HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions-[Thread 2]

[mig25]

As far as your Cockpit delusion is concerned here
Is your Raptor Su-30mki where pilot sits deep inside cockpit

The pics you posted were all taken from under the aircraft and hence does not corroborate your theory.

Check the pics below:

 

[Nomad40]

The pics you posted were all taken from under the aircraft and hence does not corroborate your theory.

Check the pics below:

Thanks for providing these images, Have you any knowledge about the RCS of Su-30 and CAP/AA configuration.

 

[mig25]

Thanks for providing these images, Have you any knowledge about the RCS of Su-30 and CAP/AA configuration.

I do not. Maybe somebody more knowledgeable on the MKIs may answer you queries.

 

[Nomad40]

I do not. Maybe somebody more knowledgeable on the MKIs may answer you queries.

Do you know how many squadrons of su-30MKI IAF has on the western theater?

 

[JohnWick]

The pics you posted were all taken from under the aircraft and hence does not corroborate your theory.

Check the pics below:

These pics also proved thanks fpr sharing in the last one the pilot sits deep in the cockpit when canopy is closed.

 

[The Maverick]

Your comparing cockpits of light fighter with heavy fighter .what

.about we designed developed and manfsctured a world class jf17 and inducted it in numbers.

Chengdu of China designed it you people told them what you needed.
You assemble and overhaul it now.
Block3 is being tested in chengdu why because you have no facilities . No shame in that you are small aero power limited resources
World class ....errr ok if you say so.
But China won't be inducting
It's budget plane for cash strapped. Air forces in Africa hence my sarcasm about world class.
we know where you stand in aero space engineering and it on a global level
You do what you can within your small financial ability the rest you turn.to China
And only China.
Working with Europeans is too costly and China is your only option for now

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Your comparing cockpits of light fighter with heavy fighter .what

.about we designed developed and manfsctured a world class jf17 and inducted it in numbers.

Chengdu of China designed it you people told them what you needed.
You assemble and overhaul it now.
Block3 is being tested in chengdu why because you have no facilities . No shame in that you are small aero power limited resources
World class ....errr ok if you say so.
But China won't be inducting
It's budget plane for cash strapped. Air forces in Africa hence my sarcasm about world class.
we know where you stand in aero space engineering and it on a global level
You do what you can within your small financial ability the rest you turn.to China
And only China.
Working with Europeans is too costly and China is your only option for now

You don't have any idea about cockpit, isn't?

 

[Fighting Falcon 01]

Your comparing cockpits of light fighter with heavy fighter .what

.about we designed developed and manfsctured a world class jf17 and inducted it in numbers.

Chengdu of China designed it you people told them what you needed.
You assemble and overhaul it now.
Block3 is being tested in chengdu why because you have no facilities . No shame in that you are small aero power limited resources
World class ....errr ok if you say so.
But China won't be inducting
It's budget plane for cash strapped. Air forces in Africa hence my sarcasm about world class.
we know where you stand in aero space engineering and it on a global level
You do what you can within your small financial ability the rest you turn.to China
And only China.
Working with Europeans is too costly and China is your only option for now

We know where you stand in developing fighter aircraft let's take example of INDIGENOUS TEJAS
Engine = American
Design = Mirage copy
Project time = 40 years
Avionics = Israeli
Radar = Israeli
Weapon package = Russian and Indian
So what is india making ??? Where is the so called decades of experience??? In 40 years you show 16 aircraft and say you guys are experts ? Maybe experts at failing

 

[The Maverick]

No we are not experts that is USA France UK Russia

Yes tejas has
USA engine why it's low maintenance better than Russia cheaper than France
Israeli radar it's good and cheaper than France they are they are our strategic alloys
Russian and Israeli weapons yes bes5 to have variety choice

Lca was late but did not fail .
It's paper specs are generation ahead of your block 1 and 2 thunder.
Your block 3 looks on par too our mark1a
Lucky you have China improving it for you
India is doing this on its own in India using our own limited skill set
But hey one step at time

 

[Nomad40]

Your comparing cockpits of light fighter with heavy fighter .what

.about we designed developed and manfsctured a world class jf17 and inducted it in numbers.

