India | A Democracy Soaked In Blood.

[Sashan]

Sir, you surprise me at times. It is not the majority Indians who are massacred, it is the minorities and some others who want to secede and are fighting for secession. These people are in majority in their own areas and not overall in India. The Hashimpura massacre happened in 1987 and what has happened since then - shrill voices of Swamy - have a heart.

The Iron Lady, who is on hunger strike since last 12 years and then what! I can continue and continue naming a lot of such known incidents. Discovery of 2000 mass graves. Sir in which country such massive and large scale atrocities are committed by their security forces - name one. Swamy quotes Nazis. So should we compare the Indian Army and other security forces with Nazi forces.

Sir, you people need to understand that such massacres and genocides can not be carried out in perpetuity.

It is not just minorities but majority as well who have been affected. As for you quoting few examples here.

1. Hashimpura does not ask for secession. It is part of the Hindu-muslim riots where maybe PAC were trigger happy.
2. Irom Sharmila is not a secessionist voice. She calls for getting rid of AFSPA from Manipur. Her fast is in response to Assam rifles killing 10 villagers. And mind you, the restrictions on her is by the Manipur state and not Indian government. Manipur government is elected by its own people.
3. 2000 mass graves - it is still up for debate who is there in those graves - foreign militants who does not belong to Kashmir or local Kashmiris. Investigation is on and I would wait for the outcome.

As for majority too getting affected -

1. Precursor to Gujarat riots(again in the riots both Hindus and muslims died) - 58 hindus were killed.
2. ULFA is due to the Assam people getting affected due to foreign illegal immigrants changing the demographics in certain regions.
3. Kashmir pandits thrown out of Kashmir.


So in short, incidents happen but India is forgiving and accomodating when it comes to minorities. It is a federation. The power rests with the states to rule their own people except for certain areas like foreign affairs.

But if someone wants secession, India will kick their b***. And India is unforgiving in that aspect and the message is very clear. Democracy is there when the people want to live within India and enjoy the fruits of a federal setup. Beyond that, there is nothing to do with democracy.

 

[Nassr]

It is not just minorities but majority as well who have been affected. As for you quoting few examples here.

1. Hashimpura does not ask for secession. It is part of the Hindu-muslim riots where maybe PAC were trigger happy.
2. Irom Sharmila is not a secessionist voice. She calls for getting rid of AFSPA from Manipur. Her fast is in response to Assam rifles killing 10 villagers. And mind you, the restrictions on her is by the Manipur state and not Indian government. Manipur government is elected by its own people.
3. 2000 mass graves - it is still up for debate who is there in those graves - foreign militants who does not belong to Kashmir or local Kashmiris. Investigation is on and I would wait for the outcome.

As for majority too getting affected -

1. Precursor to Gujarat riots(again in the riots both Hindus and muslims died) - 58 hindus were killed.
2. ULFA is due to the Assam people getting affected due to foreign illegal immigrants changing the demographics in certain regions.
3. Kashmir pandits thrown out of Kashmir.


So in short, incidents happen but India is forgiving and accomodating when it comes to minorities. It is a federation. The power rests with the states to rule their own people except for certain areas like foreign affairs.

But if someone wants secession, India will kick their b***. And India is unforgiving in that aspect and the message is very clear. Democracy is there when the people want to live within India and enjoy the fruits of a federal setup. Beyond that, there is nothing to do with democracy.

Sir, you amply highlight why India is a Democracy Soaked in Blood of Her Own People.

Keep at it, you will be able to kill hundreds of thousands more of your own. After all you have over a billion people to kill. It will take some time indeed.

 

[Sashan]

Sir, you amply highlight why India is a Democracy Soaked in Blood of Her Own People.

Keep at it, you will be able to kill hundreds of thousands more of your own. After all you have over a billion people to kill. It will take some time indeed.

I believe the discussions have run its course as there is no where to go from here. Peace.

