Iranian UAVs | News and Discussions

[tsunset]

I'm guessing cash with the promise of more extensive military cooperation down the road. Iran will likely get the SU-30 and some SU-35s as well as S-500. We will have to wait and see.

Su-30? Didn't Iran said they aren't interested in these anymore but only Su-35?

Really, we're all talking about how the drone is effective specially its cost effectiveness, that Iran is going to give sell Fateh family missiles to Russia so they can be relieved from their Iskander reserves, all of that is great, but I'm really wondering what Iran will get in exchange of these gifts, interests of Iran first is a priority for everyone posting here as Iranian right? like Russia is going to pay cash over the counter for 700km range Zolfaghar ballistic missile?

So far people talked of space coop, the soyuz launch happened with Iranian satellite in it

If in exchange it is an "authorization" coupon ticket for buying Egyptian left Su-35 or already used Su-27 family fighters, isn't it a scam for Iran? What i think all would love too see is a transfer of technology for jet engines or a coop project but right now the speculations are on buying Su-30s and Su-35 leftovers over the counter (that any country can buy without paying an extra or giving Russia drones and missiles to get the authorization to buy them)

 

[925boy]

I'm guessing cash with the promise of more extensive military cooperation down the road.

Yes, but i suspect Iran has a barter deal for Su-35s somewhere in all these transactions.

Iran will likely get..... ... as well as S-500.

S-400s before S-500s. Russia still hasn't shipped any serious military equipment to Iran that's visible at least, so you must remember that China will probably get the S-500 before Iran does, and probably India too, but the Ukraine war might change that i guess - i would've thought Russia would've "opened up" its entire military arsenal to Iran, but i think Russia is being calibrated about it, but Iran has/is definitely receiving some valuable benefits for the military weaponry supplies during active war in Ukraine.

I am sensing Iranian govt or IRGC might be seeing this Ukraine war as a war that Iran might need to "invest in", just like the Syrian war was an "investment" for Iran....If more and more IRGC personnel keep going to Ukraine, i cannot say i dont envision Russia letting Iran raise/deploy a battalion of militias or IRGC in UKraine in the future....if the war gets bad, Russia will keep reducing its expectations in such exchanges with outside countries - aka Iran gains more leverage. Iranian IRGC is probably seeing Ukraine as a "last stand" battle to suck out and dry up NATO - once and for all, AND PROFITABLY AND INDIRECTLY - its too big an opportunity - this war will define the next century in our world, and the changes are so clear today- 1.2 billion of western and old and wealthy peoples, VS 6.1 bn of people from and aligned with the majority of the developing world - America will not win this time- i'm not entertaining counters on that.

LEGEND banned me from that Ukraine thread for a week for saying that US govt was running low on ammunition to supply Ukraine, and weeks later, ITS GETTING CONFIRMED

 

[tsunset]

Yes, but i suspect Iran has a barter deal for Su-35s somewhere in all these transactions.

S-400s before S-500s. Russia still hasn't shipped any serious military equipment to Iran that's visible at least, so you must remember that China will probably get the S-500 before Iran does, and probably India too, but the Ukraine war might change that i guess - i would've thought Russia would've "opened up" its entire military arsenal to Iran, but i think Russia is being calibrated about it, but Iran has/is definitely receiving some valuable benefits for the military weaponry supplies during active war in Ukraine.

I am sensing Iranian govt or IRGC might be seeing this Ukraine war as a war that Iran might need to "invest in", just like the Syrian war was an "investment" for Iran....If more and more IRGC personnel keep going to Ukraine, i cannot say i dont envision Russia letting Iran raise/deploy a battalion of militias or IRGC in UKraine in the future....if the war gets bad, Russia will keep reducing its expectations in such exchanges with outside countries - aka Iran gains more leverage. Iranian IRGC is probably seeing Ukraine as a "last stand" battle to suck out and dry up NATO - once and for all, AND PROFITABLY AND INDIRECTLY - its too big an opportunity - this war will define the next century in our world, and the changes are so clear today- 1.2 billion of western and old and wealthy peoples, VS 6.1 bn of people from and aligned with the majority of the developing world - America will not win this time- i'm not entertaining counters on that.

