How many sabres were captured?

[Zabaniyah]

The F-86 Sabre was the very first fighter in BAF service

Here's a pic:

Also, can anyone say how the PAF performed in East Pakistan during the war? I kept hearing that Pakistan's air power was limited in the Eastern sector, which was how the Indians maintained the advantage.

 

[Bratva]

Windjammer:

Once again posting fake photos are we?

Do you have any evidence that this is an IAF jet? No. Have you been busted right here on this forum lying about this photo? Idiotically, yes

Lastly, I guarantee you that this statement ( repeated by ignorant fanboys like you) is FALSE:

"At the end of the war, all Mirages in PAF inventory were lined up before the International media to be counted and photographed."

---------- Post added at 11:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:08 AM ----------

Santro:

Who is the author of the 71 book?

These pictures are released by PAF Media Wing.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

How many sabres were actually captured by India after the war in the eastern sector concluded?What happened to them later?were they brought to India or left there itself?I heard that the Pakistani airmen had damaged the vital components of the jets beyond repair.I was looking at some pics and one of them showed three sabres arranged in a row.

Captured? Do you even know the meaning of Capture?
Dictionary: Take into one's possession or control by force
These sabers were left by Pakistanis on their own so how exactly were they captured? Can you play the game capture the flag without any opponents?
Indians cant live without believing in myths.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Windjammer:

Once again posting fake photos are we?

Just one thing: Try to also refute my points. Didn't I just call you a liar about the MIG-21 photo and your statement about "ALL MIRAGES LINED UP BEFORE THE INTERNATIONAL MEDIA"?

your syndrome explained. "Pathological liar and Pathological delusion".

Fake Mig-21 photos?

 

[Shinigami]

fanboys.


what is the purpose of an AF? to ensure air superiority.
why? so that ground troops can do their job.

the troops from which country captured more territory? we all know who
what does that tell you? This particular country achieved air superiority.

Why did the IAF have more losses? because they had a very high sortie rate, most of which were offensive.
Why did the PAF have less losses? because they had a very low sortie rate, most of which were defensive.

What is the moral of the story? Without air superiority, One cannot capture territory

 

[ziaulislam]

fanboys.


what is the purpose of an AF? to ensure air superiority.
why? so that ground troops can do their job.

the troops from which country captured more territory? we all know who
what does that tell you? This particular country achieved air superiority.

Why did the IAF have more losses? because they had a very high sortie rate, most of which were offensive.
Why did the PAF have less losses? because they had a very low sortie rate, most of which were defensive.

What is the moral of the story? Without air superiority, One cannot capture territory

at eastern wing we had little force while at western wing india didnt went into major war with us..that was the reason..india tried at western wing in 65..and got a very nice reply..
its a reality that real victory in 71 was by rebels..indian army merely supported them with fire power they lacked

 

[DARKY]

See these **** indians saying...... IAF came with a plan nd PAKISTAN was dreaming about the past.... Holy ****......
Also saying PAF underestimated IAF and overestimated herself....... ALL BULLSHIT.......... Let me tell you when you are beaten badly then you just can not hide the reality by making yourself innocent and making other to believe that we won we won......
GO AND HIDE YOURSELF....... Maybe we lost the war on the ground but we never gave it up in the year......... PAF screwed IAF so much that still they are worried about 5 to 1 ratio otherwise they can not even scramble their jets when the time arrives.....

It was the then Prime Minister of Pakistan who pointed out the PAF chief Air Marshal Rahim Khan and several other officers by name.... and Busted their unwillingness to engage IAF since they feared aircraft losses.

IAF flew at least double the number of combat sorties per day than the PAF....... Hence exposing itself to ground fire and enemy interdiction....... Despite this, the IAF's attrition rate of 0.86 per 100 sorties during the 1971 War compares favourably with the Israeli rate of 1.1 in the Yom Kippur War....... The PAF's overall attrition rate works out to 2.47 (including transporters and recce aircraft lost on the ground)...... Now If the aircraft destroyed on the ground are not taken into account...... The rate comes out to be 1.12........ which is still very high given that PAF aircraft never really stood back to fight.... and prefered to run out most of the times.

The question of loss is important...... However in the ultimate analysis is secondary....... Achieving air superiority cost the IAF Heavily in 71 but in the end they managed to achieve complete dominance over the skies in both East and West Pakistan..... which some people here find it hard to except.... and bring in the number of aircrafts shot down..... but forget the fact that even on that account PAF pilots preferred stay on ground hidden in their Hardened Shelters to save their Planes from being shot down..... and allowed Karachi to burn aswell as their Tanks to be destroyed..... Add to the fact that most of the F-86 sabres Destroyed on ground on the Eastern front were destroyed by PAF officers what else do people here want when the soldier himself is burning their weapons in order to save themselves from being Killed..... It only speaks Volumes about the willingness of PAF pilots to fight the Air war.

