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How China is building warships as India sleeps

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POLITICS
| 4-minute read | 08-09-2015

RAVI RIKHYE


Republic of China (Taiwan) intelligence says China is constructing two 60,000-tonne aircraft carriers, one each as Dalian and Shanghai. China's first carrier Liaoning (L16) underwent a seven-year rebuild at Dalian before its 2012 commissioning, so choosing that shipyard is logical. Shanghai is a surprise and suggests China intends to build these capital warships in pairs. An operational date of 2020 is suggested for both. It is possible the next pair will appear in 2025.

India, having commissioned INS Vikrant (R11) five decades before the Chinese carrier, now will be eclipsed in five years. Currently we have INS Vikramaditya (R33), a 45,000-tonner that like China's Liaoning came from the former Soviet Union, and accepted into service in 2014. INS Virat (R22) will be decommissioned next year to be replaced on 2018 by the second Vikrant(presumably R44), which displaces 40,000-tons. INS Vishaal, 65,000-tons, is planned to commission in 2023. Since, however, it is still in planning, assuming it is rapidly put under construction, 2025 is a more likely in-service date.Right there is a problem. India proposes three carriers, one each for the eastern and western fleets, with one in maintenance/overhaul reserve. But long before we have our three, China will have three medium-sized carriers, and five when we have three. The fourth and fifth carriers may well be super-sized and nuclear-powered, in which they will likely appear later than 2025. Given the secrecy surrounding Chinese military programs, much of this is speculation. It is possibly the two carriers under construction will be larger and nuclear-power, but this is guesswork on the part of Chinese blogs.

No one is suggesting India will launch carriers into the China seas. India may develop global ambitions when its GDP passes $10-trillion, say, by 2030. Currently, however, our goal is limited to dominating the Indian Ocean. China is already making clear its goals are global. Earlier this year its 18th Escort Task Force, after finishing anti-piracy duty off Somalia and the Gulf of Aden visited France for exercises, Britain, Germany, the Netherlands, and Greece. The task force consisted of a frigate, an LPD, and a supply ship. Currently its 19th Escort Task Force consisting one two frigates and a supply ship is on anti-piracy patrol, and it will be interesting to see if it makes any visits.

The PLAN had a big exercise with Russia in the North Pacific. Five ships - three frigates, an LPD and a supply ship boldly popped up in the Bering Sea off Alaska for a five-day visit. They even thumbed their noses at the US by grazing American US territorial waters. It is simply a matter of time before PLAN carriers turn-up west of Guam, then west of Hawaii, and then off the US West Coast. This analyst predicts based on current information that these events will start taking place from 2025.

For observers of India the question now becomes a simple one. With Chinese plans for a global navy now revealed, how will India react? Based on past national behaviour, it can be predicted we will NOT react. We will continue our slow, bumbling pace. At that it has to be admitted the Indian Navy at least has a plan under implementation. Inadequately, yes, too casually, yes. The Indian Air Force has a plan that is not being implemented. The Indian Army does not have a plan except on paper - and too is wildly inadequate.

China has last week announced it is to cut military manpower by 300,000 to free resources for its navy and air force. This cut will fall on the Army, which nominally has 1.25-million troops, though this analysts believe actual strength is less. Be that as it may, the PLA reduction is hardly good news for India.

The PLA has been moving slowly toward a force of 72 large brigades in 18 corps. At this time there are plenty of divisions still extant, mainly because the Chinese formation modernization foundered on the inability of the brigade staff to manage four maneuver and two artillery battalions plus several company-sized combat units. This analyst believes that the PLA has, or is close to, resolving these problems. The reason this is bad news for India is that the new brigades have considerably more combat capability than the divisions they replace.

So when Chinese carriers start visiting Burma, Sri Lanka, and Pakistan, we are unlikely to be stirred into faster and coordinated action. We will remain snug in our customary lethargy. For example, the real possibility of a PLAN carrier task force on permanent station in the Indian Ocean by 2035, when China may have six operational carriers, is for us so distant that it is an unreality. The battle flags flying from Delhi signal, "No action imminent, go back to snoozing".

How China is building warships as India sleeps
@nair @SpArK @MilSpec @GURU DUTT @OrionHunter @Horus @Rashid Mahmood @SarthakGanguly @Areesh @Hindustani78 @third eye @Water Car Engineer
 
The Type 001A is 70000 tons and the Type 002 is 80000 tons.

China is also planning to add more than 20 advanced nuclear subs in this decade for sure.

Not mentioning those Type 052D DDGs where China is producing like sausages, and the Type 055 is also coming soon.
 
The Type 001A is 70000 tons and the Type 002 is 80000 tons.

China is also planning to add more than 20 advanced nuclear subs in this decade for sure.

Not mentioning those Type 052D DDGs where China is producing like sausages, and the Type 055 is also coming soon.
And all of this aimed towards what ?
Which Navy is considered no.1 potential threat for PLAN ?
That is what I'd like to know.
Is it the possible conflict with the US or are these preparations for a pottential bitterness with China's eastern neighborhood.
 
The Type 001A is 70000 tons and the Type 002 is 80000 tons.

China is also planning to add more than 20 advanced nuclear subs in this decade for sure.

Not mentioning those Type 052D DDGs where China is producing like sausages, and the Type 055 is also coming soon.