LEGEND banned me from that Ukraine thread for a week for saying that US govt was running low on ammunition to supply Ukraine, and weeks later, ITS GETTING CONFIRMED

Would Iran benefit from S-400 compared to what it can do with Bavar and its upcoming upgrades? I think it would benefit to wait until Bavar are mass produced and complement air defense with various systems for each layer, as for S-500 IRGC said they are working on anti-satellite and ballistic systems, so it may be an indicator of an upgraded Bavar like HQ-19

Anyways only time will tell what Iran will get for its investment, waiting for concrete sales of real systems or ToT to Iran, never saw that for decades since the S-300PMU2s, i guess that since they have less Isreali and US influence over who to not provide weapons to, it should facilitate... normally...

But really, if what Iran is getting in return would be a coupon ticket that allows Iran to purchase leftovers Su-30 or Su-35... Maybe a production line in Iran for them but we see the problem that India got with the Su-30MKI production. Or maybe Su-35 designed for Iran with components Iran could ask to install (active radar, let it carry Iranian air to air/ground missiles, if i recall Russia just sells R-77 export version with 110km max range which is very low compared to western equivalents and what Iran ennemies have and i really doubt Russia would even let Iran touch R-37M missile

 

[sha ah]

I highly doubt if Iran gave Russia anything for free. Russia most likely gave Iran cash and perhaps promised to give Iran the option of purchasing weapons like the SU-30 / SU-35 and / S-400 / S-500 after the Ukraine war.

Russia used up most of their missiles stockpile, which is why in recent weeks they have been using S-300 missiles for surface to surface attacks. They can surely build Iskander missiles and drones but it will take time to ramp up production and this is compounded by the recent sanctions imposed on them by the west.

Remember Iran has been under sanctions for a long time, meanwhile it will take time for Russia to adapt. Iran has a large stockpile and can offer the Russians competitive rates, so it just makes sense for both parties.

Currently Russia is in no position to sell weapons to anyone, but after the war it will be business as usual. The sheer amount of munitions being expended during this war is mind boggling. Even the US has depleted a significant amount of its stockpiles, to the point where its reserves have reached dangerously low levels and yet the Ukrainians still want more.

Su-30? Didn't Iran said they aren't interested in these anymore but only Su-35?

Really, we're all talking about how the drone is effective specially its cost effectiveness, that Iran is going to give sell Fateh family missiles to Russia so they can be relieved from their Iskander reserves, all of that is great, but I'm really wondering what Iran will get in exchange of these gifts, interests of Iran first is a priority for everyone posting here as Iranian right? like Russia is going to pay cash over the counter for 700km range Zolfaghar ballistic missile?

So far people talked of space coop, the soyuz launch happened with Iranian satellite in it

If in exchange it is an "authorization" coupon ticket for buying Egyptian left Su-35 or already used Su-27 family fighters, isn't it a scam for Iran? What i think all would love too see is a transfer of technology for jet engines or a coop project but right now the speculations are on buying Su-30s and Su-35 leftovers over the counter (that any country can buy without paying an extra or giving Russia drones and missiles to get the authorization to buy them)

 

[Hack-Hook]

perhaps promised to give Iran the option of purchasing weapons like the SU-30 / SU-35 and / S-400 / S-500 after the Ukraine war.

none is needed by Iran and after this fantastic performance in Ukraine who ever buy Russians aircraft again

Russia used up most of their missiles stockpile, which is why in recent weeks they have been using S-300 missiles for surface to surface attacks. They can surely build Iskander missiles and drones but it will take time to ramp up production and this is compounded by the recent sanctions imposed on them by the west.

till they stablish supply routes the only thing they can build is frag-7

 

[sha ah]

In Ukraine the Russian airforce has conducted something like 3000 sorties. The reason why they can't dominate the airspace is because Ukraine has a significant number of mobile air defense systems and NATO countries keep supplying them.

You can't compare Afghanistan or Iraq for example to Ukraine. Right now as we speak Russia is working on wearing down Ukraine's air defenses but they have so many mobile units and NATO countries are giving them more all the time.

This is from today. Russian Lancet drone destroying Ukrainian BUK-M1 and M777.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1586389649064222720

Keep in mind, the last time the US went to war against industrialized powers was in WW2 and during the last year of that war the US lost 7000 tanks and tank destroyers. In total in WW2 the US lost almost 100,000 planes.