 

[Rank]

This article = Unabashedly Biased crap

The conclusion of the article= Wishful thinking since 65 years and running

Most of these so called 140 geoups have already surrendered and many of them have not more than 50-100 members. Hardly anything lethal about them .

Check out SATP.org , insurgency violence particularly in Kashmir Valley and North-East has gone drastically in the last few years .

In fact , in the North East there is hardly any serious , worth its salt insurgency or so called freedom movement left .

Do you have any idea how many so called "SEPARATION MOVEMENT Holder in Baluchistan" ??????

my answer is "LOL AT ALL INDIANS ON PDF"

by your logic thn only 2 Sardar who even don't have majority and not even have 200 + members whom your INDIA and USA claim for so called "FREEDOM GROUPS" lol not even represent 2% of Baluchistan. Where as 68 Sardaars in which few hold 20/20/30% of Baluchistan with Pakistan.

The problem with you guyz is when some news regarding India (Negative) you start bashing against the author, writer and deny all the claims and blames.. but when it comes to Pakistan.. you guys even believe those News and post those links which even wrote by anonymous Author lol

 

[Nassr]

I believe the discussions have run its course as there is no where to go from here. Peace.

Sir, contrarily, it has just begun. Got tired and so soon?

 

[Punjabbi Munda]

Though the article is biased and the 'groups' it is talking about,most of them have given up arms/surrendered,India is a democracy but the people aren't enjoying much,from inflation to national growth rate to anti-corruption laws to tackling of local issues like roads,electricity,water supply etc..the results are far from what people would have wanted.

 

[Sashan]

Sir, contrarily, it has just begun. Got tired and so soon?

Not tired but it will degenerate into troll fight from here onwards and I hate being subjective with my posts as there is nothing for me in your more recent post to counter objectively.

 

[Nassr]

Not tired but it will degenerate into troll fight from here onwards and I hate being subjective with my posts as there is nothing for me in your more recent post to counter objectively.

I am sorry I said that.

Though the article is biased and the 'groups' it is talking about,most of them have given up arms/surrendered,India is a democracy but the people aren't enjoying much,from inflation to national growth rate to anti-corruption laws to tackling of local issues like roads,electricity,water supply etc..the results are far from what people would have wanted.

However, the Indian media does not acknowledge that and lists all these groups as still operational in different parts of India.

 

[livingdead]

I am sorry I said that.



However, the Indian media does not acknowledge that and lists all these groups as still operational in different parts of India.

Indian media does acknowledge which is why you see the numbers. But sometimes the number does not tell the whole story. The number of incidents have gone down considerably( I am only comparing, I am not saying all is well) in all other regions, except the naxal areas where it has gone up.
You dont see that everyday in news because news works on basis of something happening bad( say stone throwing, bomb blast, police-naxal clash etc)
Naxalism is a separate topic, and there are many in India who are sympathetic to the cause they espouse (including me), I dont agree about their communism or armed struggle. Even govt agrees that they are to be blamed for the mess.

 

[Nassr]

Indian media does acknowledge which is why you see the numbers. But sometimes the number does not tell the whole story. The number of incidents have gone down considerably( I am only comparing, I am not saying all is well) in all other regions, except the naxal areas where it has gone up.
You dont see that everyday in news because news works on basis of something happening bad( say stone throwing, bomb blast, police-naxal clash etc)
Naxalism is a separate topic, and there are many in India who are sympathetic to the cause they espouse (including me), I dont agree about their communism or armed struggle. Even govt agrees that they are to be blamed for the mess.

I had earlier posted my reply on a similar point raised by another gentleman:

>>>>>>Sir, The stats on violence in India keeps on going up and down and may have declined as we speak. This is exactly what the author is trying to probably convey - the brutalities committed by Indian security forces may bring the violence down but has it cooled the feelings of people brutalised - I think it has resulted in increase of anti-India feelings manifold. And it is this very thing that you people need to understand.

Blaming others for your own mistakes does not hide the true picture.<<<<<<

In my opinion even Naxal movement has grown into an insurgency in certain parts, where Indian security forces are afraid to commit themselves and therefore government writ can not be established.

