German terror raids

[blain2]

I never mentioned democracy anywhere. And yeah speaking about democray, its not something we got about bragging but somethign which is said about us by others. Go chec your facts, and yeah whats you problem if we say so. Is it bco you tried and failed miserably everytime and has 2 democratically elected PM's forced into exile, and one of them NZ ran with his life after outside power ( Saudi, Hariri) brokered a deal.

Others say it because you guys brag and harp upon it ever more louder nowadays....India has been a democracy for the past 60+ years....how come others never said anything about the Indian democracy in the 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s? I would venture it was because most of the India did not have a penny to spend on the products that the west wanted to sell and make money on....when that changed, so did the importance of Indian democracy

In any case, your democracy is no problem, be happy about it...its not a bad thing...us not succeeding in implementing democracy is not a bad thing afterall...the belief that Democracy is a panacea for all evils is only limited to the retarded minds like Dubbya's. Pakistan is experimenting with various versions of governance and sooner or later we will succeed at one.

Afterall I am not sure what you are going off on (I guess you are trying to make us Pakistanis feel ashamed of something...) We really do not feel ashamed of such things. It does not surprise us when people talk about the effects of the blowback of the Afghan war. We did what we had to and there is nothing to be ashamed of. I know you are having a hard time understanding and believing it but criticism of Pakistan will carry on for as long as Pakistan is not castrated by the regional and extra regional powers. So why should we bother with this bs motivated propaganda? We are doing what we need to and we are making sacrifices, if others have a problem, they can shove it in my honest opinion.

 

[Bull]

Yeah we will see....its not like stupid policies have not held India back for the past 60 years...not sure where you get the arrogance to assume that India can never go the way of the others? At least we have something to look back to and say that it was not good for us....you guys are just entering the turbulent waters of dealing with the US (thus far the headlong embrace shows nothing but hurry which is making the geo-political waters ever so more choppy in Asia..making China a direct adversary by joining the US coalition is not very smart...US is many thousands of miles away from the Chinese, you guys live next to them and us)...so lets not be too arrogant my Indian friend. You may think that you are very smart and you and your government has thought it through all the way, but there are way too many variables that make your claims of "never" sound unrealistic.

We have a working parliament (i wont call it a democacy as it might irk u), just have a look at what the nuke deal has done. Every body is discussing it and now we have the kala coming out and expressing his opinion.

We have not joined any coalition, having a jt excercise doesnt mean anything more than just that. We even have excercises with China.

US is many thousands of miles away from the Chinese, you guys live next to them and us)....

What would you say about China supplying arms to Pakistan?

 

[blain2]

What would you say about China supplying arms to Pakistan?

China supplying arms to Pakistan is a drop in the ocean compared to what you guys have been getting from Russia and USSR in the past at "Friendship rates".

My own thoughts are that you guys chummying up with the US has a bigger implication for your relations with China than it does dealing with Pakistan. For Pakistan in many ways this is a welcome thing because we carry on with our bi-lateral defence and economic relations with US all the while China thinks of countering India further (feeling encircled) by helping out Pakistan even more. Its you guys in the end who would have to put more money on security issues to deal with China because US wants to use India as a counter. Recent articles around Ex. Malabar and even after the nuclear deal have started discussing the new geo-political alignment and token Indo-Chinese exercises do not address the new geo-political realities.

 

[Bull]

China supplying arms to Pakistan is a drop in the ocean compared to what you guys have been getting from Russia and USSR in the past at "Friendship rates". .

Well you need to look at the security scenario of both the countries and the affordabiltiy.

My own thoughts are that you guys chummying up with the US has a bigger implication for your relations with China than it does dealing with Pakistan. For Pakistan in many ways this is a welcome thing because we carry on with our bi-lateral defence and economic relations with US all the while China thinks of countering India further (feeling encircled) by helping out Pakistan even more..

I dont agree. The day we start spending to counter China is the day you shud dread, as thats when the conventional forces imbalance would get worser than what it is now. It would be impossible for Pakistan to play catch up.

because US wants to use India as a counter.

Thats right, US wants to, will India play game. No, why? Look the set up.

