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India: The U.S. Nuclear Deal and Indian ICBMs

I dont quite agree with you joe, The world does see India in a different light, yes there will be a hue and cry but that would be it. Let the China vs US-Japan hot-up. You can see the difference in Political play then.

Islamic fundamentalism in Pakistan is a definite problem, Musharraf is alone fighting it. The moment he goes; the nuke sector is an open space.

The whole point of ATV being away from Pakistani or Chinese Navy range and attacking their land mass; is a definite proposition.

What happened last time that India detonated Nukes? Nothing or sanctions? And whilst there might be China vs US-Japan in the future. There will still be Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran for the next few years. And how will all the other regional allies of the U.S. feel if suddenly there is a nuke threat near their borders? You can bet Australia will not be happy or a few other countries either.

So If India gets ICBM's and nothing is done then the U.S. will be scuppering any chance of influence with a few other Islamic countries (due to the current world situation) If they then land upon Pak with a ton of bricks.
As Neo pointed out in another thread there would be a lot more investment from Arab countries looking for investment in a politically safer environ. And Pak could say "so long and thanks for all the fish we will now continue to develop our relationships with other countries" i.e China and Ukraine.
 
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I am talking about dirty bombs as well as hardliner islamic parties taking over the government of pakistan in an election, not a terrorist takeover of pakistani army.

I am talking about Indian ICBM, it will happen, and is a matter of time. My assertion is that world will see Indian ICBM in a different light to that of Pakistani ICBM.

As for my claims of Indian ICBM, isnt the article itself and our progress in Agni 3 evidence itself.

Dirty bombs are used by people who cannot create real bombs. And even then there would be a definite footprint.

You are showing your naivety of the political make up of Pakistan. There are people who would not vote for the hardliners as well so try not to conveniently forget them. It's not like a hardliner party has held much sway in PAK unlike our neighbours.....
 
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that is true the hardliners never had power they can protest like hell but when it comes to policy decision they are always left out and most of the time the oppposite has been done to there objectives. So the hardliners argument is very old and stupid the masses still support the secular parties. the only reason that they have so many seats in parliment is that both the stronger political parties had there hands tied behind there back. So even if musharraf leaves the hhardlines will be left in the dust when it comes to elections. The ICBM question for pakistan is stupid we dont need an ICBM becuase our main threat is right next to us our missile dont have to cross an ocean to reach them.
 
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kidwaibai your making a heavy mistake, India have never been a threat to Pakistan in the sense what geopolitics there is now, If I was a pakistani I would be worried in the constructive deconstruction of my country whish seems to be supported by some of the elites.

It is the fallacy of your elites who claim India as a threat and champagnes with whisky in bombay hockey club when invited and enjoys the freedom.
 
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Dirty bombs are used by people who cannot create real bombs. And even then there would be a definite footprint.

You are showing your naivety of the political make up of Pakistan. There are people who would not vote for the hardliners as well so try not to conveniently forget them. It's not like a hardliner party has held much sway in PAK unlike our neighbours.....

I am not buying 99% Pakistani's are moderate thingie, you can serve that somewhere else.
What is the moderate in a Western society as the one in you live to a moderate in the Pakistani society. Dirty bombs is definite probability as is pakistan falling into the hands of hardliners.
 
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What happened last time that India detonated Nukes? Nothing or sanctions? And whilst there might be China vs US-Japan in the future. There will still be Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran for the next few years. And how will all the other regional allies of the U.S. feel if suddenly there is a nuke threat near their borders? You can bet Australia will not be happy or a few other countries either.

The Question is wether Australia or the US takes India as a threat or a partner. As for as India is concerned there is nothing like having a second strike capability from lets say the south pole from the ATV. Far away from Pakistani strike on that sub.

So If India gets ICBM's and nothing is done then the U.S. will be scuppering any chance of influence with a few other Islamic countries (due to the current world situation) If they then land upon Pak with a ton of bricks.

Current world situation is not continous. India's ICBM's political fall out depends on when India tests it on what point in its relationship with world. Pakistan too much bad blood to get away with it.