Iran's airforce is badly in need of new hardware. The F-4s are already 50 years old. How long should they keep using them ? another 10 years ? 20 years ? So until they're 70 years old ?

The only jet Iran can build is F-5 variants and the F-5 is too outdated and it's a light aircraft. Iran needs new hardware and something that can carry a decent payload.

The S-500 can shoot down hypersonic missiles in space. Iran won't have anything like that for atleast a decade. I mean there's a reason why even China purchased the S-400 and India risked sanctions to get their hands on the S-400. When it comes to air defenses Russia is the best.

none is needed by Iran and after this fantastic performance in Ukraine who ever buy Russians aircraft again

till they stablish supply routes the only thing they can build is frag-7

 

[sha ah]

The Israeli Harpy drone which is very similar in design, costs $70,000 each. Iran is reportedly selling Shahed-136 for $20,000 each. It likely costs Iran much less. Western weapons manufacturers can't compete with Iran. One of the biggest issues is that western weapons are produced with the primary goal of making large amounts of profit. Even Colonel Douglas MacGregor admitted this recently.


Israeli Harpy kamikaze drone

Ukraine minister tells Iranian counterpart: Stop sending weapons

Ukraine’s Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba says he spoke by phone with Iran’s Foreign Minister Hossein Amirabdollahian.

www.aljazeera.com

From the above article:

29 Oct 2022

Ukraine’s Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba has said he demanded Tehran stop providing Russia with weapons in a phone call with his Iranian counterpart Hossein Amirabdollahian.

Ukrainian officials and their Western allies have accused Iran of providing so-called “kamikaze” drones to Russia, which have recently been used to devastating effect by Moscow’s forces in strikes aimed at Ukrainian infrastructure.



BUT wait a second, I thought that Ukraine was shooting them all down and they were just a nuance that they could brush off. So then which one is it ? Why is Ukraine's foreign minister now begging Iran to stop ?

People don't realize this but many of the targets hit with this drone are not even mentioned by Russia. Sometimes we only find out about them through sources like twitter and keep in mind, in Ukraine it is illegal to photograph or videotape destroyed military equipment or facilities.

I personally believe that Russia doesn't want to put too much of a spotlight on these weapons since everyone knows that they're Iranian and not Russian. Here's something else to think about. If Russia bought 2400 UAVs from Iran, how many of them were Mohajer-6s ? So far Ukraine has showed off one Mohajer-6 which they captured ? So then where are the rest?

I mean Russia must have purchased atleast a few dozen Mohajer-6s right ? Yet we're not seeing any footage from them. Funny thing is the Russians haven't even mentioned it like the Shahed-136 which they renamed to Geran-2. They haven't even given the Mohajer-6 a designation, but it's likely being used to wreak havoc on Ukrainian positions.

Anyways I feel bad for the Ukrainians, imagine how they're going to react once Arash-2 hits them. And then imagine the outrage from the west once Iranian missiles start annihilating their expensive toys ? They're going to lose their minds. LOL

 

[Hack-Hook]

In Ukraine the Russian airforce has conducted something like 3000 sorties. The reason why they can't dominate the airspace is because Ukraine has a significant number of mobile air defense systems and NATO countries keep supplying them.

You can't compare Afghanistan or Iraq for example to Ukraine. Right now as we speak Russia is working on wearing down Ukraine's air defenses but they have so many mobile units and NATO countries are giving them more all the time.

This is from today. Russian Lancet drone destroying Ukrainian BUK-M1 and M777.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1586389649064222720

Keep in mind, the last time the US went to war against industrialized powers was in WW2 and during the last year of that war the US lost 7000 tanks and tank destroyers. In total in WW2 the US lost almost 100,000 planes.

Iran's airforce is badly in need of new hardware. The F-4s are already 50 years old. How long should they keep using them ? another 10 years ? 20 years ? So until they're 70 years old ?

The only jet Iran can build is F-5 variants and the F-5 is too outdated and it's a light aircraft. Iran needs new hardware and something that can carry a decent payload.

