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Halt in Kirpi line hinders terror fight, irks workers

Saithan

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A halt in production at a plant producing crucial armored vehicles for the Turkish military is both hampering the fight against the outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK) and hurting thousands of workers. The row comes at a time when the PKK has intensified its attacks in eastern and southeastern Turkey. The attacks have sometimes targeted non-armored vehicles carrying unarmed soldiers, thus resulting in current personnel carrying methods being strongly criticized.

The non-defense commercial problems of BMC, the maker of Turkey’s Kirpi branded armored carriers, are the reason for the year-long failure in deliveries, the head of the Undersecretariat of Defense (SSM) Murad Bayar told journalists at a meeting in the Aegean province of İzmir. The SSM has continued its payments to the company and the delivery problem is not limited to Kirpi, he said.

“[BMC’s] financial failure has caused delays in getting goods from subcontractors. ... We have made the necessary payments on time for the project. The BMC’s problem is due to its trade activities, and this has also affected our project,” Bayar said.

The SSM signed a deal in 2009 with the İzmir based-company to produce 468 Kirpi’s to be delivered by the end of 2012. The BMC is currently 17 months behind the agreed schedule. Along with the military, police forces are also waiting for 468 Kirpi vehicles whose delivery date has passed.

“This is happening for the first time,” a defense source told the Hürriyet Daily News. “Usually, companies promise a product but production does not meet the requirements and their promises. Kirpi is an exception. It fully meets the requirements but the company cannot meet the production schedule.”

So far, only 273 Kirpis are in use. Delivery of the remaining 185 in the next three months seems impossible. So far, the financial result of a delay is reportedly a 6 million Euro penalty from the SSM to the BMC.

“In defense projects, such a penalty may mean the bankruptcy of a company,” a source commented. The company’s debt to subcontractors is so high that 1 billion Turkish Liras worth of goods are already under sequestration, according to sources.

The BMC is speculated to have talked with SSM undersecretary Murad Bayar to solve the problem. Bayar reportedly said he would change the system and take complaints into consideration. It has also been claimed that the sale of the company was requested, but Bayar refused this.

He also said they were in close contact with the company and that he was hopeful the problem would be solved soon. He added that the BMC had also failed to deliver the vehicles for three other truck tenders.

Kirpi is also among Turkey’s important defense exports items. There are some alternatives to it, but SSM officials are cool on such options, as alternative vehicles mean extra tests and evaluations. In short, alternatives mean losing time for production.

The company officials say that they are hopeful they will find a solution to the financial problem in October 2012.

Employees work unpaid
BMC workers protested on Sept. 26, calling on the firm to make payments and continue production. They chanted slogans such as: “Do not halt Kirpi, do not let soldiers die.”

Halil İbrahim Tosun, head of the BMC workers trade union, said the workers had not been paid for five months and that production was halted 10 days ago. The total amount of salary paid per worker for five months was only 2,300 liras, he said, roughly 1,000 euros. The company employs 3,000 people and creates an additional 32,000 jobs in support sectors, according to a local business leader. The unionist demanded Çukurova, the parent company, create finances for the BMC. Çukurova is controlled by Mehmet Emin Karamehmet, who is also the local shareholder in Turkcell, the country’s largest mobile operator.

September/28/2012

source: LABOR - Halt in Kirpi line hinders terror fight, irks workers

I think it's problematic that Karamehmet has this kind of financial problems... He's famous for being a mafia type of guy. But that a company he's owner of delivering gods to the defense sector should be problem free, I think it's time Karamehmet was given a choice, either prioritize defense or sell it to one of the Turkish defense companies (or make it an independant company free of Karamehmet.)
 
the kirpi's are still being produced but slowed down . Karamehmet billionaire giving 400 million a year to Turkish super league viewing licence instead should focus on these because BMC is a big and good company making armored vehicles.
 
Kirpi, kaldığı yerden devam
kirpi.jpg


‘Yürüyen kale’ olarak bilinen ‘Kirpi’ ile ilgili kriz, BMC’nin aradığı krediyi bularak yeniden üretime başlamasıyla aşıldı. Güvenlik güçlerinin mayın tuzağından korunması amacıyla 2009’da 468 zırhlı araç için anlaşma imzalanmış, ancak firmanın yaşadığı maddî sıkıntı yüzünden araçların 278’i teslim edildikten sonra üretimi durmuştu. Kalan 190 Kirpi’nin 3-4 ay içinde tamamlanacağı belirtiliyor.

BMC, sonunda aradığı krediyi buldu, terörle mücadelenin kritik unsurlarından Kirpilerin üretimi yeniden başladı. Firma, maddî darboğaz sebebiyle, Türk Silahlı Kuvvetleri’ne (TSK) teslim etmesi gereken, mayına dayanıklı bu araçların üretimini durdurmuştu. Özel bir bankayla yapılan yaklaşık 150 milyon dolarlık kredi anlaşmasından sonra BMC, üretimi yeniden başlattı.

