Hizbul Mujahideen commander killed in Kupwara

[Parul]

Rot in Hell.

 

[Hellfire]

Rot in Hell.

The request is refused!!!! Even hell has standards........

LOL

On a serious note, we are again entering an era wherein a whole generation of Kashmiri youth will be wiped off due to stupid actions against the state.

It is kind of a cyclic trend now ... 90s kids are now the late teens early 20s psychos now, high on adrenaline and not an ounce of brain to understand that to achieve their target, the society must first be progressive, and developed.

The right to violence in any nation state rests exclusively with the state, and anyone trying to appropriate the same for own self does so at grave risks .... stupid gits!

 

[Joe Shearer]

The request is refused!!!! Even hell has standards........

LOL

On a serious note, we are again entering an era wherein a whole generation of Kashmiri youth will be wiped off due to stupid actions against the state.

It is kind of a cyclic trend now ... 90s kids are now the late teens early 20s psychos now, high on adrenaline and not an ounce of brain to understand that to achieve their target, the society must first be progressive, and developed.

The right to violence in any nation state rests exclusively with the state, and anyone trying to appropriate the same for own self does so at grave risks .... stupid gits!

You need to meet the same people I do, read the same posts I do, to understand the depths of despair at the all-pervasive miasma of despondency due to constant tiny but recurring incidents of violence that the ordinary Kashmiri kid faces. I have at least five fervent requests for jobs pending with me, and the moment I get onto firm ground myself, they will be my priorities. These are among those who have gathered up courage to ask for help: it isn't easy, it doesn't come naturally. For each of them, they tell me, there are another twenty or twentyfive more of their acquaintance.

There are so many oppositional trends to the Tehreek that it will take a whole paper to analyse the situation and lay out the major components.

In the middle of this turmoil, the J&K Police are both behaving like complete freaks, like what happened in Bangladesh in 71, as well as resenting bitterly the position that they find themselves in: hated by the terrorists for hunting them down and eliminating them, resented by the pro-India elements or even by the out-of-Kashmir elements because they impose their strict rules on them. The situation really needs handling in a sensitive manner, in order to eliminate the social, political and psychological background which feeds terrorism, and it is not clear who will take up this sensitive handling.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I wholeheartedly agree.

Once I happened to interact with a group of three doctors of Kashmir Health Services. I enquired about their view on Kashmir and status of the same. After the initial hesitancy in speaking openly, they opened up a bit. One said that it would be good if they were independent. I took this opportunity to ask them to convince me of their case and I would willingly stand by them against my country if they could give logical rationale.

Two of them started on uniqueness of their culture, natural resources, skills. All were, but rebutted by my counter view of culture not being trampled under India, natural resources unexploited due to prevailing insurgency, being landlocked an independent Kashmir will be at mercy of neighbors as a sovereign state and lack of skill development due to prevalent conditions and a whole generation growing under the shadow of violence and under barrel of a gun. After some to and fro, the third doctor spoke up. What he said neatly summed the situation in Kashmir: he said that he may get killed if the contents of our conversation were to be made known in his home town,but he feared God and honesty was required at the moment. He dismissed the arguments of his friend, emphasized that even if India and Pakistan leave Kashmir be, China would annex it like Tibet, and summed up by saying that the secret of the whole problem lies in the inherent laziness of the Kashmiri who doesn't want to work and wants to be paid by government of India for not working yet being provided all facilities.

A neat summation which is uncannily true?

Ooh, hard-hitting and painfully honest. But that's a Kashmiri for you. Just when you start thinking that he'll say whatever he thinks you'd like to hear, he comes out with a devastating truth that completely silences you. A very complex people. But I do dislike the others who come smarming along claiming kinship. They have nothing in common.

 

[Hellfire]

You need to meet the same people I do, read the same posts I do, to understand the depths of despair at the all-pervasive miasma of despondency due to constant tiny but recurring incidents of violence that the ordinary Kashmiri kid faces. I have at least five fervent requests for jobs pending with me, and the moment I get onto firm ground myself, they will be my priorities. These are among those who have gathered up courage to ask for help: it isn't easy, it doesn't come naturally. For each of them, they tell me, there are another twenty or twentyfive more of their acquaintance.

There are so many oppositional trends to the Tehreek that it will take a whole paper to analyse the situation and lay out the major components.

In the middle of this turmoil, the J&K Police are both behaving like complete freaks, like what happened in Bangladesh in 71, as well as resenting bitterly the position that they find themselves in: hated by the terrorists for hunting them down and eliminating them, resented by the pro-India elements or even by the out-of-Kashmir elements because they impose their strict rules on them. The situation really needs handling in a sensitive manner, in order to eliminate the social, political and psychological background which feeds terrorism, and it is not clear who will take up this sensitive handling.

Very true Sir.

My interaction with the Kashmiris has been an excellent experience, irrespective of their purported issues. Unsurprisingly, those who demand the need for Azadi are those whose children are well settled/undergoing education outside valley, be it in Delhi or Mumbai or out of India. The common Kashmiri has only one demand - a good governance, education and job opportunities.