 

[livingdead]

I had earlier posted my reply on a similar point raised by another gentleman:

>>>>>>Sir, The stats on violence in India keeps on going up and down and may have declined as we speak. This is exactly what the author is trying to probably convey - the brutalities committed by Indian security forces may bring the violence down but has it cooled the feelings of people brutalised - I think it has resulted in increase of anti-India feelings manifold. And it is this very thing that you people need to understand.

Blaming others for your own mistakes does not hide the true picture.<<<<<<

In my opinion even Naxal movement has grown into an insurgency in certain parts, where Indian security forces are afraid to commit themselves and therefore government writ can not be established.

I am from naxal affected area, I dont like to call them terrorist. Some of the grievences of the local people (tribals) are genuine which feeds the movement. I dont agree with the ideaology (overthrow of democratic rule and brining communism through armed struggle), but many of the people were pushed into the movement due to negligence of govt.

Most Indians here side with the govt because they have enjoyed the fruits of democracy. When we say, India is shining, everything is fine, we are not lying. It is our perception, because we live in cities/towns and we benefit from govt's schemes. We also can see things changing infront of our eye. For many people in naxal areas, things have not changed for decades.

 

[Ticker]

I am from naxal affected area, I dont like to call them terrorist. Some of the grievences of the local people (tribals) are genuine which feeds the movement. I dont agree with the ideaology (overthrow of democratic rule and brining communism through armed struggle), but many of the people were pushed into the movement due to negligence of govt.

Most Indians here side with the govt because they have enjoyed the fruits of democracy. When we say, India is shining, everything is fine, we are not lying. It is our perception, because we live in cities/towns and we benefit from govt's schemes. We also can see things changing infront of our eye. For many people in naxal areas, things have not changed for decades.

I agree with what you are saying. There are pockets of prosperity in India and outside these pockets much of India has not seen the shining part of India. The Naxalite movement is apparently maturing into a well organized resistance group which is preparing to cross the red line, to become an insurgency.

Today&#8217;s Deccan Chronicle report that Naxals have now developed a fully hi-tech weapons testing laboratory similar to the ones used by the defence forces and the DRDO, is a clear indicator of this fact.

Naxals have labs to test weapons | Deccan Chronicle

 

[INDIC]

I agree with what you are saying. There are pockets of prosperity in India and outside these pockets much of India has not seen the shining part of India. The Naxalite movement is apparently maturing into a well organized resistance group which is preparing to cross the red line, to become an insurgency.

Today’s Deccan Chronicle report that Naxals have now developed a fully hi-tech weapons testing laboratory similar to the ones used by the defence forces and the DRDO, is a clear indicator of this fact.

Naxals have labs to test weapons | Deccan Chronicle

Still they are same even after 50 years could not harness the opportunity when this country was dirt poor in 60s like Mao Zedong harnessed the opportunity.

 

[Ticker]

Still they are same even after 50 years could not harness the opportunity when this country was dirt poor in 60s like Mao Zedong harnessed the opportunity.

gigawatt ji they are your own people and you are laughing when they ask for their rights. This apparently is symptomatic with Indian government and most of Indians. And this is the problem. You people are not pushed when your security forces kill innocent Indians in tens of thousands all over India and you say - ye hai India meray dost yahan sab chalta hai. You will feel the pinch when it reaches your home and it will some day unless you treat other Indians as human beings.

 

[INDIC]

gigawatt ji they are your own people and you are laughing when they ask for their rights. This apparently is symptomatic with Indian government and most of Indians. And this is the problem. You people are not pushed when your security forces kill innocent Indians in tens of thousands all over India and you say - ye hai India meray dost yahan sab chalta hai. You will feel the pinch when it reaches your home and it will some day unless you treat other Indians as human beings.

Because the hardcore corrupt Naxalites indulge in anti-people criminal activities that's why it never became a people's movement even in 50years and so will be another 100 years. So, I was laughing at your intelligence.