How shrinking freedom of press in Turkey brought me closer to Pakistan

[bsruzm]

Well,we'll talk about that when we get there i suppose,now it's premature.

Regardless,you're using German subs for decades now and that's a reality.

Rear Admiral, Aydın Eken: "Turkey is one of the 16 countries that have capability to build submarines." I don't think designing a submarine would be a problem for our guys next.

 

[flamer84]

Rear Admiral, Aydın Eken: "Turkey is one of the 16 countries that have capability to build submarines." I don't think designing a submarine would be a problem for our guys next.

Sure,it could be so or not.We don't know exactly and we won't probably know for 20 years.For now,those are just words.

 

[bsruzm]

Sure,it could be so or not.We don't know exactly and we won't probably know for 20 years.For now,those are just words.

You may confuse these with Romanian politicians or yourself but these are words of two high rank officials, who are responsible of Turkey's most critical projects at the moment. 5-10 or 20, I don't think we are in a hurry or need. For now 214TN is fine with maximum local content and Turkish industrial participation in the project, what worths around 80 percent of the total value of the deal.

 

[flamer84]

You may confuse these with Romanian politicians or yourself but these are words of two high rank officials, who are responsible of Turkey's most critical projects at the moment. 5-10 or 20, I don't think we are in a hurry or need. For now 214TN is fine with maximum local content and Turkish industrial participation in the project, what worths around 80 percent of the total value of the deal.

Just words,other projects were delayed in Turkey before.Words mean nothing.

reality=Turkey can't manufacture submarines,Turkey wants to in the future.Many countries want to in the future.Turkey uses German made subs now .

 

[Umair Nawaz]

Save me the chest thumping and the usual 10 year old level attacks.You can't manufacture submarines or the things i've listed without German tech.Sry if that pains you but that's the reality.

dude they r slowly changing that, im not sure abt submarines but in other sectors that u mentioned earlier.

 

[flamer84]

dude they r slowly changing that, im not sure abt submarines but in other sectors that u mentioned earlier.

They are,i haven't disputed that nor did i call them uncapable or something.But they also did it with some German tech and they're still using it.Just saying,as these started from a 'we shouldn't deal with Germany ' post.

 

[T-123456]

Interesting. I hadn't heard of them so I looked them up. I really admire Ataturk and so that is why I don't think I would have had a problem supporting the CHP if I were Turkish so maybe MHP if they remained "Kemalist" . I don't have any problem with Islamic influence per se, as long as it reflects the best values of Islam. I personally am a bit of a Catholic nationalist, but as an American, I prefer to live in a secular republic were all are equal, regardless of faith or ethic background.

The CHP you read about or know is not the current CHP,thats what i was trying to explain.
All parties in Turkiye were ''Kemalist'',even the religious ones,it all changed after 2001 when AKP came to power,the mentality changed into sectarianism,Islamism,Atheism and all the other negative ''ism''s.
Im not going to vote for the MHP for being religious but being a nationalist party,eliminate the PKK and their supporters without pardon,no more prisoners,no more peace talks.
Turkiye was a secular republic where nobody cared for the others religion,it was a private matter.
Turkish Islam was different from others,tolerant,they ruined our society.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

They are,i haven't disputed that nor did i call them uncapable or something.But they also did it with some German tech and they're still using it.Just saying,as these started from a 'we shouldn't deal with Germany ' post.

dude there is something called step by step approach. Do u think those israelis or Dutch rolled out their AESA on the very first day? It takes time to leap and in technological breakthroughs, while yr nation is in that phase foreign help is sorted or technological/industrial spying is done depending on the status that one's country enjoys. Classical examples r of israel and China in these two scenarios viz a viz america. China gets technology through spying while other one israel get that through its relations.

Turkey is also covering that vacuum through its geographical and military status with regards to NATO n all. So it has allies and relations with those nations like Germany in this case. But that doesnt mean that it will remain same every time since what they do that they just dont buy an off shelf equipment but get that through TOT and produce them at home like in case of those subs.

Eventually they will get there but slowly and gradually depending upon how much new technology and techniques their domestic knowledge base can absorb right now. What matters is as far as i can understand that it must be a continuous process and doesnt matter in long run if its slow or fast.

In the end at some point they will be self sufficient enough to produce whatever they like and technologically it will be on par with contemporaries.

 

[SQ8]

The issue here is less about shrinking press freedoms as no media house is angelic and all have particular ideas and agendas they operate upon which can be their own or planted. They require checks to ensure that any activities that damage state institutions are not allowed.However, this is a VERY VERY murky line and can lead to curbing of human right to object as well.

But this is more about Erdogan letting his power go to his head. I really did think he had the capability to take Turkey on a greater leadership role but his(and his sons) antics with Syria have left me rather disappointed. My last trip to Turkey saw a sudden gap developing between the poorer class that supports him and the upper and elite class who do not.

It is not that his domestic policies were not all good or all bad, but that he let his own ego falter his ideals. Any man who considers his ego more superior is going to make mistakes in leadership. To that extend he is now using religion like all other power crazed people to effect Turkey's otherwise perfect tolerant society that is more Islamic than any so called declared Islamic republic.

 

[Desertfalcon]

The issue here is less about shrinking press freedoms as no media house is angelic and all have particular ideas and agendas they operate upon which can be their own or planted. They require checks to ensure that any activities that damage state institutions are not allowed.However, this is a VERY VERY murky line and can lead to curbing of human right to object as well.