As Neo pointed out in another thread there would be a lot more investment from Arab countries looking for investment in a politically safer environ. And Pak could say "so long and thanks for all the fish we will now continue to develop our relationships with other countries" i.e China and Ukraine

Ukraine is definite US stooge. There are limits to their soviet tech. They are not developing anything subtantial that a Germany or France would be bothered about in the International arms Market.
China is another story.
Arab investments are more in India, if you dont know. Try smart city cochin etc. Arabs will put more money where they find good returns.
Pakistan with 6% growth and 7% inflation, high unemployment and illiteracy, certainly isnt that.
 
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I am not buying 99% Pakistani's are moderate thingie, you can serve that somewhere else.
What is the moderate in a Western society as the one in you live to a moderate in the Pakistani society. Dirty bombs is definite probability as is pakistan falling into the hands of hardliners.

The same can be said for moaists in India, the argument doesnt dwells upon what is happening rather what can happen.

I'd rather stop speculation and worry about what a pakistani general said, nukes aimed at India.
 
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The same can be said for moaists in India, the argument doesnt dwells upon what is happening rather what can happen.

I'd rather stop speculation and worry about what a pakistani general said, nukes aimed at India.

Joey,

What is the chances of a National Political Party like the MMA or their chronies coming to power in India. BJP for whatever it is, isnt going to give nuke to its cronies and also hasnt announced to wipe Pakistan off the map.
Maoist threat though relevent, is much ballooned threat. Most of it is Hot air. build roads and see how it dies down. Bringing Firepower were needed is as important as having the firepower. Maoist dwell on these kind of unreachable places and villages.
Is the Hindu Hardliner's anywhere close to a global threat. Indian Armed Forces have a reputation for being away from state and not being communal. I dont see the same in Pakistan armed Forces.

What are my speculations? My speculation is the same as lots of writer's and strategist think about Pakistan.

PS: I send you PM for the INS Jalshava thread, coin in your views
 
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I am not buying 99% Pakistani's are moderate thingie, you can serve that somewhere else.
What incident made you to believe this or shall I consider it just a usual Indian stereo typing.
What is the moderate in a Western society as the one in you live to a moderate in the Pakistani society. Dirty bombs is definite probability as is pakistan falling into the hands of hardliners.
Your propaganda cannot change the facts and the fact is India is the only source where uranium is openly sold to terrorists around the globe.
See the report in the link below:

http://www.wmdinsights.com/I6/I6_SA2_SmugglingOfUranium.htm

Few lines from same article:
In 2001, smuggled uranium, confiscated from suspected terrorists in Balurghat, northern West Bengal, had been removed from the Jaduguda uranium mines in Bihar state, bordering West Bengal, and was planned to be smuggled across the Bangladeshi border.
Have you ever wondered what the hell terrorists will do with this Indian Uranium !!!
 
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What incident made you to believe this or shall I consider it just a usual Indian stereo typing.

I dont consider most people who follow islam and that too uneducated moderate in the true sense. Especially in Pakistan with its tribe following and all.

Your propaganda cannot change the facts and the fact is India is the only source where uranium is openly sold to terrorists around the globe.
See the report in the link below
:

Somebody stole it, its not as if Indian government sold it. Nice way to turn things.

http://www.wmdinsights.com/I6/I6_SA2_SmugglingOfUranium.htm

Few lines from same article:

Have you ever wondered what the hell terrorists will do with this Indian Uranium !!!

Einstien, we CAUGHT them. didnt we.
 
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I dont consider most people who follow islam and that too uneducated moderate in the true sense. Especially in Pakistan with its tribe following and all.

Sentence above didn't made a sense to me at all. Considering your stereo typing and few words (highlighted) I can sense a usual hindu hate propaganda against Islam and Pakistan.
As I have stated in past, before pointing your fingers always look around.

Now tell me how do you explain and compare below quoted state sponsored terrorism.

Hindu Mob in India Beats, Strips, Parades Pastor
During assault, they douse him with kerosene and toss burning Bible at him.
by Vishal Arora
http://www.spcm.org/Journal/spip.php?page=imprimir_articulo&id_article=12326
NEW DELHI, June 12 – A mob of Hindu extremists on Friday (June 8) beat a pastor and tried to set him on fire before parading him naked in the suburbs of Bangalore, capital of Karnataka state.

