Indian Railways vs. Chinese Railways...

[HeinzG]

Calm down, it's in vain to preach some isolated minds.
Sri Lanka is our partner, some small things won't have impart on Sino-Lanka relation.
Actually CSR has exported some DMU to Sri Lanka, even we Chinese don't have these types of DMU(diesel multiple unit) in China although we have a lot of non-electrical lines.
View attachment 211966

These Chinese DMU have become the workhorse of SLR for the past 10 years. Truly fantastic units they are. The the speed and power to haul large number of people.

 

[Anees]

Why cannot make compare Railway With India Vs China Vs Pakistan Vs Bangladesh ??? ''

 

[by78]

Some of the best luxurious trains in the world that you can find in India only.View attachment 211979 View attachment 211979 View attachment 211980 View attachment 211980 View attachment 211981 View attachment 211983 View attachment 211984

These are not passenger trains per se but are tourism trains, designed for rich (foreign) vacationers with money to spend so they can be carried on a meandering train through some scenic spots. It's quaint but somewhat irrelevant here.

Regular Indian passenger trains are for the common people who need the trains to be productive.

 

[indianBong]

Some Indian posters are a bit too "emotional" when it comes to any criticism, even if the criticism is a valid and constructive one.

Thanks for the post. Indian railways have been improving at a sluggish pace but the picture clearly shows there is a lot of room for improvement. India needs to upgrade its facilities if they want to be among the best in the world.

Nothing about indian railway will change much in coming years..... coz people can't afford expensive ride... can't compare with china....

 

[by78]

Nothing about indian railway will change much in coming years..... coz people can't afford expensive ride... can't compare with china....

Rides don't have to be expensive. They just have to be reasonably priced.

When was the last time passenger fares were increased? Meanwhile, how much has the income of an average passenger grown?

Fare increase is overdue. Prices could be easily doubled and still be affordable. If fare increase is not possible, then make sure EVERYONE who rides the train pays. Free riders are like thieves who steal from those who pay fares.

 

[indianBong]

Rides don't have to be expensive. They just have to be reasonably priced.

When was the last time passenger fares were increased? Meanwhile, how much has the income of an average passenger grown?

Fare increase is overdue. Prices could be easily doubled and still be affordable. If fare increase is not possible, then make sure EVERYONE who rides the train pays. Free riders are like thieves who steal from those who pay fares.

Bhai, most of the railway tracks pass over states of UP, Bihar, west bengal etc etc... No professionalism at all... people don't even buy tickets... and fare if increased will surely make the govt loose power in centre.... communists in west bengal call for a strike when metro ticket cost was increased by jus 3rupee!!!!! Leftist here need to learn from china...

 

[AndrewJin]

Rides don't have to be expensive. They just have to be reasonably priced.

When was the last time passenger fares were increased? Meanwhile, how much has the income of an average passenger grown?

Fare increase is overdue. Prices could be easily doubled and still be affordable. If fare increase is not possible, then make sure EVERYONE who rides the train pays. Free riders are like thieves who steal from those who pay fares.

Correct.
Ticket fares are the least question to pose.
Normal train ticket fare in China remains the same since 1995 and HSR ticket fare remains the same since HSR was introduced to China. But how much money do we earn now compared to 20 years ago or 5 years ago? Could I dreamed of having a Xiaomi or iPhone at that time? Could I dreamed of affording going abroad at that time?

 

[by78]

Bhai, most of the railway tracks pass over states of UP, Bihar, west bengal etc etc... No professionalism at all... people don't even buy tickets... and fare if increased will surely make the govt loose power in centre.... communists in west bengal call for a strike when metro ticket cost was increased by jus 3rupee!!!!! Leftist here need to learn from china...

Doesn't the central government provide funds and subsidies to Bihar and UP? Deduct railway losses caused by these states from their subsidies. The losses have to be recouped.

 

[AndrewJin]

Doesn't the central government provide funds and subsidies to Bihar and UP? Deduct railway losses caused by these states from their subsidies. The losses have to be recouped.

It's a way of redistribution, collect huge profit from our profitable HSR lines in Eastern China and Southern China, and subsidise lines in Western China where HSR is practically impossible to be profitable.

