India's Air Force to buy last remaining US-built C-17

[wiseone2]

HAL has worked on two civilian transport types over the last five decades: producing 89 Avros between 1964 and 1984, followed by manufacture of the Dornier Do-228 passenger/utility aircraft from 1984.

“Considering the current situation where a limited number of models of 50-80 seater aircraft are already developed and in service.

HAL has asked for an airplane not only capable of regular passenger and cargo operations but also have the ability to be configured for military roles such as: transport, maritime surveillance and electronic intelligence gathering.

building a Do-228 under license is a smart move
it is unlikely HAL will ever get to build C-130 or C-17 class aircraft under license

 

[Hindustani78]

building a Do-228 under license is a smart move
it is unlikely HAL will ever get to build C-130 or C-17 class aircraft under license

HAL has manufactured HS-748 turboprop 48 seater aircraft during 1960-1984 and it is still in service to its air worthiness standard. Also, currently manufacturing/maintaining the 19 seat Dornier DO-228 aircraft for different customers (Civil & Defense).

“Considering the current situation where a limited number of models of 50-80 seater aircraft are already developed and in service.

Maximum all up weight shall be between 20,000 to 50,000 kgs.

Civil version:
50-80 passengers with luggage, cabin crew and attendants

Non-civil version:
2 Pilots, 2 observers, 6 spare crews in maritime recc. Role
Under wing pylons for carriage of stores.
Pods for carriage of dispersant for pollution control.
Radar, INS, GPS, IR scanners.

Flares light armament and rocket pods etc.

Maximum cruise – not less than 450km/hr at 20,000 ft and above
Patrol speeds: 400 km/hr

Field Operations: Should be able to operate from ill equipped air fields in nearall weather conditions and CAT-II landing without any ground support,
Service ceiling: Not less than 20,000 ft and with one engine the ceiling shall be in excess of 15,000 ft
Endurance: Around 8 to 10 hours at patrol speeds with 10% reserve fuel and mission load Range: Not less than 1000 km with 10 % reserve & full payload.
Options for Standard Range, Extended Range and Long Range can be included in the response.
Take off field length: Less than 1200 meters at MTOW, SL ISA + 20° C
Landing: Landing distance less than 1400 meters.


The aircraft should be in service for at least 25years. The fatigue life for the aircraft should be:
About 90,000 hours of flying
About 72,000 landings

 

[wiseone2]

HAL has manufactured HS-748 turboprop 48 seater aircraft during 1960-1984 and it is still in service to its air worthiness standard. Also, currently manufacturing/maintaining the 19 seat Dornier DO-228 aircraft for different customers (Civil & Defense).

“Considering the current situation where a limited number of models of 50-80 seater aircraft are already developed and in service.

Maximum all up weight shall be between 20,000 to 50,000 kgs.

Civil version:
50-80 passengers with luggage, cabin crew and attendants

Non-civil version:
2 Pilots, 2 observers, 6 spare crews in maritime recc. Role
Under wing pylons for carriage of stores.
Pods for carriage of dispersant for pollution control.
Radar, INS, GPS, IR scanners.

Flares light armament and rocket pods etc.

Maximum cruise – not less than 450km/hr at 20,000 ft and above
Patrol speeds: 400 km/hr

Field Operations: Should be able to operate from ill equipped air fields in nearall weather conditions and CAT-II landing without any ground support,
Service ceiling: Not less than 20,000 ft and with one engine the ceiling shall be in excess of 15,000 ft
Endurance: Around 8 to 10 hours at patrol speeds with 10% reserve fuel and mission load Range: Not less than 1000 km with 10 % reserve & full payload.
Options for Standard Range, Extended Range and Long Range can be included in the response.
Take off field length: Less than 1200 meters at MTOW, SL ISA + 20° C
Landing: Landing distance less than 1400 meters.


