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Iranian Chill Thread

You're mixing things up. Greatest nationalist dynasty in Iran, the sassanids, were not secular, clerics (mobeds) had big influence. You're confusing globalist-liberalism with conservative-nationalism (which does care about the country, family and public decency).

There's no confusion on my part about these distinct political currents. I never pretended authentic nationalists are endorsing the globalist liberal agenda (although you know better than me, that many of those who continue to call themselves nationalist, have completely switched to globalism and liberalism i.e. Reza Pahlavi-supporting monarchists and so on - the separation line is getting increasingly thin). But I'm saying authentic nationalists are failing to acknowledge that liberalization of laws will not magically confine itself to the dress code, should the latter be decisively loosened. Because this whole movement is not being led by nationalists, it's controlled by liberals.

About the non-secular nature of ancient Iranian empire, the Sassanid model can no longer be replicated because let's face it, Zoroastrianism is no longer a proper live religion of the masses. Outside the traditional, tiny Zoroastrian community, its followers - and generally followers of bastan-gera nationalism, are in the minority and even to the latter, Zoroastrianism has devolved into an identitarian marker rather than an actual, concrete religious practice. Hence why there can be no religious-oriented bastan-gera nationalism in the context of present day Iran, and hence why nationalists de facto have no choice but to settle for a secular state if they were to call the shots. They aren't liberals nor globalists, that's true (and I didn't claim otherwise), but they are pretty much compelled to some sort of a secularist stance because their religion of reference can impossibly serve as a basis for governance given its mere symbolic nature nowadays (secularism is not synonymous with liberalism or globalism).

Also and more importantly, I clearly distinguished between conservative nationalists and liberal globalists in my previous post. If you read it again, I'm sure you'll notice. What I'm saying, is that nationalists tend not to realize that the overwhelming majority of those who oppose hejab in Iranian society, have very different motivations in this regard than the nationalists themselves. In other words, please don't assume that these people you see complaining about the dress code are in line with your outlook, they usually aren't. It's the globalist liberal agenda they're embracing, because it's the enemy's globalist liberal propaganda which has taken possession of their minds - not nationalism. This is the bitter reality.

The attack on family values, marriage and promotion of new sexual identities and genders is already happening separately from the hijab issue. "anti-hijabism" is a golden tool in zionist tool-box to promote those ideas. Once you break this tool and make the likes of massih alinejads go bankrupt and cry, then you will create a big blow to their wider agenda.

I agree that the attack on family values, marriage and promotion of new sexual identities and genders is already happening separately from the hijab issue. However, the nefarious process can never reach its conclusion unless current laws based on Islamic sharia are thoroughly revised. These laws and those who wish to see them upheld, represent a major stumbling block for the enemy and its social engineers. There's only so much they can attain by way of subterfuges in the framework of the existing Islamic legal setting. At the end of the day, the enemy will not be having its way as long as homosexuality remains illegal, as long as same-sex marriage is strictly banned, as long as the subversive narratives aren't taught to children at school nor promoted in the national media.

This, along with what I explained above, is why I disagree with the idea that liberalizing the dress code will simply deprive the enemy of an item its toolbox. Whether we like it or not, it's the liberal crowd not nationalists who are making up the great majority of the anti-hejab demographic. These individuals and those brainwashing them from abroad will feel massively empowered if authorities give in to their demands about the dress code. They will mechanically go on pressing for amended legislation in the other areas you listed. If this dynamic is triggered, the Islamic Republic will be pressured to cede on all these topics one by one.
 
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تایوان بعد زنزله

اون خونه مسکن مهریشون به‌کنار...​
دلیل این همه سیم و کابل‌کشی تو خیابون چی هست؟ مگه این کشور از کشورهای جهان اولی و پیشرفته متحد امریکا نیست؟ به عراق در روزگار جنگ‌زده بودنش میخوره تا تصویری که از تایوان منتشر کرده‌اند...

به عنوان مثال شرکت تراشه‌سازی TSMC که بزرگترین شرکت تولیدکننده نیمه رسانا تو دنیا هست تو همین کشور قرار داره طوری که فقط چند کشور توانایی همچین تولیداتی دارند... اکثر سی‌پی‌یوها، کارت گرافیک‌ها، رایانه‌ها و ابزارهای ارتباطی زیربناشون همین شرکت هست...

A3867241-F820-4E15-B8D7-3B0035C22FC6.jpeg
 
>If the statement "forcing people to do what they don't want will not work" were correct, having >any form of laws would be pointless.

Laws are usually based on cultural norms and standards that the vast majority of any given society will agree upon. That's why they work, not neccessarily because they're forced on everyone.

>Few people like paying taxes, yet taxes work

With taxes and bills, you could argue that the majority of people don't like paying them, but the majority also want infrastructure, roads, street lights, clean drinking water, heating, electricity grids and all those things will not be possible without taxation and paying yours bills on time.

