IRIAF | News and Discussions

[Sineva]

that photo is forged i don't know why fars published it. this wings probably are maded for our f-7:
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looks identical to me. while the first scenario makes more sense but it could belong to new semi-heavy platform based on f-5:

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seems like IRIAF have other projects too:

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and MOD has this projects:

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i'm not sure if they are wasting our resources or trying to achieve the best platform design through competition

Competition is all fine and good,but if at the end of the day all you have to show for all of these projects is a large collection of models and not much else,then yes you are wasting resources.
Whats always baffled me is why no serious attempt seems to have been made to integrate the newer russian a2a and a2g weapons with the older us airframes,as the r27,r73,r60 would be far better performers than old 70s era sidewinders and sparrows.The irgc-af has developed a modern targeting pod and new stand off weapons but the regular airforce appears to have made no effort to acquire these even for evaluation,we also saw this same sort of thing with the unveiling of the af drones.Rather than going for something like the mohajer 6 or the combat proven shahed 129 and its control systems the airforce went and built their own rather unimpressive systems
I think part of the problem is simply that the af just doesnt seem to have any kind of coherent long term plans,or at least any actually realistic ones,and even for the ones that do seem somewhat realistic ie an af drone force,the execution seems rather poor.
I really hope that they get their sh!t together at some point,ideally the sooner the better.

 

[Mithridates]

Competition is all fine and good,but if at the end of the day all you have to show for all of these projects is a large collection of models and not much else,then yes you are wasting resources.
Whats always baffled me is why no serious attempt seems to have been made to integrate the newer russian a2a and a2g weapons with the older us airframes,as the r27,r73,r60 would be far better performers than old 70s era sidewinders and sparrows.The irgc-af has developed a modern targeting pod and new stand off weapons but the regular airforce appears to have made no effort to acquire these even for evaluation,we also saw this same sort of thing with the unveiling of the af drones.Rather than going for something like the mohajer 6 or the combat proven shahed 129 and its control systems the airforce went and built their own rather unimpressive systems
I think part of the problem is simply that the af just doesnt seem to have any kind of coherent long term plans,or at least any actually realistic ones,and even for the ones that do seem somewhat realistic ie an af drone force,the execution seems rather poor.
I really hope that they get their sh!t together at some point,ideally the sooner the better.

accourding to some people in AF we have the tech to make something like f-15 (did u know 80% of f-15 component are the same used in f-4?) but we lack a proper infrastructure. it seems like AF directing it's Insignificant money only to R&D. but obviously we are wasting our time and money working in parallel projects. like kowsar and kowsar88 and the zolfagar and karrar or talash and raad and even in gatling guns: nasr and muharam and like u said in kaman and shahed drone.

 

[sahureka2]

I found another image in which you see some more elements, however the quality of the photo is low, I tried to improve it and at the top appears a structure that appears to be a part of the fuselage.

Surely these images are screenshots taken from a video, video that I could not find on the web.
I ask if any of the users of this forum can locate it and share it here, so that they can view it carefully with the hope of being able to detect some other clue as to which plane they are working on.

thank !

 

[Sineva]

accourding to some people in AF we have the tech to make something like f-15 (did u know 80% of f-15 component are the same used in f-4?) but we lack a proper infrastructure. it seems like AF directing it's Insignificant money only to R&D. but obviously we are wasting our time and money working in parallel projects. like kowsar and kowsar88 and the zolfagar and karrar or talash and raad and even in gatling guns: nasr and muharam and like u said in kaman and shahed drone.

Yes,that is one of the most frustrating things that I see,the waste of resources with the pointless amount of duplication of effort and reinventing of the wheel,with the drone programs being the most glaringly obvious example because the various branches of the military want THEIR own system rather than going for an excellent preexisting system because it wasnt developed by their branch.
Iran cannot afford this level of stupidity and waste.A real and serious effort must be made between the services to coordinate both the development of proposed systems with multi service potential while ensuring the multi service adoption of the best system for the job regardless of who designed or built it.The last thing iran wants to end up like is japan during ww2 where the two air services couldnt even agree to come up with a common 30mm cannon round design let alone a gun to actually fire it from.
I agree that one does get the feeling that the af would rather design paper planes and make desktop models than seriously try to upgrade the existing airfleets capabilities sadly.

 

[Myself]

Another fake or at most a duplicate project with tons of financial benefits for bunch of corrupted and useless people in the forms of bonus, overtime, promotions, etc. At the end, what they want to accomplish is called JL-9, and it has already been made by China many years ago!
It is not clear why the word “retirement” does not exist in the AF’s dictionary? The fleet of F-7s are at the end of their lives with almost 3 decades of service. Just retire those damn garbages and pump the money to renovate the fleet of other fighters! If Iran can really make Kowsar fighters with upgraded avionics and engines, just boost its production numbers! What the hell is happening in that corrupted system? Is anybody with a little bit honesty and patriotism left in that country?