The aircraft should be in service for at least 25years. The fatigue life for the aircraft should be:
About 90,000 hours of flying
About 72,000 landings

I am aware of HAL manufacturing of HS-748 and Do-228
The C-17 is whole different class of aircraft. It is unlikely USA will part with key technologies

 

[Hindustani78]

I am aware of HAL manufacturing of HS-748 and Do-228
The C-17 is whole different class of aircraft. It is unlikely USA will part with key technologies

50-80 seater aircraft are already developed and in service.

 

[wiseone2]

50-80 seater aircraft are already developed and in service.

It is not the number of seats. It is the range of the aircraft and cargo payload.

 

[Hindustani78]

It is not the number of seats. It is the range of the aircraft and cargo payload.

Maximum all up weight shall be between 20,000 to 50,000 kgs.

 

[wiseone2]

Maximum all up weight shall be between 20,000 to 50,000 kgs.

C-17 can lift weights more than that

 

[Hindustani78]

C-17 can lift weights more than that

Indian Scientists are working on indigenous technology from airframes to engines unlike the Chinese who are getting engines from Russians.

Sputnik news
In October 2016, media reported that China signed a contract on the delivery of 224 D-30KP2 engines worth over $658 million produced by Russia’s NPO Saturn Company. Fifty-four of them will be reportedly installed on Ilyshin Il-76/78 military transport aircraft operated by the Chinese Air Force while 170 units will be installed on China’s new Y-20 military transport plane.

 

[wiseone2]

Indian Scientists are working on indigenous technology from airframes to engines unlike the Chinese who are getting engines from Russians.

Sputnik news
In October 2016, media reported that China signed a contract on the delivery of 224 D-30KP2 engines worth over $658 million produced by Russia’s NPO Saturn Company. Fifty-four of them will be reportedly installed on Ilyshin Il-76/78 military transport aircraft operated by the Chinese Air Force while 170 units will be installed on China’s new Y-20 military transport plane.

I am fine with making clones of Il-76s
But didn't the MTI project get cancelled because Russians did not provide a powerful engine ?

 

[Hindustani78]

I am fine with making clones of Il-76s
But didn't the MTI project get cancelled because Russians did not provide a powerful engine ?

I think its more because of Russian Federation relations with Chinese that Indian Establishment is maintaining distance with Russian Federation.

 

[Han Patriot]

USA has supported legacy aircraft pretty well. They have a good track record in the past.
Keep in mind the cannablizing of parts occurs for budget reasons.

I just proved to you those cannibalizing were not because of cost reasons, please re read tht article.

LLLOLOLOLOLLOLOL Quoting from a FLIGHT Magazine from Oct 1953!!!!! beyond pathetic!!!!!

do u know the difference between a vintage flight and a Operational one???

SAAF are operational ie used for Maritime SAR and EW ....

C-47TP Turbo Dakota

Status: Current

Manufacturer: Douglas

Country of Manufacture: United States

Description:
The most widely used transport aircraft of World War Two, the DC3/C47 has been in SAAF service since 1943. In the early 1990s several were modernised with, inter alia ,turboprops replacing the piston engines and a fuselage extension.


Another example pf Upgrade

Basler BT-67


BT-67

A Kenn Borek Air Basler BT-67 at Williams Field, Antarctica (2008)
Role Cargo aircraft
Manufacturer Basler Turbo Conversions
Introduction January 1990
Number built 58[1]
Unit cost US$4.5 million, US$6.5 million as of 2012.[2]
Developed from Douglas DC-3
The Basler BT-67 is a utility aircraft produced by Basler Turbo Conversions of Oshkosh, Wisconsin. It is a remanufactured and modified Douglas DC-3; the modifications designed to significantly extend the DC-3's serviceable lifetime. The conversion includes fitting the airframe with new Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6A-67R turboprop engines, lengthening the fuselage, strengthening the airframe, upgrading the avionics, and making modifications to the wings' leading edges and wing tips.