>They will not stop until grown men can go into playgrounds and show their d**ks to kids

So you're implying that in liberal societies where women don't wear hijabs, it's common for grown men to go into playgrounds and show their d**ks to kids ? How did you even come up with this nonsense ?

Sounds to me like you're using the slippery slope argument here and trying to make it sound as if there are only two choices. You're also implying that the second choice has to come with all these strings attached, when in reality it doesn't. Realistically in between those two choices there is a middle ground that could very well be a possibility.

I mean you can always use brute force but it will always lead to mixed results, bent up anger, people becoming disenfranchised, people rebelling against the rules, people abandoning the system, etc.

In this day and age, with universal education and high rates of literacy, the proliferation of technology and the internet, I don't think any government should be telling people what to do. Rather I think people should be telling their government what to do on their behalf.

Ideally the government should represent peoples interests and do what they want, not the other way around. But on the other hand, the world is not perfect and often times a genuine democracy can turn into an authoritarian oligarchy.

If the statement "forcing people to do what they don't want will not work" were correct, having any form of laws would be pointless.
Few people like paying taxes, yet taxes work
Many people want to break traffic laws, yet traffic laws generally work.
The reason we see so much controversy over hijab laws is because there is a well-funded and well-supported force trying to undermine these laws, and most of it comes from outside Iran.
That is why the hijab law was mostly uncontroversial before the early 2000s. It became controversial after foreign forces started undermining it through satellite TV and internet.
I have a question for members who want the hijab law to be removed: What do you think is going to happen if removing headscarves were legalized? Do you think liberals will say "thank you" and just go home.
No they wont. Not once in the history of the world have liberals been content and stopped at a concession. After headscarves they will ask to remove their pants, then tops, then bare breasts...
They will not stop until grown men can go into playgrounds and show their d**ks to kids.
In the end we will have to fight for a trench
And I prefer we fight for the first trench

Man these MKO guys never quit do they. LOL

 
So you're implying that in liberal societies where women don't wear hijabs, it's common for grown men to go into playgrounds and show their d**ks to kids ? How did you even come up with this nonsense ?

Sounds to me like you're using the slippery slope argument here and trying to make it sound as if there are only two choices. You're also implying that the second choice has to come with all these strings attached, when in reality it doesn't. Realistically in between those two choices there is a middle ground that could very well be a possibility.
Yes.
Just look up some of the things that happened in front of kids in the west in the latest pride month. I would post them here but I fear getting banned.
The slippery slope argument has always proven true when it comes to liberals. You talk about a middle ground, but on what legs is your middle ground going to stand on? If it's freedom then you should allow nudity. If it's religion then you should enforce religious law. If it's public opinion, well public opinion can very easily changed and manipulated by those who control the media.

Also, a lot of members are saying that hijab shouldn't be enforced because the majority don't want it. May I remind you that the majority of Iranians wanted the JCPOA (and arguably still do).
 
Why are you jumping to extremes though ? You're implying that women not wearing hejab will inevitably lead to nudity, moral degradation and pedophilia ? But that's not necessarily true. Also remember correlation does not equal causation. A society can still experience moral / cultural degradation or crises, even with women wearing head scarves.

Just look at the Taliban in Afghanistan for example. Now more than 90% of the population is living below the poverty line and Afghans are leaving the country in droves. Women who don't want to cover their entire face, want education and wantto be able to work are beaten, imprisoned, etc.

When you have a large sector of society that opposes their government policies or the government in general, people will not cooperate or contribute to that government. They won't pay taxes. That country will not grow or flourish in any way, shape or form. People will not trust basic or even essential institutions. For example, they won't put their money into banks.

Yes the majority in a society can and often times are wrong. However an individual or group of elitists can also be wrong. The biggest issue though with authoritarian governments is that they tend to be less likely to quickly adapt or change their policies even when it's plainly obvious that they're wrong.

Especially when you have a strongman with a powerful cult of personality. Like the saying goes, absolute power corrupts absolutely. This eventually leads to an atmosphere where any criticism of official state policies becomes tantamount to blasphemy.

Yes.
Just look up some of the things that happened in front of kids in the west in the latest pride month. I would post them here but I fear getting banned.
The slippery slope argument has always proven true when it comes to liberals. You talk about a middle ground, but on what legs is your middle ground going to stand on? If it's freedom then you should allow nudity. If it's religion then you should enforce religious law. If it's public opinion, well public opinion can very easily changed and manipulated by those who control the media.

Also, a lot of members are saying that hijab shouldn't be enforced because the majority don't want it. May I remind you that the majority of Iranians wanted the JCPOA (and arguably still do).
 
Iran's new Science and Technology chief:

"President Raisi designated Ruhollah Dehghani Firoozabadi, an aerospace engineering professor at Tehran-based Sharif University of Technology, for the post".

I see this an indication that Iran is now going to become more serious about Aviation and Space sectors..that 75 seat passenger plane is my pointer for this to happen..we just have to wait and see...
 
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