What's new

If Kashmir blows up, all bets off: US

Rabbit.Rabbit

FULL MEMBER
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
260
Reaction score
0
If Kashmir blows up, all bets off: US
Ashish Kumar Sen writes from Washington
The Tribune, Chandigarh, India - Main News

Warning that if Kashmir “blows up” then “all bets are off,” Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton says the US is encouraging Pakistan to mend relations with India so that it can focus on the terrorists that threaten Pakistan.

Testifying before a subcommittee of the House Appropriations Committee on Thursday, Clinton acknowledged, “changing paradigms and mindsets is not easy.” She said the Obama administration has had a series of meetings, with both the Pakistanis and the Afghans, on how to get the Pakistani government to change their focus from “what they viewed as their existential threat, namely India, to what we view as their existential threat, namely this extremist insurgency.”

She added that Washington was encouraging the Pakistani government to reach out to the Indian government and “continue some of those confidence-building measures that they were doing, like opening the bus routes in Kashmir and other things that did have some positive effect.”

“If Kashmir blows up, and insurgents come over that Line of Control (LoC), every day or at least every week, then all bets are off,” Clinton said. “But if the Pakistani army stays on the LoC and on the Indian border and doesn’t turn their attentions to dealing with the insurgents, we’ve got a mess on our hands. So we do have to navigate through this.” Clinton said there had to be effort to enhance confidence between India and Pakistan. But, she added, those were not likely to be undertaken until the Indian elections were over.

US officials are concerned that the Pakistani army’s preoccupation with a perceived threat from India is distracting it from the task of defeating the Taliban and other extremists that have poured over the Afghan border to within a 100 km from Islamabad.

Clinton said both the Obama and the Bush administrations had worked very hard to prevent India from reacting to the Mumbai attacks. “But we know that the insurgents, Al-Qaida and their syndicate partners are pretty smart.

They are not going to cease their attacks, inside India, because they are looking for exactly the kind of reaction that we all hope to prevent,” she warned. She described India’s restraint as “remarkable” since the attacks took place in the political season.

Clinton told lawmakers she believes there is an “increasing awareness, on the part of not just the Pakistani government but Pakistani people, that this insurgency coming closer and closer to major cities does pose such a threat.” Her remark was a volte-face on comments she made a day earlier to the House Foreign Affairs Committee. On Wednesday, she called on Pakistanis, Pakistani Americans and others in the diaspora to “speak out forcefully” in an effort to change the attitudes of the Pakistani government.

Asked about this change in tone, State Department spokesman Robert Wood said US officials have been talking to officials in Islamabad “at various levels for quite some time.”

“We’ve made very clear our concerns about the Taliban and Al-Qaida. And the government there is well aware.

We don’t need to tell the government of Pakistan what a threat these extremists are,” he said, declining to say whether any of these conversations had taken place in the 24 hours between Clinton’s two remarks that could have prompted a shift in thought.
 
.
This is quite possibly the clearest endorsement of India's position on Kashmir by the US in history.
 
. .
If the Bhartis and Amreekis think that they can take advantage of the precarious situation, with the insurgency raging, and force Pakistan into making concessions on Kashmir, they are badly mistaken.

Pakistan, and Pakistanis, will never abandon the Kashmiri people to the State Terrorism that is inflicted upon them by the Bharti establishment and security services.

The US should instead mediate between teh two countries, in order to bring about a solution that is at first acceptalbe to the Kashmiri people, and to Bharat and Pakistan, and that is in accordance with International Law.
 
. .
If the Bhartis and Amreekis think that they can take advantage of the precarious situation, with the insurgency raging, and force Pakistan into making concessions on Kashmir, they are badly mistaken.

Pakistan, and Pakistanis, will never abandon the Kashmiri people to the State Terrorism that is inflicted upon them by the Bharti establishment and security services.

The US should instead mediate between teh two countries, in order to bring about a solution that is at first acceptalbe to the Kashmiri people, and to Bharat and Pakistan, and that is in accordance with International Law.