 

[DARKY]

at eastern wing we had little force while at western wing india didnt went into major war with us..that was the reason..india tried at western wing in 65..and got a very nice reply..
its a reality that real victory in 71 was by rebels..indian army merely supported them with fire power they lacked

Stop with the craps like we had little force..... or we had less resource..... No Navy etc...etc....
Is it so hard to see the reality what else would be a major war for you where about 14,000 km2 territory in West Pakistan was captured by Indian troops.
Its was troops on Eastern Front which showed some guts and stood against enemy in Hilli.... while the ones in West were having wet dreams about blitzkrieg Indian territory all the way to Delhi without any air support
The battles faught at Longewala and Basantar clearly shows the BS propaganda they were fed with..... and never cared to be battle ready.

 

[Shinigami]

at eastern wing we had little force while at western wing india didnt went into major war with us..that was the reason..india tried at western wing in 65..and got a very nice reply..
its a reality that real victory in 71 was by rebels..indian army merely supported them with fire power they lacked

are u kidding me? IA captured chunks of west pakistan territory in 65 and 71.

like i said IAF suffered losses because its sorties were offensive. did u know that IAF and IN attacked Karachi regularly in cordination?

 

[MZUBAIR]

Since your post is not credible and is full of non-facts, I accept your 'Guilty' plea.

This is a vast improvement on your earlier attitude of lying and denying the truth till you go blue in the face

Windjammer is very senior person in the community and have well solid knowledge about histroy and Defence related information.
I am sorry about your immature behavior....

Please stick to the topic or will be reported.

 

[John Doe]

Windjammer is very senior person in the community and have well solid knowledge about histroy and Defence related information.
I am sorry about your immature behavior....

Please stick to the topic or will be reported.

Sorry, I don't share your opinion of WJ as being knowledgeable about military history, etc. He has been caught lying on this forum more times that I care to remember. Feel free to report me, if you don't like what I type.

Secondly, seniority on online forums is not based on actual age, experience, intelligence, knowledge, etc. Just on the number of posts. Think about this for some time.

Cheers!

 

[SQ8]

Windjammer:

Once again posting fake photos are we?

Do you have any evidence that this is an IAF jet? No. Have you been busted right here on this forum lying about this photo? Idiotically, yes

Lastly, I guarantee you that this statement ( repeated by ignorant fanboys like you) is FALSE:

"At the end of the war, all Mirages in PAF inventory were lined up before the International media to be counted and photographed."

---------- Post added at 11:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:08 AM ----------

Santro:

Who is the author of the 71 book?

Pran chopra I think..

And yes.. the mirages were all lined up.. not one.. but multiple PAF sources have verified it. Including A/C kaiser Tufail whose figures are the most accurate you will find. He has been very methodical in his research.
The mirages escaped unscathed and put up a good show. Even after repeated attempts to engage mig-21's.. not one mirage vs fishbed fight ever occurred. (except the one in which a mig-21 wingman shot down his leader at night whilst trying to intercept recce mirages..if that can be even counted as a fight).

And both WJ and John.. lay off each other.. agree to disagree and move on.
The rest can ignore jingoism from both sides..

 

[John Doe]

@ Myth Buster :

Care to upload the page which is 2 pages below this one?

You know the one: Where John Fricker says that he saw 22 and not 23 Mirages in the Lineup?
Hell, you can count them in the photo yourself, no?!?!?!

See what I have a problem with? These terms that get repeated constantly by blind fans, such as "All Mirages lined up" and "International Media"

@ Santro:

Firstly see above. Secondly IIRC I had read on Jagan's website where he and Sameer Chopra had given the serial nos. of the Mirages that were not talked about by the PAF. All I could find now was this from his page:

"Pakistan's 24 or 28 Mirage III's


At the End of the 1971 Bangladesh War, When it was time to sit back and assess scores, The Indian Air Force after evaluating the results throughout the war claimed among the PAF aircraft destroyed, Five of the PAF's Prize Mirage III Jets. Pakistan was quick to rebuff the claim and in a major PR exercise, arranged for a display of its Mirage III Fleet. It had received 24 Mirage III Interceptors from France. and it invited foreign journalists to one of its airbases where 23 of the Mirage III aircraft were displayed. the 24th aircraft supposedly lost on a training flight prior to the War. The Indian Claim of Five Mirage III's seemed ludicrous.

Then France let the cat out of the bag. It said it had delivered 28 Mirages not 24 as Pakistan claimed. so the Indian claim was not far off the mark."

 

[fatman17]

The F-86 Sabre was the very first fighter in BAF service

Here's a pic:

Also, can anyone say how the PAF performed in East Pakistan during the war? I kept hearing that Pakistan's air power was limited in the Eastern sector, which was how the Indians maintained the advantage.

if you throw what was it 9 IAF squadrons against 1 PAF squadron, u can maintain advantage.!

 

[Windjammer]

Sorry, I don't share your opinion of WJ as being knowledgeable about military history, etc. He has been caught lying on this forum more times that I care to remember. Feel free to report me, if you don't like what I type.

Secondly, seniority on online forums is not based on actual age, experience, intelligence, knowledge, etc. Just on the number of posts. Think about this for some time.

Cheers!

You your self are as credible as an ash tray on a motor bike.

You have miserably failed to prove any substance to back up your weird claims, and always found a convenient escape route like we can all witness in your post#12.
I believe you are a senior citizen, hence you should behave like one and earn respect.... otherwise, a stray animal has to be constantly whacked behind the ears to keep it in line. Since you do seem oblivious to the word respect, I suggest, you take a leaf out of Sir Fatman's book.