I remember a small kid in Srinagar asking Rs 200 to stone the local hurriyat office and rs 500 to stone Geelani's house!! Hilarious yet ironic, as the basic demand of governance is unfortunately not being met by the local administration there. The void of even basic services is being filled by army in remote locales as also along LC where the local administration simply turns up in summers to enjoy the good weather and have an 'outing'.

The nexus between the politicians-hurriyat-JKP in terms of being in cahoots with each other is an eye opener.

Political settlement remains the need of the hour, yet neither the local government nor the GoI has shown any inclination of doing that!

 

[Joe Shearer]

Very true Sir.

My interaction with the Kashmiris has been an excellent experience, irrespective of their purported issues. Unsurprisingly, those who demand the need for Azadi are those whose children are well settled/undergoing education outside valley, be it in Delhi or Mumbai or out of India. The common Kashmiri has only one demand - a good governance, education and job opportunities.

I remember a small kid in Srinagar asking Rs 200 to stone the local hurriyat office and rs 500 to stone Geelani's house!! Hilarious yet ironic, as the basic demand of governance is unfortunately not being met by the local administration there. The void of even basic services is being filled by army in remote locales as also along LC where the local administration simply turns up in summers to enjoy the good weather and have an 'outing'.

The nexus between the politicians-hurriyat-JKP in terms of being in cahoots with each other is an eye opener.

Political settlement remains the need of the hour, yet neither the local government nor the GoI has shown any inclination of doing that!

IMHO, the biggest criminals in this are the bureaucrats of the Government of India, who first subverted the J&K Constitution, and then kept advising the politicians (after Indira, who had a very good sense of the state of Kashmiri politics, born out of her intimate knowledge of the state) very, very badly. What happened after 1984, a watershed year, is what is polluting the atmosphere now (people normally quote 1989-90, but a little reading about the chain of events will show clearly what happened when, and where the root causes lie).

 

[SrNair]

Lets see how many are eliminated in this famous photo

View attachment 314444

View attachment 314446

Lolz, poor rats.. Wanted to be famous - got themselves killed.

Only three remains .

Very true Sir.

My interaction with the Kashmiris has been an excellent experience, irrespective of their purported issues. Unsurprisingly, those who demand the need for Azadi are those whose children are well settled/undergoing education outside valley, be it in Delhi or Mumbai or out of India. The common Kashmiri has only one demand - a good governance, education and job opportunities.

I remember a small kid in Srinagar asking Rs 200 to stone the local hurriyat office and rs 500 to stone Geelani's house!! Hilarious yet ironic, as the basic demand of governance is unfortunately not being met by the local administration there. The void of even basic services is being filled by army in remote locales as also along LC where the local administration simply turns up in summers to enjoy the good weather and have an 'outing'.

The nexus between the politicians-hurriyat-JKP in terms of being in cahoots with each other is an eye opener.

Political settlement remains the need of the hour, yet neither the local government nor the GoI has shown any inclination of doing that!

Core problem lies in the so called 'special' status of J&K.
Politicians in J&K earns a lot through the unaudited funds from the centre but ordinary Kashmiris problem still remain there .Sometimes Army will becomes their scapegoat for their cheap politics and I am talking about all politicians including from BJP.Look at the recent so called 'molestation' incident .

But this is a trap that always become tight when ever we tries to loose it .
Only choice is to convince them in join the mainstream .

 

[Hellfire]

IMHO, the biggest criminals in this are the bureaucrats of the Government of India, who first subverted the J&K Constitution, and then kept advising the politicians (after Indira, who had a very good sense of the state of Kashmiri politics, born out of her intimate knowledge of the state) very, very badly. What happened after 1984, a watershed year, is what is polluting the atmosphere now (people normally quote 1989-90, but a little reading about the chain of events will show clearly what happened when, and where the root causes lie).

Sir, totally agreed. Irrespective of the loyalty to our nation I am highly critical of the way things have been handled at the political front. We have achieved the target for the armed forces, yet continue to dither on the political front. In 2007 the 'intelligent' people came up with the idea to introduce Saudi money via Jamiat Ahl-e-Hadith, which has sprung up as a major charity and educational organization which is augmenting the efforts at grassroots where the existential government infrastructure is lacking and the void is being filled in by this and other affiliated organizations. The aim was supposedly to divide the Deonbandi leaning outfits and pitch them against the more orthodox Wahabi leanings and in the process try and augment the Kashmiri sufi fabric. Seriously, such policies have rarely ever been sensible at inception and never at execution. Between 2007 and 2015, the secular and progressive fabric of Kashmiri society has undergone a shift which was earlier merely perceptible and now evident. As an example, where in 2009 it was rare to find hijab, now it is becoming quite common. The aim, evidently has backfired on the 'brains' and now we are seeing more and more wahabi and takfiri thoughts, which saw the bloodbath of rival factions in the run up to panchayat elections.

A case of a madarssa catering to primary education in North Kashmir is an example of the gross stupidities of the IAS bureaucrats. This madarssa was observed actively teaching children of 5-7 years of age that the Indian Army was an occupying force and in full knowledge of the district administration! The funding - zakat from Saudi Arabia et al!