The S-500 can shoot down hypersonic missiles in space. Iran won't have anything like that for atleast a decade. I mean there's a reason why even China purchased the S-400 and India risked sanctions to get their hands on the S-400. When it comes to air defenses Russia is the best.

build the damn , aircraft , beside the engine all other parts are there .
and the last time they went against industrialized opponent was in korea war that they effectively fought china .
those mobile air-defence are effectively glorified man-pads . if Russians airforce was a modern airforce , they were no threat at all.

and 3000 sortie in 7 month mean 420 each month or 1.4 each day .
how many sortie Nato flew during Iraq war ?
russia can't deal with buk and S-300 of 80s tell alot about how effective their air force are . the fact that their most modern aircraft uses FAB-500 in this war tell how modern they are .
even and F-16v can eat mighty Su-35s for breakfast , launch and dinner. before that Ibris-e can even detect it the e-warfare capability of the airplane is rudimentary .

i rather go buy JF-17 block III from pakistan than Su-35 from Russia

The S-500 can shoot down hypersonic missiles in space. Iran won't have anything like that for atleast a decade. I mean there's a reason why even China purchased the S-400 and India risked sanctions to get their hands on the S-400. When it comes to air defenses Russia is the best.

or bavar is far better than s-400 in radar department and have missiles upto 300km of range , more than than export version of S-400
heck even our 13th of khordad and 15th of khordad right now have missile with equal range to export version of s-400
i don;t knew why china bought s-400 but best indian indigenous airdefense is equal to kub , yes kub not even buk

 

[Hack-Hook]

his is from today. Russian Lancet drone destroying Ukrainian BUK-M1 and M777.

the second strike was a dummy

And then imagine the outrage from the west once Iranian missiles start annihilating their expensive toys ? They're going to lose their minds. LOL

for that Russia must find where they are , what we saw in this war show they have serious problem in that department

 

[tsunset]

build the damn , aircraft , beside the engine all other parts are there .
and the last time they went against industrialized opponent was in korea war that they effectively fought china .
those mobile air-defence are effectively glorified man-pads . if Russians airforce was a modern airforce , they were no threat at all.

and 3000 sortie in 7 month mean 420 each month or 1.4 each day .
how many sortie Nato flew during Iraq war ?
russia can't deal with buk and S-300 of 80s tell alot about how effective their air force are . the fact that their most modern aircraft uses FAB-500 in this war tell how modern they are .
even and F-16v can eat mighty Su-35s for breakfast , launch and dinner. before that Ibris-e can even detect it the e-warfare capability of the airplane is rudimentary .

i rather go buy JF-17 block III from pakistan than Su-35 from Russia


or bavar is far better than s-400 in radar department and have missiles upto 300km of range , more than than export version of S-400
heck even our 13th of khordad and 15th of khordad right now have missile with equal range to export version of s-400
i don;t knew why china bought s-400 but best indian indigenous airdefense is equal to kub , yes kub not even buk

I don't think this is what he meant, i think he meant (and i too) that S-400 would only benefit Iran, so Iran can 1: have various systems on each layer of the air defense, something like China mixing up HQ-9, S-400, Iran could do the same with Bavar mixed with S-300 and S-400 and 2: have time to produce in large numbers the bavar, and still having more protected airspace while producing Bavar and its variants

For the aircrafts i think a lot of people now have the idea that Russian aircrafts are very bad against anything that is from the west, but it could only benefit Iran if it is not bought over the counter, just having modern aircrafts which isn't dating back from the 90s is benefiting, China bought Su-35 also to complement their air force, after no one knows why Russia are using FAB instead of PGM, it may be because indeed they are short on these or that they do not want to use them on the theater which is paradoxical so the first one is more probable

I've got the same view that Iran would benefit more from JF-17 block III for its use (light fighter to protect its airspace, not a big aggressor Su-35) i would've liked also a kind of coop with China or China letting export J-10C instead of J-10A, don't know if J-16 are available for export, but for example the J-31 could compete with western F-35

But all of that above is just not confirmed at all, China didn't made offers for decade beside J-10A and Iran is in crucial need of modern fighters, so it would only benefit Iran to get any modern fighter or a ToT, whether Su-35 or JF-17, but Iran have to do with what it can do, not wait decades until China makes an offer, also Iran could concentrate on an engine development if there is a ToT with Russia, and still having one or two squadrons of 4++ gen fighters (Su-35) to defend its airspace or conduct strikes on nearby terrorists, Iran have to do with what it can