 

[TheImmortal]

accourding to some people in AF we have the tech to make something like f-15 (did u know 80% of f-15 component are the same used in f-4?) but we lack a proper infrastructure. it seems like AF directing it's Insignificant money only to R&D. but obviously we are wasting our time and money working in parallel projects. like kowsar and kowsar88 and the zolfagar and karrar or talash and raad and even in gatling guns: nasr and muharam and like u said in kaman and shahed drone.

Being able to produce 6 planes per year vs 60 is a huge difference in cost per plane and overall program cost. It’s what is economically feasible and makes sense from cost benefit analysis.

Iran does not have the proper supply chain industries and mass production lines set up to build a major fighter jet.

Obviously Iran knows what is needed, the supply chain and production lines of BMs has demonstrated that.

For some reason and it’s likely due to funds and military politics Iran hasn’t focused fully on Air Force.

People need to know Iran is under economic siege right now, expecting Iran to spend tens of billions of dollars on building The required infrastructure for domestic fighter jet production is naive.

The West is making Iran choose between keeping its civil sector a float or its military. If Iran focuses too much on military and let’s civil languish then it could face political unrest and then it won’t matter what type of fighter jets you have.

During 2009 Protests, Iran was in much stronger position economically and thus the protests didn’t grow beyond containable proportions. At the time Iranian toman was 1200 for every $1. Today is 13000 for every $1. People can barely afford meat due to rapid rising costs and depreciating currency.

Iran is not North Korea, the population won’t accept starvation and absolute poverty. Thus Iran has to walk a fine line right now. Certain things have to prioritized over others. The West is trying to pressure Iran into collapsing economically like Venezuela.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

that photo is forged i don't know why fars published it. this wings probably are maded for our f-7:
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These F-7s are F-7PGs. IRIAF has F-7Ns that have conventional Delta wings. I highly doubt the IRIAF is spending its very limited funds to bring its near useless F-7 fleet to PG standard!

 

[Myself]

These F-7s are F-7PGs. IRIAF has F-7Ns that have conventional Delta wings. I highly doubt the IRIAF is spending its very limited funds to bring its near useless F-7 fleet to PG standard!

The tip of the wings in the photo taken during Sattary’s visit clearly resembles JL-9, and not F-7PG.

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

The tip of the wings in the photo taken during Sattary’s visit clearly resembles JL-9, and not F-7PG.

Both the F-7PG and the JL-9 have similar wings! Both these aircraft are a waste of money and energy for Iran.

 

[Sineva]

I found another image in which you see some more elements, however the quality of the photo is low, I tried to improve it and at the top appears a structure that appears to be a part of the fuselage.

Surely these images are screenshots taken from a video, video that I could not find on the web.
I ask if any of the users of this forum can locate it and share it here, so that they can view it carefully with the hope of being able to detect some other clue as to which plane they are working on.

thank !

Found another pic

https://www.pintaram.com/u/iranian_defensive_power/1998181202671273724_2016887485

 

[Ray_Atek]

The wings can belong to modified su22 also.

 

[WinterNights]

On that poster, the tail appears to be like the JL-9

If this turns out to be nothing more than a project to waste money on upgrading their J-7 then the airforce is truly the most incompetent branch in the entire Iranian army.

 

[sahureka2]

looking at the model plans published by Skyshadows, the image of Sineva and the new wings that actually resemble those of F-7PG and JL-9, it seems that in reality there are technical studies for an updated and modified version of the F- 7

Always curious to see how such a version might appear, I made this photoshop

photoshop modified 14-3-2019

I wonder if there could be a small "discreet" help from China that has already realized, starting from the FT-7, JL-9, by modifying the wing and the front part of the fuselage by adopting side air intakes.

however it could be an option only if completely built from scratch and not for conversion of the elderly F-7 and if powered by the RD-33 or the same power class.
This version of the legendary Mig-21 / F-7, could have very similar performances to the JF-17 Thunder-

 

[Myself]

Both the F-7PG and the JL-9 have similar wings! Both these aircraft are a waste of money and energy for Iran.

No! They are different! Also, F-7 production line has been abondoned for years now, but the one for JL-9 not!
It is clear that Iran Air Force authorities have a comprehensive plan to enhance the capabilities of their fleet to match with other advanced world class air forces such as Sudanese Air Force!

 

[PeeD]

Without a RD-33 sized engine only the Kowsar can be produced. With nothing else produced from scratch, only upgrades can improve the fighting power.

Heavy upgrades on the other hand, train new personell, step by step a capable industry can form.

Aerodynamic design changes on the Saeghe were minimal and none was performed on the Kowsar. Then some serious work was done with the Kowsar 88 trainer.

Is it possible that the aerodynamic/airframe team of the IRIAF keep working on and improve skills by heavily modifying the F-7? That would actually make quite some sense, even if we agree that the capability increase by that F-7 upgrade would be minimal in practice.

Practical truth is that your personell in the airframe design department must keep their skills and add new skills by new projects. So this likely ist just training for a team that wants to mature their skills for something serious, once the engine guys can deliver a serious product.

Such step by step training programs worked in the avionics department and will also work for the airframe department in future. The IRIAF wants to survive and this is their only path.