problem is, SecDef only control the active personnel, reserve (Which contribute to somewhere around 850,000 soldier. sailor, airmen and marine) and National Guardsmen are not under the control of SecDef, they were under the leadership of the President directly, so which mean the best scenario SecDef (or anyone above him) can muster about 1,200,000 active troop, facing off 850,000 reserve, 250,000 National Guardsmen and some 620,000 States Militia, State Trooper, LEA and so on.

US Military Structure is like that for a reason. Which prohibit any coup attempt from within or outside the government

The only way can technically to start a coup is by the Vice President to take charge of the Armed Force, which would take over 2/3 of active, reserve, guards and militia. But then one part of this is the 25th amendment by invoking A1 S2 C5 which mean this is technically a military coup, but in essence, it is a political coup, because that's where the VP get the Political Power first, then the military power.

Yes that's a wonderful example, and I agree that the 3 forces differ in command and control according to the US constitution. And I was completely aware of that as I have worked with US Military personals for almost 2.5 years.
But my concern over here is not about that at all, as you know that the US National guards are called Citizen Soldiers of reserves, so when their are grievousness of a general public that their constitution is violated and if Military coups happens would you believe that the US National Guards would intervene on a President order when the they themselves (US National Guards took an oath to protect the constitution)?

 

[Oldman1]

Yes that's a wonderful example, and I agree that the 3 forces differ in command and control according to the US constitution. And I was completely aware of that as I have worked with US Military personals for almost 2.5 years.
But my concern over here is not about that at all, as you know that the US National guards are called Citizen Soldiers of reserves, so when their are grievousness of a general public that their constitution is violated and if Military coups happens would you believe that the US National Guards would intervene on a President order when the they themselves (US National Guards took an oath to protect the constitution)?

If the peoples' Constitution is being violated, that is the debate through the U.S. Supreme Court. This is why we have checks and balances. For these situations. Don't need a military coup. Unless Trump decided to go against the American people which he will never have that kind of power or is able to enforce it. And with what? The military?

 

[jhungary]

Yes that's a wonderful example, and I agree that the 3 forces differ in command and control according to the US constitution. And I was completely aware of that as I have worked with US Military personals for almost 2.5 years.
But my concern over here is not about that at all, as you know that the US National guards are called Citizen Soldiers of reserves, so when their are grievousness of a general public that their constitution is violated and if Military coups happens would you believe that the US National Guards would intervene on a President order when the they themselves (US National Guards took an oath to protect the constitution)?

This is what you don't know (In fact, not too many people know)

Regular Army, Reserve, National Guard and Citizen Militia (National Guard was only called Militia by name) they have different command structure and loyal to different organisation.

Regular Army and reserve pledge loyalty to the Constitution and the President, National Guard and State Militia pledge their loyalty to the State Government.

In time of National Emergency, the power of activating the Active Reserve and National Guard fall on US President Alone, which mean the only time these force can be act as Federal Force only after the President Order it to. So the POTUS would have the ultimate right to those troop.

Of course in any case, if a coup do take place, not all National Guard would pledge their loyalty to the POTUS, but the question is, how many of those are lies within the Nation, and the Government loyalist, and how many of those support the coup. Because in order for a coup to go ahead, you would have less states (US Federal Government Power is distributed by states, with state nominating the representative into both congress and senate) and the only way a coup make sense would be the coup fraction only enjoy minor support state-wise, otherwise if majority of the states wanted Trump and the government gone, they would have go thru Impeachment instead of starting a coup. If this is the case, then the Coup fraction would have minimal National Guard Support because they have minimal States support, in turn because the National Guardsman and Militia loyal to the states instead of Federal Government.

 

[SQ8]

This is what you don't know (In fact, not too many people know)

Regular Army, Reserve, National Guard and Citizen Militia (National Guard was only called Militia by name) they have different command structure and loyal to different organisation.

Regular Army and reserve pledge loyalty to the Constitution and the President, National Guard and State Militia pledge their loyalty to the State Government.

In time of National Emergency, the power of activating the Active Reserve and National Guard fall on US President Alone, which mean the only time these force can be act as Federal Force only after the President Order it to. So the POTUS would have the ultimate right to those troop.