But this is more about Erdogan letting his power go to his head. I really did think he had the capability to take Turkey on a greater leadership role but his(and his sons) antics with Syria have left me rather disappointed. My last trip to Turkey saw a sudden gap developing between the poorer class that supports him and the upper and elite class who do not.

It is not that his domestic policies were not all good or all bad, but that he let his own ego falter his ideals. Any man who considers his ego more superior is going to make mistakes in leadership. To that extend he is now using religion like all other power crazed people to effect Turkey's otherwise perfect tolerant society that is more Islamic than any so called declared Islamic republic.

Wise words, my friend.

 

[DemirkanTR]

Erdogan(AKP) used to work with Feto,why was it ok then?
Why dont you blame Feto and Erdogan for the mess we are in?

I blame both for many things, but why would I blame both for this specific thing which is caused by only one to harm opposite side (but actually it harms our state and profits) ? They are fighting against each other for almost 5 years now but the thing I mentioned happened just 2 years ago. My aim is eating grape, not beating vinedresser!

I think many people, including plenty of Turks, are apprehensive of increasing authoritarianism that has been promoted by President Erdogan. I am as well and if I were a Turk, I would probably support the Republican People's Party over the APK for that reason, even though I am an American conservative. Nevertheless, I will support Erdogan and the Turks over almost any of their foreign critics like the Russians or some in the West. The Turks have always been staunch allies of the USA and faithful members of NATO and that means allot to me. They have always supported international security. My father fought in the Korean War and told me about the Turkish soldiers there who were legendary for their bravery. I worked with them in NATO. I definitely want Turkey on my side if I have to go to war.

I think you can understand our disappointment that your country chosed YPG/PKK over Turkey and let them build a state in our southern border. This is not the meaning of "alliance" in our dictionary!

 

[-SINAN-]

Save me the chest thumping and the usual 10 year old level attacks.You can't manufacture submarines or the things i've listed without German tech.Sry if that pains you but that's the reality.

Yeah, and US wouldn't be able to produce ICBMs, without German tech ??? So, what's your point ?

Mate, you throw some BS on the table, then accuse people of "chest thumping", etc... If you don't know what you are talking about , don't talk at all.

reality=Turkey can't manufacture submarines,

Turkey produces %80 of the U-214TN. So, "Turkey can't manufacture submarines"....yeah, than what's below...?

Oh, U-214TN it the making, in Gölcük Naval Shipyard (Turkey) with Turkish workers&engineers, with Turkish materials... Next will be Milden, indigenous submarine... So,i'm asking again. What's your point ?

Im a liberal democrate but i will probably vote for the MHP(nationalist party) this time,if and only if they change the leadership.

Mate, from what i heard;

1-) Bahçeli is goner.
2-) Koray Aydın has no chance, people don't like him because of the his corruption.
3-) I used to like Sinan Oğan but i heard that his relatives are into smuggling business, kind of a mafia family.
4-) Ümit Özdağ and Meral Akşener has the highest chance.

Meral Akşener is going to be on CNNTürk, today at 22:00. I always had the impression of her being a strong leader but kind of lacks intellectualism. Will be a good chance to know her better.

 

[Zulkarneyn]

Yeah, and US wouldn't be able to produce ICBMs, without German tech ??? So, what's your point ?

Mate, you throw some BS on the table, then accuse people of "chest thumping", etc... If you don't know what you are talking about , don't talk at all.



Turkey produces %80 of the U-214TN. So, "Turkey can't manufacture submarines"....yeah, than what's below...?
View attachment 300448

Oh, U-214TN it the making, in Gölcük Naval Shipyard (Turkey) with Turkish workers&engineers, with Turkish materials... Next will be Milden, indigenous submarine... So,i'm asking again. What's your point ?



Mate, from what i heard;

1-) Bahçeli is goner.
2-) Koray Aydın has no chance, people don't like him because of the his corruption.
3-) I used to like Sinan Oğan but i heard that his relatives are into smuggling business, kind of a mafia family.
4-) Ümit Özdağ and Meral Akşener has the highest chance.

Meral Akşener is going to be on CNNTürk, today at 22:00. I always had the impression of her being a strong leader but kind of lacks intellectualism. Will be a good chance to know her better.

Meral Akşener is connected with Feto. Ümit Özdag has the potential to raise MHP from the rubbles.

 

[-SINAN-]

First of all.....we didn't. America chose to let Kurds build a state within Turkey? How so? We recognise the autonomous Kurdish territory within Iraq, but the US has never advocated any state within Turkish borders. The meaning of "alliance" for us is not being accused of something we didn’t do. If you want to treat my country like a bitch, than I will take back what I said and the Turks can go f*ck themselves so thanks for my support. Backstabber.

I guess I should have known better than to trust yet another pathetic, "blame America for us being f*cked up", pussy. What pathetic little girls...

There is typo in my friend's words, it should have been "build a state at our southern border."

- He meant Northern Syria...where YPG is trying to establish an autonomous state and US is backing them.... Do you want to re-evaluate your words or are you still saying "Turks can go and fvck themselves" ?

- Also can you explain how we are "backstabbers" ?

- for "us being fvcked up"......in this part of world nobody can fvck with us and get away with it.

 

[T-123456]

Ümit Özdag has the potential to raise MHP from the rubbles.

Never heard of him,do you have some info about him?