 

[by78]

It's a way of redistribution, collect huge profit from our profitable HSR lines in Eastern China and Southern China, and subsidise lines in Western China where HSR is practically impossible to be profitable.

Most Japanese lines and French lines are unprofitable in the actuarial sense. China likely will never recover the capital invested through charging fares, but the positive economic impact of HSR cannot be calculated accurately.

The World Bank did a study on Chinese HSR two years ago and concluded that the increase in economic output due to HSR more than offset the initial capital expenditures. In fact, the hours saved on travel alone multiplied by GDP per capita per hour over a fifteen year period should be greater than the initial outlays. After that, it's simply all profit.

 

[The BrOkEn HeArT]

 

[HeinzG]

These are not passenger trains per se but are tourism trains, designed for rich (foreign) vacationers with money to spend so they can be carried on a meandering train through some scenic spots. It's quaint but somewhat irrelevant here.

Regular Indian passenger trains are for the common people who need the trains to be productive.

I assume that Indian rail system for commuter is efficient and reliable as other major rail systems through out the world. AFAIK commuter lines in Mumbai for example runs on time and carry more passengers. However I bet even US do not have a proper commuter rail system except for the NY subway system.

Most Japanese lines and French lines are unprofitable in the actuarial sense. China likely will never recover the capital invested through charging fares, but the positive economic impact of HSR cannot be calculated accurately.

The World Bank did a study on Chinese HSR two years ago and concluded that the increase in economic output due to HSR more than offset the initial capital expenditures. In fact, the hours saved on travel alone multiplied by GDP per capita per hour over a fifteen year period should be greater than the initial outlays. After that, it's simply all profit.

Why HSR lines are unprofitable?

 

[by78]

Why HSR lines are unprofitable?

They are unprofitable because fares alone can't pay back the money spent to build the lines. Only three lines in the world are expected to recover their investment through ticket sales: Paris to Lyon, Tokyo to Osaka, and Beijing to Shanghai.

However, in reality most lines are in fact profitable because they save commuters time and enable them to travel more frequently. The time saved and productivity gained add more to GDP than the money took to construct the lines.

Remember, Time = Money.

 

[AndrewJin]

Most Japanese lines and French lines are unprofitable in the actuarial sense. China likely will never recover the capital invested through charging fares, but the positive economic impact of HSR cannot be calculated accurately.

I think the World Bank did a study on Chinese HSR two years ago that concluded the increase in economic output more than offset the initial capital expenditures. In fact, the hours saved on travel alone multiplied by GDP per capita per hour over a fifteen year period should be greater than the initial outlays.

Yep.
China’s high-speed rail is so popular, it’s hurting the domestic airline industry – Quartz
Beijing-Shanghai high-speed railway to post annual profit - Global Times
Some key corridors like Shanghai-Beijing Shanghai-Nanjing, Guangzhou-Shenzhen are already profitable. (One line's company is even in stock market). However, HSR network as a whole is too difficult to make money.
Anyway, making money is not the ultimate goal of HSR, just like holding Summer Olympics in Beijing, how Beijing has changed after massive metro construction and expressway construction. The social values and economic values are invaluable.
Set me as an example, a student from Wuhan in Central China and studying in Shanghai. After Shanghai-Wuhan HSR was launched, I have donated at least 30 times of Shanghai-Wuhan HSR rides(4-5hour) instead of previously going home once or twice a year by normal 10-hour train(900km). And I usually take HSR(intercity) to nearby cities like Hangzhou and Suzhou for weekend excursions (one-day trip, less than one hour by HSR).

These Chinese DMU have become the workhorse of SLR for the past 10 years. Truly fantastic units they are. The the speed and power to haul large number of people.

Good to know that.
It's impossible for small countries to have a complete railway industry, Switzerland doesn't, Norway doesn't. The number of railway giants are very limited, so I don't think it's a shame for those who don't have a railway industry to import metros or trains from abroad.
CSR around the world:

More information in https://defence.pk/threads/chinese-hsr-news-and-information：original-translations.363685/page-3

 

[VelocuR]

Don't just compare with Chinese Railways, they have very high standard and best services.

For India is just very low standard and bad maintenances that should similar to poor countries.