Chengdu of China designed it you people told them what you needed.
You assemble and overhaul it now.
Block3 is being tested in chengdu why because you have no facilities . No shame in that you are small aero power limited resources
World class ....errr ok if you say so.
But China won't be inducting
It's budget plane for cash strapped. Air forces in Africa hence my sarcasm about world class.
we know where you stand in aero space engineering and it on a global level
You do what you can within your small financial ability the rest you turn.to China
And only China.
Working with Europeans is too costly and China is your only option for now

Yes we worked with Chinese company for the manufacturing part. I see you hindustanis come up with retarded arguments, A fighter is inducted into in air force when a requirement is there for it and the PLAAF had no contribution in the jf-17. I suggested you some thing about the problem with you people it seems that you have ignored it-------- At least we did not copy a french design put some Israel avionics, Russian weapons and an american engine and neither did we take 30 years to develop a some what combat capable plane and call it our own. oh and dont get me started on the FCS, Flight computer, Software and the stupid draggy design. What is Indian about LCA ?


Frick yeah every weapon system on the jf-17 was developed by us with the help of china man, Frick yeah Every avionics inside the jf-17 is our OWN Frick yeah we developed the Radar with the Chinese, Frick yeah we Upgraded and modified and redesign components of the Russian rd-33 and rd-93 was born.

Frick yeah we sold planes to Nigeria and Myanmar-----Your air force and navy dont even have the confidence in the LCA plane.

Frick yeah jf-17 is cheaper than Western fighters that does the same job for 3 times the price.


1 squadron of LCA in 30 YEARS dont forget always under estimate Pakistan!

here is a small inspiration picture-----so your tiny mind can digest.

No we are not experts that is USA France UK Russia

Yes tejas has
USA engine why it's low maintenance better than Russia cheaper than France
Israeli radar it's good and cheaper than France they are they are our strategic alloys
Russian and Israeli weapons yes bes5 to have variety choice

Lca was late but did not fail .
It's paper specs are generation ahead of your block 1 and 2 thunder.
Your block 3 looks on par too our mark1a
Lucky you have China improving it for you
India is doing this on its own in India using our own limited skill set
But hey one step at time

so now your Dumb Asz saying Tejas despite being 2 decades late and taking 32 years more than the JF-17 to develop you say tha it is a generation Ahead than block 2 jf-17? so you are stating that the Teja is a 5th Generation platform what can the tejas do? you have 1 only 1 squadron of tejas and your air force is stuck with it you know your air force is given the option to go for another a fighter they will do it in half a heart beat.


If a person takes 4 years to graduate uni vs a person takes 20 years to graduate from the same program-----will you call it a success. where was Tejas on 27 ?------- In the production line or parked in some hanger because Pilots and higher command had no authority in the plane.

Limited skill set----do you lack the cognitive ability to process information, India has a much bigger aviation industry than Pakistan. HAL has outsorced all aspect of the project, HAL before Tejas had the experience of Murat, trainers, and su-30mki-----were you not the one that showed me the pictures of Indian Helos and stealth helos.


JF-17 was par of the First strike Package.

Jf-17 was Part of the Air superiority Package and engaged Indian Mirage 2000-----BVR lock M2000 and like cowards IAF ran away.

JF-17 is like our F-16-----your pilots tremble in fear, You know what the IAF Pilots radio in when they see the CAP/ Air interdiction response?

"NO JOY" "BINGO" "BUGOUT" "SICK NORAD" "SICK" "SKIP IT"

 

[The Maverick]

Plaaf have no requirement for thunders because that role is performed by j10 single engined fighter

The flanker both Russian supplied and Chinese copys provide the twin engined roles ie load distance etc

Chengdu did the work
Gave you the labs workshops materials radar testing weapons testing wind tunnels etc
Block three is in China... Why

Hey let us enjoy our moment tejas is late
It's compact it'.has Israeli and USA technology not a bad thing in my mind .
We are proud and even you have to agree it's better than mig21 and mig27.
And it's our own.
I know it's not rafale or f35 or even f16 but it's here drag or no drag and it works it's safe it has
hmd hobs combo
Glass cockpit
Bvr.
Laser guidance
Ew suites and jammers

Enjoy the pictures your thunder looks nicer in the air shots at ground level it looks dated design

Sorry just my opinion

 

[NAVDEEP DHALIWAL]

Actually tejas will need 5-10 yrs to be in good numbers & fully integrated to be used extensively as front line fighter.
If by that time pak also deploys JF 3rd block in good numbers I would consider them equal. (Numbers matters a lot when diff of permance is 10-20%)

Only diff is jf can't go to block 4 cause of old frame design. & so does tejas as well.

That's why I feel iaf did right thing to let go of tejas mk2. There's a limit to the upgradation .

So if pak doesnt start with new frame after 20 years it would be way behind india. Rest time will tell.

 

[The Maverick]

Its a good move that india is moving through the blocks quicker than PAF

THEY now HAVE 120 BLOCK 1 & 2 that lack even basic HMD or HOBS not to mention airframe FCS that is class of 1980S FIGHTERS ie no composite in airframe and full quadruplx FBW system but single digital FBW only.

They can update them to block 3 I think BUT not sure on cost and time frame

 

[The Maverick]

Do you know how many squadrons of su-30MKI IAF has on the western theater?

14 Squadrons in 3 commands = 19 fighters in each

North command facing china 3 air bases 6 sdqs.

South Command = 4 sqds

Western command facing PAK border 4 sqds

There are 270 su30mki in service now

Love it su30mki with LCA in tandem

 

[MirageBlue]

Look at how the cockpit is elevated at such a sharp angle.

the air intakes seems very odd for Delta design dont you think the cockpit is a bit tight?

Of course it is elevated at an angle.

The IAF had very specific requirements about the rear seat pilot having visibility out of the front of the cockpit. In fact, in a Gripen D, the rear seater has almost no frontal visibility at all thanks to the fact that the cockpit is not angled.

The air intakes are perfectly fine and have NOTHING to do with delta wings. I would like you to please explain the physics of what those air intakes have to do with the delta wings. That would probably explain your own understanding better.

so how big is a indian pilot ?

Not much bigger than most Asian pilots, including other South Asians. Anthropometric data for the 90th percentile Indian male was used to design the cockpit, the distances from the knobs, switches, MFDs, rudder pedals, head clearance from canopy, etc.

India's premier Design institute, the National Institute of Design in Ahmedabad was directly involved in the ergonomics of the Tejas cockpit as well as the design of jigs, sims, etc.. Those who are from India know how prestigious the NID is and how good they are.

article link

We know where you stand in developing fighter aircraft let's take example of INDIGENOUS TEJAS
Engine = American
Design = Mirage copy
Project time = 40 years
Avionics = Israeli
Radar = Israeli
Weapon package = Russian and Indian
So what is india making ??? Where is the so called decades of experience??? In 40 years you show 16 aircraft and say you guys are experts ? Maybe experts at failing

Design is not a Mirage copy. Dassault was a consultant for HAL in the early 1990s and yes they helped in the selection of the configuration. No big deal. The work was done by the 300 plus HAL engineers posted at Dassault for this. If you think that a mid-set compound delta wing is the same as a low set delta wing, then that's your problem really.

Neither the airframe nor the wings are anything similar to the Mirage. I could say that the JF-17's wing is a direct copy of the F-16 and the airframe is derived from the Super-7 which itself was derived from the MiG-21. Tell me whether that's right or wrong.

Project work began in 1993 with official sanction and funds granted. Before that it was simply about establishing ADA and the facilities required.

Weapons we'll integrate whatever we want that is available whether from Russia, Israel, Europe or our own. Crucially we can integrate on our own, without need to get some other OEM to do it at high cost and with the possibility of being denied permission. Going forward, most weapons will be indigenous designs. We own the source codes for the radar, the software onboard so integration is a lot easier than it was for ANY other design in the IAF.

We own the wind tunnels where all wind tunnel testing is done. We own the anechoic chambers where RCS and electromagnetic spectrum testing is done. We own the Lightning test facility where lightning testing is done.

Most avionics are Indian, except for new software defined radios and HMDS, Litening LDP and a few LRUs. Radar is Israeli back end with MMR antenna which is indigenous. And we'll get the indigenous Uttam AESA radar in the second block of the Tejas Mk1A. MFDs are by Samtel, which is India, HUD is from CSIO which is Indian, the RWR is Indian. The crucial computers on board are all Indian, with all software being written by Indians. The FCS is 100% Indian. Actuators are from Moog in USA, but now new indigenous actuators are also being tested. Mk1A may well have those.

The composites are indigenous, the jigs, tools and assembly are indigenous. The ground support equipment, the simulators, the testing and training equipment and software are indigenous.

The Brake Management System, Fuel Management System, Fire Suppression System, the software that ties all of these together with the Mission Computer and various other computers is indigenous. EW system may get SPJ from Israel, which is fine, it works great.

The problem is most people like you don't know much about the hundreds of systems that are required for a 4th gen fighter, but think that just looking at it externally you can tell what goes on inside and behind the scenes.

The day you Pakistanis actually do something yourself rather than taking whatever China gives and calling it yours, you'll know the ACTUAL amount of effort that goes into designing and building a genuine 4th gen fighter.

Compared to all this, JF-17 is 99% Chinese. 1% is Turkish, thanks to Aselsan LDP. What is Pakistani design in it? Zero.

Come back and criticize when the Project Azm fighter is ready and inducted into service with this much level of Pakistani content. Or even when you can design and develop a JF-17 Block 4 on your own with minimal Chinese involvement.

These pics also proved thanks fpr sharing in the last one the pilot sits deep in the cockpit when canopy is closed.

No he doesn't. In fact he sits even higher than the front seater and with frontal visibility only matched by the Su-30MKI.

Here is a video of the current USAF Chief of Staff Gen Goldfein, flying in the rear seat of a Tejas twin seater.

USAF Chief of Staff flies in Tejas trainer

and here is a video of the French Air Force Chief Genearl Lenata, flying in the rear seat of a Tejas twin seater.

French AF Chief flies in Tejas trainer

IAF ACM Arup Raha, flying in the rear seat of a Tejas twin seater.

IAF Chief of Staff flies in Tejas trainer

All 3 videos show the excellent visibility in both front and rear seats of a Tejas trainer.

Do you know how many squadrons of su-30MKI IAF has on the western theater?

What has that got to do with anything being discussed here? IAF has Su-30 squadrons on both Western and Eastern front as well as a new Su-30 squadron, No.222 'Tigersharks' based out of Southern Air Command, tasked with carrying Brahmos-A ALCMs.

All the modren fighter i.e F-22 F-35 J-31 Su-57
And Su-35 are not in the form of delta....And also all the battle proven fighters F-16 F-15 F-14 F-4 F-5 and even mig series are also not delta....don't disperse misinformation here on pdf.


After 40 years the best has yet to come.
While in world outside India after 15 years the fighter programmes are completed.in PAC we also has started to overhauling jft.


In fact is an just a little modified m2k old design with an ugly tumour like refuelling probe right on the face.


As far as your Cockpit delusion is concerned here
Is your Raptor Su-30mki where pilot sits deep inside cockpit.
View attachment 637104 View attachment 637105


You have a brain disease .....You can't understand the simple english I was only saying that HAL can't integrate that type of
good looking refuelling systems in Tejas....and put a non retractable refueling ugly looking probe right infront of tejas's face.

This is the same guy who couldn't tell the difference between drogue/probe refueling and boom refueling. LOL.

He wants a "Good looking refueling system"! LOL. And then he claims others are stupid and have brain disease.

Arguing with a person with this limited knowledge is a waste of time. It's like teaching calculus to guy whose mathematics level is limited to counting on his fingers. Sab kuch iske uppar se nikal jaayega.

Go on, live in your own fantasy land. Your opinion doesn't make one bit of a difference in the real world.