Laxmi Narayan Gowda, an independent pastor and representative of the Global Council of Indian Christians (GCIC), was recovering in a hospital at press time with swelling and numerous bruises.

The incident took place at about 7 p.m. in Hessarghatta, about 30 kilometers from Bangalore, when a group of about 50 people barged into the pastor’s house and threatened him with violence unless he moved out of the area, said Sam Joseph, a Karnataka-based leader of the All India Christian Council (AICC).

The group returned with 100 more people shortly after, cornered Pastor Gowda in a room in his house, and began assaulting him in front of his wife and two small children.

Extremists of the Bajrang Dal, youth wing of the Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP or World Hindu Council), allegedly led the mob.

One of the assailants threw kerosene on the pastor, and others started burning Bibles. Someone tossed a burning Bible onto Pastor Gowda, but miraculously he did not catch fire, Joseph told Compass.

The extremists then stripped the pastor naked and hung a board around his neck that said, “I am the one who was converting people,” before parading him through the area.

“By this time, the mob had swollen to about 1,000, as more people joined in to harass and torture the pastor,” Joseph added.

Local police arrived about an hour later, after one of the pastor’s relatives called them by telephone.

The assailants burned at least 250 Bibles and also vandalized furniture and equipment.

Police had not registered a case against the attackers at press time. When Compass spoke to Inspector R. Malesh of the Soladevanhalli police station, he said the victim did not want to file a complaint.

“We have requested the Christians to give us a complaint in writing, but they do not want to press charges against the attackers,” he said.

Malesh claimed that the mob consisted of local people who did not belong to any Hindu extremist groups. Some of Pastor Gowda’s neighbors attacked, he said, because they do not want Christian prayers and meetings to take place in his house.

A local source, however, told Compass on condition of anonymity that the attack was pre-planned and directed by an unidentified lawyer. The lawyer suggested to the crowd that if they hit the pastor as a mob, then there would be no possibility of prosecution, said the source.

Before Pastor Gowda accepted Christ about 15 years ago, the source said, he was a member of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh, the parent organization of numerous Hindu extremist groups in India.

“The attackers seemingly wanted to punish Pastor Gowda for converting to Christianity from their Hindu nationalistic ideology, and warn others against dong so,” added the source.

Pastor Gowda has been working in the area for the last 12 years. The source also said the pastor was firm in his faith following the attack.

Dr. Sam Paul, AICC’s public affairs secretary, said that although Karnataka was known for anti-Christian attacks, the situation has become more volatile in the state since the Janata Dal-Secular party, in coalition with the Hindu nationalistic Bharatiya Janata Party, took power from the Congress Party in February 2006.

“Extremists in Karnataka are emboldened as the police usually turn up after the incident,” he said. “There are also times when the police encourage anti-social elements to harass Christians.”
Paul also stressed the need to educate India’s people about true conversion, in particular that it does not mean that one becomes anti-national.

Dr. Sajan K. George, national president of the GCIC, told Compass that he was thankful to God for saving the life of one of his organization’s representatives.
 
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Am I Hindu by birth yes, Thats where the buck stops boyo.

ANd yes about the link you have pasted
would be Good for nothing sorry excuse for human beings; they are criminals and nothing less
 
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I'm not talking about you rather I was trying to show you that orthodox hindus are the worst example of hardliners and they are the one who control India and its policies.
Stripping a pastor is a act of shame ...
What if the same hardliner hindus mob strom a depot of your neuclear arsnels ?
They will simply have a walk over, as no one even like to write strong words about the heniouis of acts, how can they dare to stop them phisycally.
Rest assure all your neighbors think hindu hardliners as a threat to there sovreignity and all there defence spendings are reciprocal to Indian defence procurements.
 
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I'm not talking about you rather I was trying to show you that orthodox hindus are the worst example of hardliners and they are the one who control India and its policies.
Stripping a pastor is a act of shame ...
What if the same hardliner hindus mob strom a depot of your neuclear arsnels ?
They will simply have a walk over, as no one even like to write strong words about the heniouis of acts, how can they dare to stop them phisycally.
Rest assure all your neighbors think hindu hardliners as a threat to there sovreignity and all there defence spendings are reciprocal to Indian defence procurements.

lol,
yes hindu fanatics have that kind of resources,lol
 
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