Its you guys in the end who would have to put more money on security issues to deal with China because US wants to use India as a counter. Recent articles around Ex. Malabar and even after the nuclear deal have started discussing the new geo-political alignment and token Indo-Chinese exercises do not address the new geo-political realities.

Well what you are saying is that its ok for Pakistan to be a counter for China against India, but then the same isnt right if India does it. The irony is that you are right.

And the worse thing is that uyou feel US has always iltreated its allies, my friend its only Pakistan that had that fate. Look at Japan, UK, germany even they are used as a trasnit base, Australia. None of these countries are treated the way you are.

 

[blain2]

Well you need to look at the security scenario of both the countries and the affordabiltiy.

I dont agree. The day we start spending to counter China is the day you shud dread, as thats when the conventional forces imbalance would get worser than what it is now. It would be impossible for Pakistan to play catch up

.
Dread what? India? Don't make me laugh. You may be bigger in size and resources but Pakistan has never been afraid of India, concerned it has been but that is prudence on our part. Also we are both nuclear weapons states...most Indian strategists agree that militarily Pakistan cannot be pushed around by India any longer post 1998. What can you spend on which would erode the nuclear balance which is the ultimate guarantor of Pakistani security vis-a-vis India?

Thats right, US wants to, will India play game. No, why? Look the set up.

I would agree with it if there was a lot of data to suggest what you say...there have been indications already where India has played ball the way US wants it to...case in point: Sending Iran's nuclear program to UNSC.

Well what you are saying is that its ok for Pakistan to be a counter for China against India, but then the same isnt right if India does it. The irony is that you are right.

No there is nothing OK about it. I am simply pointing out that tensions and problems are bound to increase for India due to assuming the status of a counter against China for the US.

And the worse thing is that uyou feel US has always iltreated its allies, my friend its only Pakistan that had that fate. Look at Japan, UK, germany even they are used as a trasnit base, Australia. None of these countries are treated the way you are.

No I do not since I do not cater to this BS about friendship. Its all about interests and as such not all US allies are alike. There is a reason as to why US has tiers of allies. All of the countries you mention are Tier 1 allies of the US. India is not there. Pakistan is not there.

 

[yarmook]

Well brother Blain,

You did splendid job in shutting Bulls Indian mouth. BUt i wont mind him saying anything kaz whatever he says or present facts hes still an INDDDDIAN

rememvber a headshaking INDDDDIAN with non sense filled in his brain.

Cheers,

 

[blain2]

Yarmook, my point is not to shut anyone...I really don't have the power or the intention to do so...what irked me was the suggestion that Pakistan or Pakistanis should be ashamed of whats going on in Germany or elsewhere. I just responded to that.

 

[Shivakumar]

And what are you doing about the US invasion and cross border bombings....? Remember satelite....!!!

..........
..........


As i asked you early, why did you dump your own mulsim bros? Who ordered you to? How come russian invasion was fought but not the American?

Blain, You haven't answer these yet. Why dont you answer?

 

[Neo]

Well brother Blain,

You did splendid job in shutting Bulls Indian mouth. BUt i wont mind him saying anything kaz whatever he says or present facts hes still an INDDDDIAN

rememvber a headshaking INDDDDIAN with non sense filled in his brain.

Cheers,

This is a public warning and an infraction for posting verbal diarrhea! Defence.pk does not tollerate such language; you have the right to counter Bull's post but do it in a proper and respectable manner.

Next rule violation will result in a (temp) ban!

Neo

 

[Neo]

Bull please get your judgemental finger out of your ***. Why should Pakistan or Pakistanis be ashamed of anything?? If there is anything to be ashamed of is to see chaps like you and others judging Pakistan. We, more than anyone else, helped the cause of the Afghan freedom. What were you guys doing back then?? Twiddling your thumbs...and here you expect us to be ashamed?

The fact that the west and you guys use the issue of terrorism to nail Pakistan is just a ploy...who the hell let these people come to Pakistan and train??? It was all of the western countries who supported the same people by encouraging them to take military training in Pakistan and Afghanistan during all of these past years....it just happened so that 9/11 came along in the middle abnd suddenly all of their arses were on fire (oh ****! What have we been doing supporting these people all these years" ).