You are still assuming this will be the case for C-130. I am telling you they did faced parts shortages due to non-production, do you want that to happen when China is bombing you?
Smarty ***?

Someone was trying to paint as if the DC-3 had been continuously used without facing issues with parts since production stopped, I proved him wrong, they did scavenge parts due to non-production. C-130 life might or might not be extended, might be modernized, who knows, but it all depends on the US, you are putting your defense in their hands. See what happened to your IAC? It got delayed for many years because of trying to use Russian steel initially.

Whether they will upgrade or extend the life of C-130 is an assumption you make. For example, if there is a parts shortage in 10-15 years time, everyone is competing for it around the world and India gets none. Then 5 years later some company wants to extend the life by introducing new parts, new modifications and so on, so are you telling me for 5 years your craft is gonna be grounded??

Again is it wise to buy the LAST FREAKING AIRCRAFT IN PRODUCTION? or is it a smarter choice to spend that money on some research to build your own like China?

 

[wiseone2]

I just proved to you those cannibalizing were not because of cost reasons, please re read tht article.

it happens rarely with aircraft produced in large numbers

 

[GuardianRED]

I just proved to you those cannibalizing were not because of cost reasons, please re read tht article.


You are still assuming this will be the case for C-130. I am telling you they did faced parts shortages due to non-production, do you want that to happen when China is bombing you?
Smarty ***?

Someone was trying to paint as if the DC-3 had been continuously used without facing issues with parts since production stopped, I proved him wrong, they did scavenge parts due to non-production. C-130 life might or might not be extended, might be modernized, who knows, but it all depends on the US, you are putting your defense in their hands. See what happened to your IAC? It got delayed for many years because of trying to use Russian steel initially.

Whether they will upgrade or extend the life of C-130 is an assumption you make. For example, if there is a parts shortage in 10-15 years time, everyone is competing for it around the world and India gets none. Then 5 years later some company wants to extend the life by introducing new parts, new modifications and so on, so are you telling me for 5 years your craft is gonna be grounded??

Again is it wise to buy the LAST FREAKING AIRCRAFT IN PRODUCTION? or is it a smarter choice to spend that money on some research to build your own like China?

Proved???? Where is this PROOF??? from an article posted in 1956!!!!????u need to go back to school and learn what that word means. Posting ONE Time Article and Say it is proof - Pathetic!

U lack of how the world works where the production of spares are quite a different line or even in a different country apart from where the actual frame is being assemble/built

Best STOP Beating a dead half eaten and buried horse

Good Day!

 

[Han Patriot]

Proved???? Where is this PROOF??? from an article posted in 1956!!!!????u need to go back to school and learn what that word means. Posting ONE Time Article and Say it is proof - Pathetic!

U lack of how the world works where the production of spares are quite a different line or even in a different country apart from where the actual frame is being assemble/built

Best STOP Beating a dead half eaten and buried horse

Good Day!

Yes, it is proof, no matter which period it came from, I am proving parts shortage did occur and scavenging did occur. This happened even to the mighty US military. I posted two articles actually, one for DC-3 in the 50s and another for F-18 aircraft recently.

The essence of my argument is this, only dumbasses buy the LAST REMAINING AIRCRAFT IN PRODUCTION.

How sure you are I am the one lacking the knowledge on how the world works? And it is not your country that is taking the unnecessary risk in depending on FOREIGN IMPORT as always.

 

[GuardianRED]

Yes, it is proof, no matter which period it came from, I am proving parts shortage did occur and scavenging did occur. This happened even to the mighty US military. I posted two articles actually, one for DC-3 in the 50s and another for F-18 aircraft recently.

The essence of my argument is this, only dumbasses buy the LAST REMAINING AIRCRAFT IN PRODUCTION.

How sure you are I am the one lacking the knowledge on how the world works? And it is not your country that is taking the unnecessary risk in depending on FOREIGN IMPORT as always.

hahaha ,..... pathetic reply!!! ....