My wife, someone who has been discussed briefly on this forum for her achievements a few years back, was interacting with a village headman's wife on a trip to Kashmir. The wife of the headman, after coming to know what my wife did, simply asked help in securing suitable grooms for her daughters outside the valley in order to enable them to have a good life which they have been bereft of.

Upon pointing out that the state had passed a legislation that would strip a Kashmiri woman of her citizenship if she marries outside the valley, the attitude of the lady remained same.

It is these things that tell us the human and societal costs being inflicted upon the ordinary Kashmiri while India and Pakistan continue to dilly dally over negotiating.

Sad

But this is a trap that always become tight when ever we tries to loose it .
Only choice is to convince them in join the mainstream .

Another example. A 11th standard Kashmiri boy approached a Maratha Light Infantry unit which was in valley a couple of years back. He wanted to join NDA and become an Officer. The CO was a magnanimous and offered the child all guidance and invited him to seek guidance from the youngsters of the unit any time he was free and opened up the unit library for him. Since units have subscription to Competition Success Review, ACC, NDA, SSB entrance books, all the resources were put at the boys disposal. The CO went so far as to tell the child to go for coaching as a sponsored candidate to Pune to prepare for SSB and the unit will sponsor him and would like him to join the unit. The boy went away happy.

Couple of days passed by but the boy was not found coming to the unit to start off. The CO sent his detail to check on the boy.

The parents had flatly refused!! It was apparent that this decision was under duress as it was confirmed by the local SOG embedded asset ...... the parents had been threatened with ex-communication by the maulvi and parents with the rape of his daughters if the boy went on the course.

In such a scenario, until and unless the political will is there, nothing can be achieved. A soldier can only provide an environment for implementation of a political solution.

 

[SrNair]

Sir, totally agreed. Irrespective of the loyalty to our nation I am highly critical of the way things have been handled at the political front. We have achieved the target for the armed forces, yet continue to dither on the political front. In 2007 the 'intelligent' people came up with the idea to introduce Saudi money via Jamiat Ahl-e-Hadith, which has sprung up as a major charity and educational organization which is augmenting the efforts at grassroots where the existential government infrastructure is lacking and the void is being filled in by this and other affiliated organizations. The aim was supposedly to divide the Deonbandi leaning outfits and pitch them against the more orthodox Wahabi leanings and in the process try and augment the Kashmiri sufi fabric. Seriously, such policies have rarely ever been sensible at inception and never at execution. Between 2007 and 2015, the secular and progressive fabric of Kashmiri society has undergone a shift which was earlier merely perceptible and now evident. As an example, where in 2009 it was rare to find hijab, now it is becoming quite common. The aim, evidently has backfired on the 'brains' and now we are seeing more and more wahabi and takfiri thoughts, which saw the bloodbath of rival factions in the run up to panchayat elections.

A case of a madarssa catering to primary education in North Kashmir is an example of the gross stupidities of the IAS bureaucrats. This madarssa was observed actively teaching children of 5-7 years of age that the Indian Army was an occupying force and in full knowledge of the district administration! The funding - zakat from Saudi Arabia et al!

My wife, someone who has been discussed briefly on this forum for her achievements a few years back, was interacting with a village headman's wife on a trip to Kashmir. The wife of the headman, after coming to know what my wife did, simply asked help in securing suitable grooms for her daughters outside the valley in order to enable them to have a good life which they have been bereft of.

Upon pointing out that the state had passed a legislation that would strip a Kashmiri woman of her citizenship if she marries outside the valley, the attitude of the lady remained same.

It is these things that tell us the human and societal costs being inflicted upon the ordinary Kashmiri while India and Pakistan continue to dilly dally over negotiating.

Sad



Another example. A 11th standard Kashmiri boy approached a Maratha Light Infantry unit which was in valley a couple of years back. He wanted to join NDA and become an Officer. The CO was a magnanimous and offered the child all guidance and invited him to seek guidance from the youngsters of the unit any time he was free and opened up the unit library for him. Since units have subscription to Competition Success Review, ACC, NDA, SSB entrance books, all the resources were put at the boys disposal. The CO went so far as to tell the child to go for coaching as a sponsored candidate to Pune to prepare for SSB and the unit will sponsor him and would like him to join the unit. The boy went away happy.

Couple of days passed by but the boy was not found coming to the unit to start off. The CO sent his detail to check on the boy.

The parents had flatly refused!! It was apparent that this decision was under duress as it was confirmed by the local SOG embedded asset ...... the parents had been threatened with ex-communication by the maulvi and parents with the rape of his daughters if the boy went on the course.

In such a scenario, until and unless the political will is there, nothing can be achieved. A soldier can only provide an environment for implementation of a political solution.

Hard reality indeed .
Across the border it is establishment that makes money through warmongering and scare mongering .In our nation it is bureaucrats and politicians.
Neither there is a political will nor a rules or regulations that allows Armed forces to take care of such aspiring kids in to our unit .Parents only cares about the well being of their children .We cant blame him .
Politicians in the valley have nexus with such maulvi and separatists .
So they will maintain a nasty balance approach like this even in future .Until there is a political will to change that special 'constitutional status of J&K' situations will remain same .