 

[Hack-Hook]

Iran could do the same with Bavar mixed with S-300 and S-400 and 2: have time to produce in large numbers the bavar, and still having more protected airspace while producing Bavar and its variants

you think what's the production capabilities of Russia these days . and we can also mix the systems , Bavar , with 15th of khoedad with 3rd of khordad , with tactical mersad , with Majid. with oghab with zoobin, with......... alot more indigenous design , in one sector our capabilities have no problem and that's our air defense , we don't need Russian or Europeans or American or anyplace else air defense system in this sector we are capable to compete with anyone else

For the aircrafts i think a lot of people now have the idea that Russian aircrafts are very bad against anything that is from the west, but it could only benefit Iran if it is not bought over the counter, just having modern aircrafts which isn't dating back from the 90s is benefiting, China bought Su-35 also to complement their air force, after no one knows why Russia are using FAB instead of PGM, it may be because indeed they are short on these or that they do not want to use them on the theater which is paradoxical so the first one is more probable

no they bought it more for political reason after all their own j-16 is 100 time better than su-35 is nothing but Su-27m just like T-90 which is nothing but T-72BU that russia renamed to sell it to India

also Iran could concentrate on an engine development if there is a ToT with Russia, and still having one or two squadrons of 4++ gen fighters (Su-35) to defend its airspace or conduct strikes on nearby terrorists, Iran have to do with what it can

the problem is because of the lack of modern radar and E-warfare system those su-35 fall out of the sky in front of mirage-2000 , rafale , f-15 and f-16 or JF-17 and J-10s of our neighbors
for gods sake even our own lowsar have more modern electronic inside it than su-35

 

[Sineva]

Thanks for the clarification. The Harop though has an onboard camera, so it can conduct reconnaissance, it can loiter and dive onto a target.

The Omid and Ababil-2 are similar to the Harop in terms of their general shape but they do not feature onboard cameras. Of course there's always cheap UCAVs like Mohajer-6. Then of course Iran has more advanced, expensive variants like the Shahed-149 (Gaza). However those are not loitering munitions. Of course there is Iran's type 358 loitering munition which is similar to the Russian Lancet uav. It features an imaging infrared seeker. Anyways

Harop

View attachment 890403

Ababil-2

View attachment 890404

Omid UAV

View attachment 890401

358 loitering munition

View attachment 890407

Interesting video about Shahed-136 drones

The ababil 2s that we saw being produced in tajikistan have had their nose cones redesigned to enable the use of a small optronic turret.

Plus there were older versions of the ababil 2 that used a simple,probably daylight only,video camera turret.
So the option is certainly there if wanted or needed.

I honestly wouldnt be surprised if the omid is eventually fitted out with some sort of optronic turret as well.

 

[Sineva]

Kaman 12 and ababil 3 fitted out with ew payloads during the recent war games

In the army's electronic warfare exercise, the Air Force 707 aircraft coordinated with Kaman 12 drones equipped with the new Tiam and Fater radar systems and Ababil 3 and 4 drones successfully performed the electronic support operation of the attacking micro-birds in order to accurately detect and identify the location of the target's radar sites and communication networks

https://twitter.com/x/status/1585639064069234690

 

[tsunset]

the problem is because of the lack of modern radar and E-warfare system those su-35 fall out of the sky in front of mirage-2000 , rafale , f-15 and f-16 or JF-17 and J-10s of our neighbors
for gods sake even our own lowsar have more modern electronic inside it than su-35

If Iran doesn't buy over the counter, could they just ask Russia to change some components for Iran needs just like many country did like China Su-30MKK? Ask them to put an active radar like Zhuk and other things that suit Iran needs, such hate just because of the Irbis E pesa?

