Is India really capable of building a 5th gen fighter

[Skull and Bones]

By the time Indian's fifth fighter achieved IOC, the world is already moving to sixth gen, this is still considering everything is done under timely manner.

What will be the demarcation features between 5th Gen and 6th Gen fighters?

 

[IblinI]

What will be the demarcation features between 5th Gen and 6th Gen fighters?

It's for the aero researchers and air force to find out, the boundary is not very clear for now, but it will be clear in 1-2 decades, the similar situation also happened on MBT, what is the difference between a third gen tank and fourth?

 

[Skull and Bones]

It's for the aero researchers and air force to find out, the boundary is not very clear for now, but it will be clear in 1-2 decades, the similar situation also happened on MBT, what is the difference between a third gen tank and fourth?

Because global Air Force is in the process of inducting 5th Gen fighters even in 2030s, while the elements of 5th gen fighters were in application since the 1980s.

 

[IblinI]

Because global Air Force is in the process of inducting 5th Gen fighters even in 2030s, while the elements of 5th gen fighters were in application since the 1980s.

around mid 2030s, we will see prototypes, induction happening in early 2040s, much like current 5th gen combined with 4/4.5th gen fighters.
but one thing is for sure, countries will be left the table as new each generation platform cost may double even triple.

 

[Skull and Bones]

around mid 2030s, we will see prototypes, induction happening in early 2040s, much like current 5th gen combined with 4/4.5th gen fighters.
but one thing is for sure, countries will be left the table as new each generation platform cost may double even triple.

The only evolution from 5th to 6th Gen platform seems to be Optionally manned aircraft, with swarming capability. I don't think sustained hypersonic flight will be mainstream for another 20-30 years.

 

[RealDeal]

Only possible with private sector involvement. With HAL it will meet the same fate as Teja or Arjunk.

 

[MirageBlue]

You've already answered your question in your OP. Engine tech is nowhere close to what is required (at the moment).

And so India is going to go with the F-414 for the initial batch of the AMCA.

IF the engine JV for the 110 kN turbofan with a foreign partner comes through, we may see a AMCA Mk2 with that 110 kN engine in the 2040s.

Where is credible source saying AMCA has completed CDR ?

How about Janes?

Aero India 2023- AMCA finishes systems level Critical Design Review

The critical design review (CDR) of all systems for India's Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) has been completed, a senior project official said.

Speaking to Janes at the Aero India 2023 show being held in Bangalore from 13 to 17 February, the project official said that the aircraft's 16 primary systems have completed the CDR. “This will allow us to complete the platform-level critical design review of the AMCA in one to two months,” the project official with India's Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) said.

Sixteen aircraft systems were assessed in the systems-level CDR, said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity. These include hydraulics, cockpit avionics, Integrated Vehicle Health Management (IVHM), electricals, the weapons systems, and the internal weapons bay.

When Janes last spoke to ADA in November 2022 about the project, some of the systems were still in the process of development. The agency had told Janes at the time that it was working to refine the functionality of the internal weapons bay. The official added that these technological bottlenecks have since been resolved.

ADA, which is under the Department of Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), displayed a working demonstration model of the internal weapons bay during the Aero India 2023 show. This model showed the completion of the sequence of opening of the bay, missile drop, and closing of the bay over a time span of four seconds.

However, the ADA official said that the operational bay designed by ADA will be able to open, launch the weapon, and close within a fraction of a second.

How is Turkey doing so much better than India despite economic gap and population size?

So much better? Do they have an indigenous turbofan engine?

Apart from that there is mostly parity when it comes to aerospace and defence. Some areas where Turkey has the edge like UAVs and UCAVs and some where India has the edge (SAMs, radars, tactical, BVRAAMs and ballistic missiles, nuclear submarines, etc.)

Just because the TF-X has been prototype BEFORE clearing it's CDR does not mean that it is ready to fly anytime soon.

India has a 4th gen light fighter in service whereas Turkey has just rolled out a Hurjet. India has landed it's Naval LCA on a carrier whereas Turkey is decades away from that.

 

[MirageBlue]

When do you expect the first prototype will be completed ? 2026 ?