Savunma Sanayii Müsteşarlığı (SSM) tarafından açılan, mayına dayanıklı zırhlı araç ihalesi sonucunda, BMC ile 2009’un Mart ayında sözleşme imzalanmıştı. Araçların, Aralık 2011’e kadar teslim edilmesi gerekiyordu. Firma üretimi gerçekleştiremeyince süre 2012’nin Mayıs ayına kadar uzatılmış ve bu tarihe kadar 278 adet Kirpi, TSK envanterine girmişti. Zaman’a bilgi veren Savunma bürokratları, “Kalan 190 adet Kirpi’nin teslimatı önümüzdeki 3-4 ay içinde tamamlanacak.” dedi. Öte yandan gecikmeden dolayı SSM tarafından firmaya 7 milyon Euro ceza kesildi.

Kirpiler 13 personel taşıyabiliyor, her türlü arazi şartlarında rahatlıkla hareket edebiliyor. Mayın, el yapımı patlayıcı, balistik testlerinden geçen ve ‘yürüyen kale’ olarak bilinen Kirpiler, saatte 105 km hıza ulaşabiliyor, 120 cm derinlikteki sudan geçebiliyor.

NATO standartlarına göre üretilen Kirpilerde, aynı zamanda motor altının da koruması sağlanıyor. Böylece herhangi bir mayın tehdidine maruz kalan aracın kısa sürede onarılarak görevine devam etmesi mümkün oluyor. Koltuklar ise mayın patlaması anında basıncı emecek özel bir sistemle üretiliyor. Söz konusu zırhlı, şu anda Güneydoğu’da terörle mücadelenin yoğun olarak sürdüğü yerlerde kullanılıyor. Özellikle terörle mücadelede iç güvenlik harekât bölgesinde görev yapan Kirpiler, Mehmetçiğin elini kuvvetlendiriyor. PKK’nın sahip olduğu mayınlara karşı dayanıklı olan bu araçlar, askerin bir noktadan diğerine güvenli sevkiyat yapmasına da imkân veriyor. Ayrıca, teröristler tarafından yapılan taciz atışlarında da askerin, güvenli olduğu için Kirpi’den inmediği ve teröristlere aracın içinden karşılık verdiği kaydediliyor. Askerî yetkililer, “Teröristler Kirpilere diğer zırhlı araçlara saldırdıkları gibi kolay saldıramıyor. Kendi aralarındaki telsiz konuşmalarında, ‘bu araçları gördüğünüzde mühimmat harcamayın’ diyorlar.” ifadelerini kullanıyor. Öte yandan Kirpi’nin ilk üretilen zırhının, yapılan testlerin ardından terörle mücadeleye uygun olarak güçlendirildiği kaydediliyor.

Emniyet Genel Müdürlüğü de uzun süredir bu araçlardan istiyor. Özellikle geçtiğimiz eylül ayında terör örgütü PKK’nın, Bingöl’ün Karlıova ilçesinde asayiş görevinden dönen polise kurduğu bomba tuzağında 8 polisin şehit olmasının ardından, Emniyet’in zırhlı araç ihtiyacı iyice gün yüzüne çıkmış oldu. Emniyet Teşkilatı’nın kullandığı shortland ve panzer gibi araçların zırhları çok hafif. Terörle mücadelede kullanılmaya elverişli değil. Daha güçlü zırhı olan kobralar ise personel sevkiyatında zaten kullanılmıyor. Savunma kaynakları, aynı araçlardan Emniyet’e de alınacağını kaydediyor. Ayrıca Silahlı Kuvvetler’deki ağır zırhlı personel taşıyıcıların sayısının da artırılması gerektiği ifade ediliyor.

That is a good news, hopefully our police department will also get Kirpis.

Source: Zaman
 
Well, don't get me wrong but kirpi is clearly an overkill for General Directorate of Security(EGM)

Even rich countries like US or UK don't have such advanced vehicles under their police departments.

You can google and see how cheap and simple SWAT trucks are :) basically civillian trucks with some add-on armor to provide ballistic protection. No police force in the world has MRAPs at their disposal. Simply because mine protection is unnecessary in urban areas.

Fettullah's influence in EGM is a known secret, of course Zaman will write such things, they simply want police to "compete" with the army :D well, they can forget it... this ain't no Iran :)

EGM can buy few more light helicopters, possibly some MD500s with the money that'll be wasted on mine-protected vehicles.
 
@LegionnairE

I disagree, why?

First of all, you got it wrong. EGM wants those Kirpis for the Spatial Police Forces we know as Ozel Harekat Polisi, not for regular polices in urban area. Second of all, as you know Spatial Police Forces actively fight with terrorists in the east and eastern Anatolia.Therefore, they were/are being attacked by terrorist PKK and they need such vehicles to protect themselves. You are right, police departments do not have such vehicles in their inventory neither in US nor in UK. BUT, their police forces do not fight with terrorist. Besides, you know very well the terrain in east/eastern Anatolia, right? That is why spatial police forces definitely need these vehicles, there is no doubt.