DarkStar,

with all the good intentions...let me say i'm afraid that one day Pakistan might loose itself into oblivion in its quest to snatch kashmir from india.
 
.
Pakistan expectations were very high on the kashmir issue, when the new administration took power, now it is crumbling day by day.

One must look at the perspective of President Obama. Before he was President, he was mentioning that in order to resolve the southeast issue, he said first I will resolve the kashmir issue, so Pakistan can move there army to west to fight the talibans. After he has become the president his views are changed and now focused solely on fighting the AQ and talibans in Pakistan.

See the problem is the pakistan establiments thinks it was because of Indian lobbing, but that is not the case. The real case is that Obama advisor are telling what are the facts, and what needs to be done first. And it very simply, there is no current threat from India, and all Pakistan has to do to solve this terrorism problem that is plaguing the region is simply move the army west ward and start fighting.
 
.
Why is this news ONLY been published in Indian & Pakistan News ?
 
.
Pakistan, and Pakistanis, will never abandon the Kashmiri people to the State Terrorism that is inflicted upon them by the Bharti establishment and security services.

The US should instead mediate between teh two countries, in order to bring about a solution that is at first acceptalbe to the Kashmiri people, and to Bharat and Pakistan, and that is in accordance with International Law.

Not in this lifetime. Kashmir is an integral part of India. Pakistan has repeatedly tried to create problems but failed miserably. For instance, despite boycott calls, Kashmir recorded the highest voting in history.

US has realized India has a legitimate hold on Kashmir, and Pakistan is indulging in terrorism because it can never face India head on and cannot even give up on Kashmir because that would be the most embaressing thing to do. So, it will divert the attention from the 'real issue' which is of growing extremism in Pakistan, by sending its own citizens as terrorists only to be run over by IA.

What is really ironic is that now that they cant get Kashmir, they want Americans to get it for them. Little do they know that instead of giving, India might as well take the remaining part of its annexed territory. Now that is completely legimitate by international law, as a it will fully qualify under 'regaining annexed territory'.:tsk:

As we all know, IA wanted to cross over LOC after pushing enemies back during Kargil So I'm not gonna say its not possible, if only the Centre could have given the nod, much needed peace would have come to the region.
 
Last edited:
.
Calling Indians Bharatis is similar to calling you Pakisteens (pronounced like Khawa-teen).
Bharatiya is the correct word, in case you're wondering.

I refer you to the thread on the word Bharati, where it was subsequently proven that Bharati is a legitimate Urdu/Hindustani word to use. Do not create offtopic convroversies, if you have anything to add to the discussion, I suggest you post on the forum I referred to.
 
.
Pakistan seems to be CAUGHT in the middle ie A rock and a Hard place.

1. WOT increasing Taliban control in tribal borders expanding into cities with increasing USA pressure to apply more [Pakistan resources to counter this daily real threat.

OR

2. To continue the PAKISTAN ARMY/ ISI position of been in constant readiness /guard accross its Border and LOC. To face off its regional nemesis India.

** Failure to reign in the first issue wil result in more and more American pressure and more unrest in the border regions.

But Pakistan will never wind down its face off with india which has been existence since the creation of the 2 states in 1947. That posture will never relent regardless of Kashmir in my opinion.
 
.
Idiotic attempts at trying to browbeat Pakistan into accepting the status quo in Kashmir.

This will not happen. If the Pakistani government backs off, the Pakistani nation will not forgive them for it and every politician in Pakistan knows that there is no bigger political suicide than to back off the Kashmir issue (no different in India).

The Kashmir problem is as difficult as the Israel-Palestinian one or the Cyprus issue. What is being suggested here is akin to, at a certain level, asking the government of President Mahmood Abbas to forget about the problems with Israel and focus on fighting only Hamas.

People here from varying backgrounds can disagree with me, but as DS has suggested in post #4, Pakistan will not back off.