3 years after the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) approves the funding for the program, which will release funds to build the first prototype.

If that happens in 2023, then it will be in 2026 that the first AMCA prototype will roll out.

 

[-Naval-]

It's for the aero researchers and air force to find out, the boundary is not very clear for now, but it will be clear in 1-2 decades, the similar situation also happened on MBT, what is the difference between a third gen tank and fourth?

I'm not seeing many differences in renderings of FCAS annd Tempest so far to be honest. FCAS looks a lot like the Northrup YF-23. I have a feeling the difference from 5th to 6th gen fighters is not going to be radical.

 

[Deino]

Did you even read the entire post, or are you just saying that based on your own preconceived notion,
Please explain why do you think India will not be able to make a 5th gen fighter alone

One word: ENGINES!

 

[Faceless]

One word: ENGINES!

One sentence : Engines are just one piece of the puzzle. There's more to an aircraft than just it's engines

 

[FuturePAF]

There are Stealth fighters and then there are “Stealth” fighter. The Su-57 is considered a stealth fighter but can it really said to have a reduced RCS in league with the US fighters. No one doubts India can produce a plane with planform alignment, but what is the build quality going to be? There were pictures a while ago at an air show that showed an LCA and it’s poor build quality. So many are right to have their doubts on India’s ability to make true 5th Gen aircraft.

Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, says Vietnam’s MoD

The Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, could not be confirmed that this aircraft can be called fifth-generation aircraft, published Vietnam express quoting Colonel General Phan Văn Gi…

www.google.com

 

[TheSolution]

There are Stealth fighters and then there are “Stealth” fighter. The Su-57 is considered a stealth fighter but can it really said to have a reduced RCS in league with the Us fighters.

Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, says Vietnam’s MoD

The Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, could not be confirmed that this aircraft can be called fifth-generation aircraft, published Vietnam express quoting Colonel General Phan Văn Gi…

www.google.com

Looks like it was built in someone's garage

Given Pakistan's quality control in even simple everyday areas ngl I don't expect much from Azm

 

[Faceless]

ioc in 2032-2035, what about mass production? as for our timetable, you can't predict it by just looking at a scale model or whatever it is, J20 only shown up 20 days before its first flight, anyway, let's come back to this thread after 10 years, only time will tell.
you seems to be pretty confident and doesn't take any opposite opinion, I would say it's normal when people outside India disagreed with you because of your country's track record, but I'll leave you to that.

Mass production will start just after the IOC (well altleast according to current Air Chief) so expect at least 6 aircrafts a year from 2032-35.

I take opposite opinion when it's in good faith and is genuine question or detailed explanation of where my analysis is wrong, not when it's intended as a taunt.

When @Indos pointed out about the CDR I Wholeheartedly accepted that I had not given proper sources and there is ambiguity on the status of CDR.
When he asked about the prototype timeline, I explained the timeline.

Me: writes an article on whether India will be able to make a 5th gen aircraft
IblinI: taunts me that by the time India makes 5th gen platform world would have moved on to 6th gen platform
Me: I explain why that will not be the case and urge him to not be ignorant and use taunts.
IblinI: accuses me that I don't listen to opposite opinion
Me: surprised Pikachu face and thinking when did I do that

 

[Faceless]

There are Stealth fighters and then there are “Stealth” fighter. The Su-57 is considered a stealth fighter but can it really said to have a reduced RCS in league with the US fighters. No one doubts India can produce a plane with planform alignment, but what is the build quality going to be? There were pictures a while ago at an air show that showed an LCA and it’s poor build quality. So many are right to have their doubts on India’s ability to make true 5th Gen aircraft.

Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, says Vietnam’s MoD

The Su-57 may not be built with quality workmanship, could not be confirmed that this aircraft can be called fifth-generation aircraft, published Vietnam express quoting Colonel General Phan Văn Gi…

www.google.com

True, in my original post I showed reservations on whether India would be able to maintain the required level of precision and quality control.
LCA has poor build quality, ye kab hua.
It's more likely that you saw images of the prototype that HAL uses for testing purposes.
Check out Tejas photos from aero India 2023, I don't think jets there were of poor build quality