Last of all, this mentality "they simply want police to "compete" with the army" is TOTALLY WRONG. Polices and Soldiers are our polices and our soldiers. They serve our country, however, some mighty generals did not want EGM to have heavy weapons (during the Feb 28th, spatial police forces were fighting with PKK and had heavy weapons in the inventory)that is why they dismissed the spatial police forces and passivate them and then got their all heavy weapons. The reason was, because, they did not want any obstacle when they plot a coup. They got all heavy weapons but what happened then. More death, more martyr. We paid a lot for this kind of mentality and we cannot allow same thing happen again.
 
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^nuff with the BS, either post here the latest mine-attack against EGM personnel or shut up.

Police vehicles get ambushed and attacked by assault rifles and other light-arms fire. What they need is ballistic protection and you can install add-on homogen steel armor and ballistic glass to a thousand police cruisers at the price of a few kirpis. Still my choice would be to buy more light helicopters.

Don't be naive, Police and Jandarma has a clear division of labor, it's jandarma's job to provide security in rural areas and police' job to secure urban areas each has to adapt their own working areas. Trying to make one compete with other can only end-up damaging this country.

Right now police fighting KCK and the army fighting PKK there are different threats each need different solutions.
 
Well, don't get me wrong but kirpi is clearly an overkill for General Directorate of Security(EGM)

Even rich countries like US or UK don't have such advanced vehicles under their police departments.

You can google and see how cheap and simple SWAT trucks are :) basically civillian trucks with some add-on armor to provide ballistic protection. No police force in the world has MRAPs at their disposal. Simply because mine protection is unnecessary in urban areas.

Fettullah's influence in EGM is a known secret, of course Zaman will write such things, they simply want police to "compete" with the army :D well, they can forget it... this ain't no Iran :)

EGM can buy few more light helicopters, possibly some MD500s with the money that'll be wasted on mine-protected vehicles.


Send swat team with ther armored vehicle to Hakkari and Semdinli. Let them blow it wit IED. You talking bs sorry. Polis Ozel Harakat need and other police forces too. This vehicle wil be used in east of Turkey and not in Istanbul and Ankara.

Ther wil be 20 fot the police force.
 
Send swat team with ther armored vehicle to Hakkari and Semdinli. Let them blow it wit IED. You talking bs sorry. Polis Ozel Harakat need and other police forces too. This vehicle wil be used in east of Turkey and not in Istanbul and Ankara.

Ther wil be 20 fot the police force.
I asked a simple question to @The Commander when did last time any police vehicle got ambushed by land mines or IEDs?

If you can find any piece of news from last two decades I'll admit I was wrong. If you can't, go fvck yourself and stop wasting my time
 
Fok your self amq...

Polise may

Stupid idiot! And you live in Turkey? Go fuc k you self easy...
 
Fok your self amq...

Polise may

Stupid idiot! And you live in Turkey? Go fuc k you self easy...
Stupid idiot it's a bus, a "servis aracı" the bomb didn't explode under the vehicle but near it. Deaths occured by sharpnel pieces that could be stopped by a STANAG II ballistic armor. You don't need kirpi to avoid these, a shortland is enough. Meanwhile Kirpis are subjected to much heavier blasts that opened holes in roads. Blasts that could throw a six-ton cobra few meters high. It's not the case with Polis, not for a long time

Bingöl-Erzurum highway is hardly Hakkari or Şemdinli this could have happened anywhere, In fact, military convoys got attacked in İzmir more times than i can remember. Are we to replace all busses with MRAPs?
1344592784.jpg
 
Servic Araci are sitting ducks in thet east of Turkey. The chance be hit in west of Turkey and east is different. And this bus is hit by landmine. And flow meters away! So they need it to.
 
Servic Araci are sitting ducks in thet east of Turkey. The chance be hit in west of Turkey and east is different. And this bus is hit by landmine. And flow meters away! So they need it to.

I dont want to pick sides bro but the Army themself cant afford much MRAPs so how do you expect that the police replace there entire inventory of transport busses and vehicles? The Turkish Army convoys still mainly consist of Land Rover Defenders which are just horrible against Mines or IEDs but to replace more then 9000 of these vehichles is close to impossible. Turkey is still developing and still cant just give money away like that...
 
Servic Araci are sitting ducks in thet east of Turkey. The chance be hit in west of Turkey and east is different. And this bus is hit by landmine. And flow meters away! So they need it to.
Ok, I'll explain the sh*t out of you.. just not tonight

http://youtu.be/BbTGqHyP4m0

This is a video showing how easy it is to outfit civillian vehicles with ballistic protection. Private frims in Turkey are doing this for VIP passengers. Just some homogen steel blocks to the doors, ballistic glasses and ta-daa you have some decent protection by spending just a few thousand bucks.

Same can be done for police cruisers.
Great minds think alike... these are newly procured shortlands with some new capabilities

Even the EGM knows that kirpi is an overkill for for themselves.
http://www.cnnturk.com/fotogaleri/g...ofa.karsi.yeni.zirhli.arac/15294.1/index.html
 

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