For Pakistanis, there is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of...I could care less if People think Pakistan is the center of this or that...its simply an opinion and an excuse to bring bad PR on Pakistan. Why were folks like these idiots not probed when they returned from Pakistan or when they were going to Pakistan? At one time, they were the heroes of the west...so maybe those with short memories forget things and blame Pakistan for it, I say Pakistan should stay proud of what it did...individuals are the concern of other countries, not Pakistan. Do a better job of policing your citizens or more importantly, look at the causes of injustice and polarisation in the world. That would answer why some guy in Germany wants to travel all the way to Pakistan or Afghanistan to take part in a struggle that is so distant from him.

Well said Blain!

 

[su-47]

What Pakistan needs to do is first send Hidustani Musarraf back to Delhi then finish off India. Kill two p i g s with one blow ahahah

So long as India is there they will continue to malign Pakistan one every front. Just look at these charecters above first to show their ugly faces.

Specially any forum where Westeners come these Indians are specially active in maligning Pakistan.

I have coined a new term for such charecters , it called 'Basement Bhangee' , a basment Bhangee is an indian who sits in a dim litted basement of his parents and writes trash about Pakistan on the internet. Hence forht all these indians on this forum are 'Basement bhangees'

India is enemy number one , show no mercy to the enemies of Pakistan !
( starting with Hindutani Delhi ka k u t t a Mush ). Once india is finished off turst me all this nonsense about 'all terrotist come from Pakistan' will finsih off too

This blatant hatred and senseless talking shows u have the same IQ as a dead salmon. U have no idea of situations on the ground and have no debating skills so u come here to rant about India. If finishing off India was easy, it would have been done long ago.

'basement bhangees'! please. look who is talking trash about other countries. so if i'm a 'basement bhangee' where r u from? judging by the quality of your post, u should be from a sewer.

 

[su-47]

And also tell us about what should we do about the terrorist coming to pakistan via afghanistan thanks to the courtesy shown by our pal india here.

India helping afghan terrorist get into pakistan? In case u forgot, taleban dont like indians. what makes u think india will help them, when any indian who offers to help will be beheaded?

Wishful thinking! if evading pakistan was so simple you guys would have done it along ago. Same stands for US.

Trust me. I DONT want US to invade pak, so please dont say wishful thinking. The reasons:

1) Pak might launch nukes at india if USA invades.

2) Even if pak WMDs r taken out, and pak cant strike india, pak will b messed up by USA and refugees will flood in.

3) Its not good for India to have an unstable neighbour.

Now about USA and India not being able to invade. India invaded in '71 and USA is USA. The way they smashed Saddams massive army in '91 will give u some idea of their power. Pak has nukes, but cant nuke USA itself. Best it can do is use nukes on invading soldiers. but most probably USA will take out most nukes before attacking, and remaining nukes will be taken out by patriot or SM-3 missiles

 

[Bull]

Pts taken Blain, lets stop it here. You know where this is going...!!!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

India helping afghan terrorist get into pakistan? In case u forgot, taleban dont like indians. what makes u think india will help them, when any indian who offers to help will be beheaded?

They had no problem accepting bucket loads of weapons and money from the "Great Satan" and the "Yahood". One of the nice things about belonging to the Taliban school of thought is that you have no shame or principles about accepting money from people you diss every chance you get, as long as it helps you fight your current enemy. I am not saying that means India is helping them out - just that you cannot use their dislike for everything "non medieval" as a reason for not accepting aid from India, if they wanted to.

 

[blain2]

Pts taken Blain, lets stop it here. You know where this is going...!!!

I am with you....I hate getting involved in these exchanges...to the point that you lose track of what the other's post said. I just took your initial post as a personal insult. We all as nations have very many things to be embarassed of...what you pointed out is the least of it...we have issues like Mukhataran Mai which embarrass us (you guys have quite a few but in order to avoid the tit for tat, I will forego it)...in the end, what others have to say about us is a non-issue.