I recently heard 2 001A is about 60,000 though it's close enough. 2 002, no info on those but have heard conventional with steam, and then 003 after that.

nuke subs? Have not heard much, but I think 3-5 new SSN by 2020 is more realistic. Type 52D, was it 12 or 20 forgot, 055 could be a game changer, but probably limited in numbers(in relation to the US' 60) for now, from what I heard.

Conflicting reports everywhere.


Regarding this article, too much of a focus on carriers, China's strength, relative to India, lies in numbers, and tonnage. The weapon systems should be similar as India has access to the latest in Israeli and European as well as American tech.
 
I feel sorry for India.
The best way to proceed for the next decade(s) for India is to accept Chinese hegemony and be humbled.
I know this sounds bitter from an Indian perspective but it is the only way to guarantee a safe and prosperous future for India.
If India accepts the fact that yes China is/will be the shupa powah of this region then China will also feel less challenged.Then Chinese will start doing with India what they like to do.Friendly Business.And I mean huge mammoth businesses which are not happening now because India keeps on signalling China that itvwants to rival China.
These stupid articles are making a mindset for the future Indian generations.
India in reality cannot and should not get itself into an arms race with China.
Whatever the Indians manage to pull,China will be ahead of them.Always.
If India will acquire 10 warships,China will add 20.
If India will have an army of FGFAs,China will already have a pack of SGFAs.
And then China will always use Pakistan against India and Pakistan will always be willing.
Point is,these billions being spent on defense are going to create more problems for India.
The more India spends,the more China will take it as a threat and China will always make sure to outspend and out procure India because it can.Good manners with China ensure a good future for India.
 
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Misinformation and disinformation。
 
I feel sorry for India.
The best way to proceed for the next decade(s) for India is to accept Chinese hegemony and be humbled.
I know this sounds bitter from an Indian perspective but it is the only way to guarantee a safe and prosperous future for India.
If India accepts the fact that yes China is/will be the shupa powah of this region then China will also feel less challenged.Then Chinese will start doing with India what they like to do.Friendly Business.And I mean huge mammoth businesses which are not happening now because India keeps on signalling China that itvwants to rival China.
These stupid articles are making a mindset for the future Indian generations.
India in reality cannot and should not get itself into an arms race with China.
Whatever the Indians manage to pull,China will be ahead of them.Always.
If India will acquire 10 warships,China will add 20.
If India will have an army of FGFAs,China will already have a pack of SGFAs.
And then China will always use Pakistan against India and Pakistan will always be willing.
Point is,these billions being spent on defense are going to create more problems for India.
The more India spends,the more China will take it as a threat and China will always make sure to outspend and out procure India because it can.Good manners with China ensure a good future for India.

As usual apane dum par kuchh nahi.................

P.S- Nixon impresses me more and more. ;)


Indeed, our navy is undertaking a large fleet build up.
 
These sensationalist titles (from either extreme) are becoming tiring.

Getting journalists that have zero knowledge of defence related matters to write some stupid article that presents only one side of the story.
 
I feel sorry for India.
The best way to proceed for the next decade(s) for India is to accept Chinese hegemony and be humbled.
I know this sounds bitter from an Indian perspective but it is the only way to guarantee a safe and prosperous future for India.
If India accepts the fact that yes China is/will be the shupa powah of this region then China will also feel less challenged.Then Chinese will start doing with India what they like to do.Friendly Business.And I mean huge mammoth businesses which are not happening now because India keeps on signalling China that itvwants to rival China.
These stupid articles are making a mindset for the future Indian generations.
India in reality cannot and should not get itself into an arms race with China.
Whatever the Indians manage to pull,China will be ahead of them.Always.
If India will acquire 10 warships,China will add 20.
If India will have an army of FGFAs,China will already have a pack of SGFAs.
And then China will always use Pakistan against India and Pakistan will always be willing.
Point is,these billions being spent on defense are going to create more problems for India.
The more India spends,the more China will take it as a threat and China will always make sure to outspend and out procure India because it can.Good manners with China ensure a good future for India.
Mate, this is exactly what India is doing with Pakistan......Can you accept Indian hagemony and be humbled??
 
I feel sorry for India.
The best way to proceed for the next decade(s) for India is to accept Chinese hegemony and be humbled.
I know this sounds bitter from an Indian perspective but it is the only way to guarantee a safe and prosperous future for India.
If India accepts the fact that yes China is/will be the shupa powah of this region then China will also feel less challenged.Then Chinese will start doing with India what they like to do.Friendly Business.And I mean huge mammoth businesses which are not happening now because India keeps on signalling China that itvwants to rival China.
These stupid articles are making a mindset for the future Indian generations.
India in reality cannot and should not get itself into an arms race with China.
Whatever the Indians manage to pull,China will be ahead of them.Always.
If India will acquire 10 warships,China will add 20.
If India will have an army of FGFAs,China will already have a pack of SGFAs.
And then China will always use Pakistan against India and Pakistan will always be willing.
Point is,these billions being spent on defense are going to create more problems for India.
The more India spends,the more China will take it as a threat and China will always make sure to outspend and out procure India because it can.Good manners with China ensure a good future for India.
not the brightest kid around are you?
 
By that China will have 300.
Rest assured.China will only be cozy with you until you are subservient.
The day they sense that now you're posing some real threat they'll turn on the aggressive mode.

The thing is how economy works .. If our economy increase we will sure Increase the number of warship . Rest China has USN 7th Fleet on door , Japan Martime Self-Defence Force , and other small nation while we have only one Pakistan Navy that cant stand Indian western Fleet Alone . so, it won't be a tough call for Indian Navy .
 
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