Statements like the following show the problem with Washington's policy towards Pakistan which is bound to fail big time if the same single-minded approach without regard for Pakistan's concerns is pursued. "Washington was encouraging the Pakistani government to reach out to the Indian government and “continue some of those confidence-building measures that they were doing, like opening the bus routes in Kashmir and other things that did have some positive effect.”

Its a two way street. Pakistan will not have a weak PPP government for ever. The attitudes are bound to harden on the Pakistan side and these pressure tactics will only go so far.
 
Last edited:
.
Pakistan, and Pakistanis, will never abandon the Kashmiri people to the State Terrorism that is inflicted upon them by the Bharti establishment and security services.

Care to prove the charge of "State Terrorism" by India ? That term has an accepted common usage. A group can be classified terrorist by nations, UN etc. I have not heard of that charge being made by any international body or by a sovereign nation against India.I'd even settle for evidence from a third-party neutral encyclopedia. All I have found is allegations by Pakistani groups (LeT etc.) or by some pak politicians.

I think now you are making unsubstantiated allegations.
 
.
If the Bhartis and Amreekis think that they can take advantage of the precarious situation, with the insurgency raging, and force Pakistan into making concessions on Kashmir, they are badly mistaken.

Pakistan, and Pakistanis, will never abandon the Kashmiri people to the State Terrorism that is inflicted upon them by the Bharti establishment and security services.

The US should instead mediate between teh two countries, in order to bring about a solution that is at first acceptalbe to the Kashmiri people, and to Bharat and Pakistan, and that is in accordance with International Law.

Let me tell what my perception about future Indian policy is. After 26/11, the GoI has virtually abandoned the thought of becoming friendly with Pakistan, or have any negotiations with Pakistan on Kashmir issue. India believes that Pakistan is clearly playing a double game, of talking peace on one hand while nurturing terrorism on the other hand. And India does not want to get involved in a full scale military conflict, since it would severely affect her dreams of becoming a superpower by 2020 - 2025. The great 'Indian Dream'. So it is like a deadlock situation, with no immediate way out as far as India is concerned.

Whats the better way? Keep Kashmir issue as is. While Indian economy grows, the Indian influence on the world increases, Pakistan is infested with the terrorists, which are pulling her down. So by the look of current things, in next 5 years, India would have surged ahead in all the departments & would be a significant global player, much more than it is now. And Pakistan, if at all it exists, would have gone down the drain, as a failed state. And at that time, Pakistan would have little , if not no influence at all over Kashmir issue. India would find it much easier to tweak the solution her way. And this would be achieved by extremely simple means. Do nothing. Just keep the situation as it is today. No negotiations, no talks.

As I mentioned, this is just my perception. So I would not be surprised if India in next few years makes no progress at all on Kashmir issue.
 
.
Americans are very confused. Clinton says one thing and then Gen. David Petraeus says another:

Here are few comments which were made by Gen. David Petraeus to the subcommittee of the House Committee on Appropriations in the last 24-48 hrs.

'There are people who have rightly said that Ambassador Holbrooke's title should be Afghan, Pakistan and India,’

‘Now, let me just tell you, his portfolio very much includes India'

Gen. Petraeus, however, observed that if the international community could resolve the Kashmir dispute or reduce the tensions generated by this issue, Pakistan would have had a greater focus on fighting the extremists on its western border.

DAWN.COM | World | Holbrooke?s portfolio includes India, says US general

Some would argue that these comments were made to balance the stance taken by Clinton but regardless of any point of view, Pakistan can't give up Kashmir.

There has to be a solution on Kashmir, sooner rather then later.

I hope one day Indian media actually travel across Kashmir and ask the everyday Joe about his/her opinion. Results will show that majority of Kashmiris either wants Pakistan or complete independence.

Indians need to realize that Kashmiris don't want to be part of India, it is alost cause for India.

You can buy MRCA, Nuclear submarines and send people to the moon but you can't buy the will of people.
 
.

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom