Hafiz saeed to challenge US bounty in international court

[darkinsky]

Useless talks if India has guts and balls, Do a operation to kill this scumbag. Else India should stfu!

and you know india doesnt have the balls and guts and the brains, so stfu, calling some innocent guy a terrorist without proof is like saying india is a shupar powar, calling someone wthout ground realities doesnt change it

 

[Solomon2]

---> No damning evidence, no smoking gun. NADA.

I see no contradiction. Not all evidence collected is usable or sufficient to convict in a court of law. That doesn't mean one can't solicit and issue rewards for such evidence, or that there could be enough evidence to charge and imprison someone.

After all, if prosecutors waited until they had iron-clad proof of criminality then U.S. courts would only issue convictions.

bounty is meaningless -- it's a snub on Pakistan

Not meaningless, but surely it is a snub on Pakistan - a well-deserved one.

So what's left is the Big Question: is the purpose of Pakistan to shield international terrorists? Yes or no?

 

[darkinsky]

I see no contradiction. Not all evidence collected is usable or sufficient to convict in a court of law. That doesn't mean one can't solicit and issue rewards for such evidence, or that there could be enough evidence to charge and imprison someone.

are you on drugs?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

I see no contradiction. Not all evidence collected is usable or sufficient to convict in a court of law. That doesn't mean one can't solicit and issue rewards for such evidence, or that there could be enough evidence to charge and imprison someone.

it's an ABSOLUTE contradiction, are you kidding me?

I simply can not fathom or come to terms with how Mark Toner @ the State is actually affirming Pakistan's position on this ''contentious'' issue

After all, if prosecutors waited until they had iron-clad proof of criminality then U.S. courts would only issue convictions.

so what you're saying is the US judicial system is flawed and that there are criminals and felons roaming about who ought to have received a conviction?

Not meaningless, but surely it is a snub on Pakistan - a well-deserved one.

you're not really in the best position of leverage to be engaging in snub business....especially as C-in-C Prez Obummer is talking about withdrawing his troops from Afghanistan by or around 2014 (I think Leon Panetta expressed his hope that this date will be expedited)

So what's left is the Big Question: is the purpose of Pakistan to shield international terrorists? Yes or no?

Choice B.

Is the purpose of the USA to be the police-man of the world?

 

[Solomon2]

it's an ABSOLUTE contradiction, are you kidding me?

No.

I simply can not fathom or come to terms with how Mark Toner @ the State is actually affirming Pakistan's position on this ''contentious'' issue

Is the distinction too subtle for you to grasp?

so what you're saying is the US judicial system is flawed -

In the U.S. what matters is whether or not the defendant receives a fair trial. To see if a case has merit a grand jury is used first - that eliminates spurious criminal cases. As the direct descendant of a system of colonial rule more interested in subjecting the populace to order than justice, Pakistan lacks this system of checks and balances.

Is the purpose of the USA to be the police-man of the world?

Any country can choose to enforce the warrant for Hafiz Saeed's arrest.

 

[PakEagle]

Americans are in a habit of painting things in a very distorted way something that suits their covert agenda...but yet we have to admit that they have good presentation and can beautifully disguise the pain and suffering that country has inflicted on mankind under their immense love for world peace and prosperity..

Does that make anybody laugh?

Dollar is the foundation stone of today's world and still that country acts like the most threatened one on the planet coz american federal reserves is manged privately and is not under their goverment.they are excelling at reading people's mind and the home of all major scientific inventions lately.US military is present in over a dozen countries and their military is always accompained by handful of callous diplomats and undercover agents to pursue the aims of those who are infact behind this surface of MANKIND loving America,the real rulers and policy makers.And their love for humans was unfortunately lost when they facilitated satan by establishing church of Satan decades back and Americans on a whole have been brainwashed thru media and events like 9/11 to believe that they are the oppressed one's in reality the very same people are supporting the most oppressive govt and military.

If any court had issued any notice in 2008 why it took Americans 4 years to decide a bounty and even that's on a person which is not hiding in caves.

These time windows and lapses when nothing seems working on the surface a lot is being done undertable which if exposed can reveal some facts common man of not only America but the whole globe should knowhttp://www.infowars.com/bg1.html..

The point is we need to identify the threats and take control of things in our own hands especially the things which are important to our life line namely a palestinians independent country on 1948 borders and a solution of Kashmir .we have no issues after that with anybody as far as this alciada is concerned it will die naturally when it's supporters in states and their frontmen Arabs will back off.

But again how can one ask a cannibal to spare his prey and the hunger of satanists is ever growing and it functions on the principal of spilling innocents blood.Something we have seen in recent decades.

Why west left Libya and Iraq to chaos when their covert missions were achieved.Why their love evaporated once qaddafi was down.

There are thousands of unanswered questions and it's now survival that's on stake and it's our turn to take responsibility of our home and acts for its safety and prosperity.

 

[Jango]

There has been an Interpol warrant on him since 2008. Since then there has been court testimony as to his role, and additional info discovered from the Abbottabad raid last year.

Not at all.

.

You can consult the link in post 795 by Abu Zulfiqar.

The Spokesman said that the bounty is for person who presents credible evidence against Hafiz Saeed that can then be produced in court to try him, meaning that the US does not have anything on him at the moment.

And on what charges could he be arrested, for doing rallies???

 

[Solomon2]

The Spokesman said that the bounty is for person who presents credible evidence against Hafiz Saeed that can then be produced in court to try him, meaning that the US does not have anything on him at the moment.

No, that's not what it means. It means it is felt there is insufficient evidence to proceed with prosecuting Saeed now for everything the U.S. government wants to try him for. The purpose of the bounty is to solicit such evidence.

Clearly the Pakistani military won't provide - Saeed dines with Pakistani generals and yesterday that relationship was reaffirmed when Saeed issued his statements from Rawalpindi. I suppose we can definitely say that the current purpose of the Pakistani state is to defend international terrorists; it's not like the Pakistanis here have argued vigorously against it.

It's up to individual Pakistani citizens now, I suppose. So, are Pakistanis going to come forward and provide information, or not? Or would doing so be considered treason?

 

[PakEagle]

No, that's not what it means. It means it is felt there is insufficient evidence to proceed with prosecuting Saeed now for everything the U.S. government wants to try him for. The purpose of the bounty is to solicit such evidence.

Clearly the Pakistani military won't provide - Saeed dines with Pakistani generals and yesterday that relationship was reaffirmed when Saeed issued his statements from Rawalpindi. I suppose we can definitely say that the current purpose of the Pakistani state is to defend international terrorists; it's not like the Pakistanis here have argued vigorously against it.

I wonder how some people acts like clowns and still feel they are talking sense at one hand you are admitting there isnt evidence to prosecute him and on the other hand you are calling him a terrorist something even you cant prove in 4 years but still adamant just because you want to found one in him..

how can someone be called terrorist unless his crime is proved in a court of law..

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

No.

No? then what?

Is the distinction too subtle for you to grasp?

As per Mark Toner, ''we're looking for information that can be usable to convict him in a court of law"


and my favourite part:

''we wanted to be able to provide Pakistan with the tools that they need to prosecute this individual"


what tools is he referring to? Do they come in the form of crispy green Benjamins?


(and does zardari get 10% commission?)

In the U.S. what matters is whether or not the defendant receives a fair trial. To see if a case has merit a grand jury is used first - that eliminates spurious criminal cases. As the direct descendant of a system of colonial rule more interested in subjecting the populace to order than justice, Pakistan lacks this system of checks and balances.

uh huh, im familiar with what a ''grand jury'' is but thanks for sharing...I still remember I was a youngster in Peshawar when I saw that OJ Simpson trial from start to finish.

as for the last part of this comment, i actually agree with you....but our judiciary is quite strong and in fact one of the strongest and least corruptible pillars of our state.

Any country can choose to enforce the warrant for Hafiz Saeed's arrest.

Solomon - he's in Lahore today and moving freely out in the open. What good is this ''warrant''

 

[Solomon2]

I wonder how some people acts like clowns and still feel they are talking sense at one hand you are admitting there isnt evidence to prosecute him -

Not necessarily. There can be sufficient evidence that Saeed committed crimes that he can be prosecuted for, but that isn't what the U.S. government wants to prosecute him for. Or current evidence may be from sources the U.S. doesn't want to reveal. It may be a bit nutty but it does make sense.

and on the other hand you are calling him a terrorist something even you cant prove in 4 years

The U.S. government can call a terrorist without proof because, at the very least, that's what his Interpol "red card" says he is.

how can someone be called terrorist unless his crime is proved in a court of law..

You mean one can't be a terrorist unless one is convicted of terrorism first? That you could blow up a mosque or hotel citing political reasons for doing so and not be considered a terrorist until you are convicted?

PakEagle, I think you - and many of your countrymen - are confused because there are differences between what things are, what they are called, and what they are proved to be in a court of law. The hot-heads among you mix it together to keep you confused. Why give yourself up to this madness?

 

[PakEagle]

Not necessarily. There can be sufficient evidence that Saeed committed crimes that he can be prosecuted for, but that isn't what the U.S. government wants to prosecute him for. Or current evidence may be from sources the U.S. doesn't want to reveal. It may be a bit nutty but it does make sense.

The U.S. government can call a terrorist without proof because, at the very least, that's what his Interpol "red card" says he is.

You mean one can't be a terrorist unless one is convicted of terrorism first? That you could blow up a mosque or hotel citing political reasons for doing so and not be considered a terrorist until you are convicted?

This is what law is all about..Allegations needs to be substanially proved with evidence and You AMERICANS want world believe everything you say despite the fact that you guys are still searching for WMD in iraq and havnt found them yet.

PakEagle, I think you - and many of your countrymen - are confused because there are differences between what things are, what they are called, and what they are proved to be in a court of law. The hot-heads among you mix it together to keep you confused. Why give yourself up to this madness?

I agree with this part as far as you apply it on yourself as well but again I have to praise your teachers who taught you how to mix little truth in reality to present it to masses as ultimate truth and at the same time making them belive that small lie as well.

Americans should realize by now that world knows exactly how their cycle from"FROM BEING OPPRESSED TO ULTIMATE OPPRESSOR WORKS" its no more a mystery .

Pakistan is going through all this because musharraf to make his illegal stay legitimate sided america against afghans he should have told americans to use either iran or central asian states as their ally..

Pakistan never knew suicide bombings its an american gift and then what will you say about american ammuintion and dollars always present in abundance with these so called alciada activists who is helping them out in disguise.To keep themselves sustained and active these elements have spent billions of dollars in past decade where from this money came ..Pakistan doesnt have such resources who else then..Any sane man would name a few only and those are americans,jews and indians and as a whole satanists which indeed has no religion or yes american saudi frontmen ..People still wonder as all the highjackers and Osama were saudi nationals why americans never dragged them in this mess...

Solomon you and other guys of your cult has been exposed now and Time is changing faster than your ancestors had anticipated.Forces of light will always be superior to the forces of darkness and its upto you whom you wanna side but some people's hearts are being locked and they cant see any light all their life and to me you seem one of them..

May Almighty the creator of us all shows you the right path and let you see behind curtains and let you be able to read between lines..But to me you seem like a lost cause ...ALL LOST who works like a robot and whose output is proportional to his feed which unfortuantely is derived from hatred for muslims and the dream of absolute power in this mortal world..

 

[Hello_10]

I see no contradiction. Not all evidence collected is usable or sufficient to convict in a court of law. That doesn't mean one can't solicit and issue rewards for such evidence, or that there could be enough evidence to charge and imprison someone.

After all, if prosecutors waited until they had iron-clad proof of criminality then U.S. courts would only issue convictions.

Not meaningless, but surely it is a snub on Pakistan - a well-deserved one.

So what's left is the Big Question: is the purpose of Pakistan to shield international terrorists? Yes or no?

First I would clear that I don’t like Mr Hafiz Saeed as he openly ask for Jihad against India. And we know CIA controlled 26/11 2008, by using Mr Saeed or someone else, it doesn’t make much difference for the people like me who have clear understanding that its CIA and US’s senior politicians who were behind that. But, this bounty has a sense that “if someone can prove Mr Saeed is a terrorist, he may get $10mil.” This simply means government agencies of US and Pakistan can’t do the same by themselves and they challenge the whole world that if someone can prove him a terrorist, he may earn $10mil. Its simply mean that US’s establishments accept that no one in world can prove that Mr Hafiz Saeed is wrong, the man who would be punished for any reason.

And as we see that spoke person of US’s state openly say that Mr Hafiz Saeed is a terrorist and LET is a terrorist organization, and if we mix these two things, then it simply means that the poor education level of US’s foreign ministry is now a shame for the whole world. So poor educational background on legal/ political issue also clearly state that US’s officials would simply declare US a failed state. Neither they have competent science students / engineering professionals to run their industries, nor they are capable enough to run their foreign ministry also. They simply don’t have enough qualified people who may govern the US.

 

[Jango]

No, that's not what it means. It means it is felt there is insufficient evidence to proceed with prosecuting Saeed now for everything the U.S. government wants to try him for. The purpose of the bounty is to solicit such evidence.

Clearly the Pakistani military won't provide - Saeed dines with Pakistani generals and yesterday that relationship was reaffirmed when Saeed issued his statements from Rawalpindi. I suppose we can definitely say that the current purpose of the Pakistani state is to defend international terrorists; it's not like the Pakistanis here have argued vigorously against it.

It's up to individual Pakistani citizens now, I suppose. So, are Pakistanis going to come forward and provide information, or not? Or would doing so be considered treason?

Is there any proof that he is a terrorist?

What has he done to warrant an arrest in pakistan, and/or action by pak Mil against him, and forbid him from holding press conferences?

Why don't you first put a bounty on Knoy and millions others, then talk about this guy.

 

[Solomon2]

Is there any proof that he is a terrorist?

Enough for the Interpol warrant in 2008 at the very least. Is there a problem with soliciting additional proof?

What has he done to warrant an arrest in pakistan -

Under the post-9/11 UNSC Resolutions (especially 1373, binding under Chapter VII of the Charter) Pakistan is obliged to eliminate terrorists and terror-training camps from its territory and to deny terrorists safe harbor - except Pakistan hasn't complied because it hasn't changed its laws to suit, nor do courts like the LHC recognize Pakistan's sovereign international obligations.

- and/or action by pak Mil against him, and forbid him from holding press conferences?

Why don't you ask why the Pakistani military goes out of its way to show Saeed favors?