you think what's the production capabilities of Russia these days . and we can also mix the systems , Bavar , with 15th of khoedad with 3rd of khordad , with tactical mersad , with Majid. with oghab with zoobin, with......... alot more indigenous design , in one sector our capabilities have no problem and that's our air defense , we don't need Russian or Europeans or American or anyplace else air defense system in this sector we are capable to compete with anyone else

no they bought it more for political reason after all their own j-16 is 100 time better than su-35 is nothing but Su-27m just like T-90 which is nothing but T-72BU that russia renamed to sell it to India

the problem is because of the lack of modern radar and E-warfare system those su-35 fall out of the sky in front of mirage-2000 , rafale , f-15 and f-16 or JF-17 and J-10s of our neighbors
for gods sake even our own lowsar have more modern electronic inside it than su-35

I meant diverse system for each layer, not in total, in the long range one (+200km range) as far as i know Iran have B-373 and S-300PMU2, ASAT and ABM Bavar haven't been shown yet but S-400 can add a supplement on the long range SAM layer and cover longer ranges while developing Bavar variants in security and assurance this is why i think it can only benefit Iran having some of them even they would be surpassed by next Iranian systems in the future

I thought that 15th Kordad was meant to replace MIM23 batteries as well with 3rd khordad, Zoobin Majid Aras for short range against drones and cruise missiles

Iran should never overestimate their enemy real capabilities, this isn't because all aircrafts you mentionned comes from the west that are surhuman performances, we didn't saw these jets in action other than strikes against weakened country like Syria and Afghanistan, never against an industrialised country with equivalent fighters, Russia is fighting against Ukraine backed by NATO nearly completely, they aren't fighting some wahhabi warlord in desert...

I mean look in Yemen, Houthis manage to shut down F-15E and eventually EF-2000 using Iranian systems and Apache with a strela, overestimating the enemy capabilities is the worst thing to do

Look at how Iranian drones, which they said sucked and will be destroyed easily by NATO systems... aren't, beside normal morale war propaganda

 

[sha ah]

If Iran could build something better than an F-5, they would have done it already. If SU-35 is such garbage as you claim then why is Turkey considering it ? Why did China buy it despite the fact that they can actually build domestically designed modern fighter jets, unlike Iran ?

If you really think JF-17 is better than SU-35,then I don't know what else to say to you. JF-17 is okay... but look at the countries that want it, Nigeria ? That speaks for itself. Also China was not industrialized during the Korean war. It was still largely an agrarian society.

Again Russia is not up against Ukraine by itself. It's up against Ukraine with massive support from NATO, 30+ developed countries that are constantly pumping weapons, spare parts, intelligence, money, training, mercenaries, etc into Ukraine.

Also after the Soviet Union collapsed, Ukraine inherited hundreds of air defense batteries. This is not a joke. Since 2014 they've brought countless numbers of them out of storage, they've upgraded them, received parts and entire systems from NATO countries, not to mention new systems from the west. You can't compare Ukraine to Iraq or Afghanistan, that's just silly.

You really believe the narrative that western weapons systems are inherently superior ? Then why won't any western nations send their tanks into Ukraine ? The US has sent Bradley fighting vehicles and many of them have been annihilated. Their M777's were supposed to be a game changer, most have been destroyed or have maintenance issues.

Look at what happened to the Saudi Abrams tanks in Yemen or Turkish Leopard 2 tanks in Syria. Imagine what would happen in Ukraine, they would get torn to pieces easily. It's different going up against a formidable adversary with the will to fight or a professional military with modern defensive equipment

build the damn , aircraft , beside the engine all other parts are there .
and the last time they went against industrialized opponent was in korea war that they effectively fought china .
those mobile air-defence are effectively glorified man-pads . if Russians airforce was a modern airforce , they were no threat at all.

and 3000 sortie in 7 month mean 420 each month or 1.4 each day .
how many sortie Nato flew during Iraq war ?
russia can't deal with buk and S-300 of 80s tell alot about how effective their air force are . the fact that their most modern aircraft uses FAB-500 in this war tell how modern they are .
even and F-16v can eat mighty Su-35s for breakfast , launch and dinner. before that Ibris-e can even detect it the e-warfare capability of the airplane is rudimentary .

i rather go buy JF-17 block III from pakistan than Su-35 from Russia


or bavar is far better than s-400 in radar department and have missiles upto 300km of range , more than than export version of S-400
heck even our 13th of khordad and 15th of khordad right now have missile with equal range to export version of s-400
i don;t knew why china bought s-400 but best indian indigenous airdefense is equal to kub , yes kub not even buk