Of course in any case, if a coup do take place, not all National Guard would pledge their loyalty to the POTUS, but the question is, how many of those are lies within the Nation, and the Government loyalist, and how many of those support the coup. Because in order for a coup to go ahead, you would have less states (US Federal Government Power is distributed by states, with state nominating the representative into both congress and senate) and the only way a coup make sense would be the coup fraction only enjoy minor support state-wise, otherwise if majority of the states wanted Trump and the government gone, they would have go thru Impeachment instead of starting a coup. If this is the case, then the Coup fraction would have minimal National Guard Support because they have minimal States support, in turn because the National Guardsman and Militia loyal to the states instead of Federal Government.

Systems are strong enough that it will NEVER come to that.

U.S. citizens embrace Democracy in the states. They will never accept military coup of any kind. Perhaps it works in your country, but not in ours.

Regardless of embracing democracy, the system here works so there is no need for such. If there is a will to change leadership there are legal avenues and processes available to invoke it which will force any elected official not agreeing with the will of the people to act or lose representation.

 

[Oldman1]

Systems are strong enough that it will NEVER come to that.


Regardless of embracing democracy, the system here works so there is no need for such. If there is a will to change leadership there are legal avenues and processes available to invoke it which will force any elected official not agreeing with the will of the people to act or lose representation.

Oh yeah we got impeachments and new elections. Unless Trump does what the Venezuelan president Maduro and disband Congress and Supreme Court and claims dictator for life.

 

[jhungary]

Systems are strong enough that it will NEVER come to that.


Regardless of embracing democracy, the system here works so there is no need for such. If there is a will to change leadership there are legal avenues and processes available to invoke it which will force any elected official not agreeing with the will of the people to act or lose representation.

Yes, to make it simple, it's a lot easier to impeach a president and change the government than starting a coup in the US, coup is only for country that have centralized power, which normally people can do nothing but to start a military coup if they want a government gone. But in the US (and much easier in Europe and Australia) where President and PM can be replaced a lot of easily by political mean than Military mean, in Australia we have 5 Prime Minister in the last 9 year 9 months, where the elected term is 3 years in between 3 elections (1 for Julia Gillard retain PM and 1 for K Rudd losing to Tony Abbot and 1 for Turnbull retain as PM)

The premises is, it's so easy to replace the Prime Minister or President, why would anybody start a coup?

 

[Thetigerforces]

No. This is stupid.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

So it means you have forgotten the Article Six, Section 2 of the US Constitution.

"This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

And don't forget the fourteenth amendment.

But a military coup is unconstitutional in the first place...so we wouldn't recognize the military leadership as being in control.

That's like somebody throwing the captain of a ship overboard, grabbing his chair, declaring himself captain, and then saying everybody has to follow his orders because well that's the established ship rules for the last 200 years. He has no authority to claim that.

 

[Penguin]

First of all the article I shared was just to give the audience a view, if things are discussed in society it makes the headlines, people talk about it and printing media certainly publish things about it. Now let me clarify you something that you have probably missed, and that is People in US back in 1995 ignored the view of Military coup by 98% in 2015 43% hypothetically agree to support the coup if American constitution is violated by the politicians. This is a huge number and it was back in July 2016, in July 2017 the situation is worse.
Now all we have to do is to find out that whether or not American Politicians are indeed violating the constitution and threatening the Judiciary with dire consequences?
Now read out this news just for an example, and not to forget Donald Trump is a Politician, or else, otherwise you consider him a guitarist.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...se-violation-richard-blumenthal-a7789456.html
Whether if it is against one man his business interests or the entire Political elite, it is getting into the brains of US Citizens that indeed their constitution is under attack by the elite. And if you still don't get it, than read this, come back than we will have a debate. If you do not read this and you still come back and argue with me because you hate the idea that Military coup could happen even in United States than I am afraid I have to block you, because you should listen to yourself, you even annoy yourself with your baseless statements. Read it please, it will help you to find out that why I opened this debate?
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/12/6/1608071/-Politicians-Being-Played-Like-Puppets

bla bla bla bla bla.

 

[jamal18]

Many people who are aware of the total zionist control over the US government advocate this. The democratic system is not functioning correctly. There are two candidates; the pro-Israeli and the even more pro-Israeli.
The press is owned by them.