India was an imagined idea:PM Manmohan Singh

[Alphatech]

India was an imagined idea

If so, all I can say is : "WHAT AN IDEA SIRJI !!!"

 

[Jade]

At the time, many people agreed with Carter's characterization, which is why he was able to deliver it with a straight face. Iran was a huge buyer of US weapons, goods and services. And Iran had achieved far more at that time, for its people, than India has. You may not be familiar with Iran's history, but Iran went from being carved up by the great powers, to being a very strong country, a shining economy, a nation with very high per capita income and the strongest military in the region. Iranian infrastructure was top-class, Tehran was called the "Paris of the Middle East", their roads, factories, the excellence of their universities and the revolution in Agriculture were all absolutely mind boggling. Pick up an old National Geographic featuring Iran from those times and take a peek.

Even today, India is no where close to the kinds of per capita income and infrastructural achievements Iran had achieved in the 70s.

But again, you are free to believe what you wish. If you think Obama's words were heart-felt and as another Indian friend said earlier, "India is the world's growth engine", then you are welcome to these opinions.

Finally, you said Carter was praising Iran to bring them into the US fold. This is hogwash. Iran had been in the US fold for decades prior to Carter's visit.

You seem not to realize the power of aggregates neither do you seem to realize how hard is it to movie countries such as India or China towards the path of development; for countries such as Iran, it is easier to put it on a developmental mode, but much harder to do the same for countries such as China or India; however, a developing China or India would make hell lot of a difference to the world economy and polity then ever will a developed Iran would do....and either a moving China or India would draw unprecedented attention of the world then Iran could ever imagine…. as they say size matters

Ok if not now, in near future India is going to be one of the world's growth engine…can you deny this?

 

[dBub]

I just want to remind you to please analyze the situation for yourself and come to your own conclusions. Relying on the words of a US President re how your country is doing - and that too while he is on a sales tour - can be very dangerous and misleading. They will say things out of their own self interest, not because they actually believe them.

I bring this up not to throw cold water on your enthusiasm, but in a genuine and friendly way. As an historic parallel, have you read Carter's famous "Island of Stability" toast which he gave on his very famous, much ballyhooed visit to Iran? The US already knew that the Shah was probably going to be overthrown and many groups believe that they even had a hand in it, but Carter still spewed this nonsense to mislead the Shah and placate him. Examine the irony in these words in a historic context and consider that they were delivered when Iran was already being rocked by the growing revolutionary movement:

“Iran, because of the great leadership of the Shah, is an island of stability in one of the more troubled areas of the world. This is a great tribute to you, Your Majesty, and to your leadership and to the respect and the admiration and love which your people give to you.”

-- Jimmy Carter

Analyze each one of the statements. "Love which your people give to you". "Island of stability". "Great Leadership of the Shah". Each one of them, at the time Carter was saying these words, was a complete and utter lie. A great example of meaningless and non-genuine praise.

The unfortunate thing about US foreign policy is that it is always short term, the US tends to always lose interest and is thus unable to form longstanding relationships (please don't bring up the UK here, because we all know that clinging on to the coattails of the US is the only hope the UK has to remain relevant in today's world). In the words of Henry Kissinger:

“It may be dangerous to be America's enemy, but to be America's friend is fatal”


The Big Apple: “It may be dangerous to be America’s enemy, but to be America’s friend is fatal”

Henry Kissinger said in November 1968, after Richard Nixon was elected U.S. president but before he took office: “Nixon should be told that it is probably an objective of Clifford to depose Thieu (South Vietnamese president Nguyen Van Thieu—ed.) before Nixon is inaugurated. Word should be gotten to Nixon that if Thieu meets the same fate as Diem, the word will go out to the nations of the world that it may be dangerous to be America’s enemy, but to be America’s friend is fatal.”

The quotation referred to America’s role in Vietnam. If America doesn’t stand by its friends and allies, the quotation explains, then it might ultimately be less dangerous to be America’s enemy.

 

[ganimi kawa]

Henry Kissinger said in November 1968, after Richard Nixon was elected U.S. president but before he took office: “Nixon should be told that it is probably an objective of Clifford to depose Thieu (South Vietnamese president Nguyen Van Thieu—ed.) before Nixon is inaugurated. Word should be gotten to Nixon that if Thieu meets the same fate as Diem, the word will go out to the nations of the world that it may be dangerous to be America’s enemy, but to be America’s friend is fatal.”

The quotation referred to America’s role in Vietnam. If America doesn’t stand by its friends and allies, the quotation explains, then it might ultimately be less dangerous to be America’s enemy.

Welcome to the forum!

Nice post to start your posting career here, mate! Let me be the first one to thank you.

 

[TechLahore]

The quotation referred to America’s role in Vietnam. If America doesn’t stand by its friends and allies, the quotation explains, then it might ultimately be less dangerous to be America’s enemy.

I am aware of the context of the quote. Thanks for reinforcing my point. You may not have seen the earlier discussion concerning Pakistan enabling U2s to overfly the USSR, only to be threatened with a nuclear attack by Khruschev, and the consequent American refusal to extend a nuclear umbrella of protection to Pakistan. This is a great case in point of how it has historically been fatal to be an American ally.

I'll end it here as we are probably veering too far off course.

 

[vandemataram]

Republic of India is one of a kind. We will fight to end against right wing loonies of every society, cast and faith to make it a reality, if it's already not one.

Well these kind of statements are all hogwash and are meant to incite communal passions.

I am afraid but your "secular" credentials are too apparent here not to term you as a closet commie. We are fed up with Communist gases and gases and more gases. We need some fresh thinking and fresh perspective.

What we need to do over here is to root out "Leftist" and "Extreme Leftist" ideologies with force and more force, if that is required.

And to fight out "Right Wing Loonies", first as a political force you would need to galvanise people across the spectrum not 1 or 2 states that you rule.

And inculcating your "Idea" that "Right Wing Extremism" does exist and it does pose an existential threat to India/Indians it is too much work.

I would rather say that the time for that hasnt come as yet.

In the meanwhile let us deal with an "Iron Hand" with the Left Extremists and the Islamic Fundamentalists who have far better and robust capabilities and credentials proved than the so-called "Right Wingers" that you talk of.

And finally for this idea, that you propose, to take shape, you probably have to try harder than you are trying, I mean the Internal Security Agencies also have to be on the same page you are.

But that, my friend, it isnt the case as yet, however unhappy you might be with that....

Thanks,

 

[Dalai Lama]

"All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come."

- Victor Hugo

Nicely said Chinese-Dragon! However I believe it's actually "No army can stop an idea whose time has come". No effrontery intended.

In the interest of inspiring quotes:

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"
- Edmund Burke

"Be the change you want to see in the world"
- Mahatma Gandhi

"Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more"
- William Shakespeare (Henry V, Act III)

 

[vandemataram]

Yes agreed....Right Wing Nationalism and Discrimination has to be contained before it empowers more.......also more emphasis on Education which is the single most important factor which will actually make the youth of India resourceful and united...

Yes education is the way to go but they will have to be rational, modern, contemporary and socially acceptable and Universal in nature.

And before Right Wing nationalism please concentrate on Left Winged bigotry and Minority Fundamentalism.