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General Chuck Yeager and the Pakistan Air Force

He seems to be terribly misinformed or fed with one sided propaganda.:lol:

And is this really surprising? America was Pakistans biggest ally back then, so he is obviously going to say good things about PAF. I mean he was was the military advisor to the PAF after all, it would stupid to say that nah they were no good. Am sure Soviets would have only good things to say about the IAF.

PAF may or may not have won the air battle, at the end of the day it was India who won the war, and thats what is more important.

Collecting data for studies is not about saying nice things and this thread isn't aimed at convincing Indians.
 
He seems to be terribly misinformed or fed with one sided propaganda.:lol:

And is this really surprising? America was Pakistans biggest ally back then, so he is obviously going to say good things about PAF. I mean he was was the military advisor to the PAF after all, it would stupid to say that nah they were no good. Am sure Soviets would have only good things to say about the IAF.

PAF may or may not have won the air battle, at the end of the day it was India who won the war, and thats what is more important.

No one is debating who won the war, this thread is specifically for the air war.
 
Fair meaning having no bias in stating facts as is..

He said you guys owned on the ground what more do you want? If he was being fully biased he would have said it was total domination for Pakistan but that coward Niazi surrendered early but he didn't say that did he? :azn:

It just bothers you that PAF is and always has been a better AF than the IAF. :coffee:
 
What study and what data? personal anecdotes aren't worth much.

Battlefield data is collected in great details including enemy war fighting tactics , Air Combat maneuvering , combat formations , payload delivery accuracy , survival techniques , in flight communication , technical failures , performance at different altitudes , temperatures , pilot fatigue , ejections , kill ratio , radar locks and performance , air to air missile accuracy or failures/altitude performance , launch and recovery times slots , night time navigation , technical issues per sortie , air intelligence data , enemy wreckage identification and recovery etc

All of the above is collected from a war situation then it is analyzed by qualified analysts who then help devise strategies for better survivability , superior tactics and air combat maneuvering , situational awareness , electronic countermeasures against enemy hardware , technical & operational capability analysis of enemy fighters , their payload efficiency , response time , altitude performance , engines , radar & heat signatures , command and control psyche and doctrine etc.

After analyzing the data , the developed tactics , countermeasures , strategies are embedded in future combat pilot training programs to prepare pilots better for future engagements hence updating raw battlefield knowledge by knowing enemy air craft and pilots strengths and weaknesses. Such updated regimes are then implemented throughout courses fighter pilots take to update their skills. All of this is put to the test during air exercises between different air forces , tested , evaluated and refined. This is how schools like Topgun in USN , Combat Commanders School in PAF and many others train their best pilots.

I hope it helps.
 
Battlefield data is collected in great details including enemy war fighting tactics , Air Combat maneuvering , combat formations , payload delivery accuracy , survival techniques , in flight communication , technical failures , performance at different altitudes , temperatures , pilot fatigue , ejections , kill ratio , radar locks , air to air missile accuracy or failures/altitude performance , launch and recovery times slots , night time navigation , technical issues per sortie , air intelligence data , enemy wreckage identification and recovery etc

All of the above is collected from a war situation then it is analyzed by qualified analysts who then help devise strategies for better survivability , superior tactics and air combat maneuvering , situational awareness , electronic countermeasures against enemy hardware , technical & operational capability analysis of enemy fighters , their payload efficiency , response time , altitude performance , engines , radar & heat signatures , command and control psyche and doctrine etc.

After analyzing the data , the developed tactics , countermeasures , strategies are embedded in future combat pilot training programs to prepare pilots better for future engagements hence updating raw battlefield knowledge by knowing enemy air craft and pilots strengths and weaknesses. Such updated regimes are then implemented throughout courses fighter pilots take to update their skills. All of this is put to the test during air exercises between different air forces , tested , evaluated and refined.

I hope it helps.


but your opening post is not battle field data....its a part of one guys autobiography.....where he has to show bias bacause he hd a responsible role in that war and cannot show himself in bad light in his own autobiography...can he?
 
but your opening post is not battle field data....its a part of one guys autobiography.....where he has to show bias bacause he hd a responsible role in that war and cannot show himself in bad light in his own autobiography...can he?

If you use your brain before your keyboard you indeed will see the link between two. This is why Chuck Yeager was here for , to gather combat and operational performance statistics not just for training PAF pilots. They were already highly trained , he was here mentoring them , the real purpose was what i stated above. PAF pilots get the highest level of training possible , many of the pilots shooting down IAF planes were top gun graduates. []

sua_05.jpg


United States Navy Strike Fighter Tactics Instructor program - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Pakistan's own Top Gun base: http://www.pakdef.info/pids/paf/topgun.html
 
My father being a former PAF engineer which even Muradk can confirm had to say about 71 is this:

The Indian pilots were very incompetent. Having superior aircraft they should have destroyed the PAF. The ground war was won by the Indians in East Pakistan. He said the only thing that really saved the PAF were our pilots.

Now bhartis can take it or leave it, but that was my father's opinion.
 
Battlefield data is collected in great details including enemy war fighting tactics , Air Combat maneuvering , combat formations , payload delivery accuracy , survival techniques , in flight communication , technical failures , performance at different altitudes , temperatures , pilot fatigue , ejections , kill ratio , radar locks and performance , air to air missile accuracy or failures/altitude performance , launch and recovery times slots , night time navigation , technical issues per sortie , air intelligence data , enemy wreckage identification and recovery etc

All of the above is collected from a war situation then it is analyzed by qualified analysts who then help devise strategies for better survivability , superior tactics and air combat maneuvering , situational awareness , electronic countermeasures against enemy hardware , technical & operational capability analysis of enemy fighters , their payload efficiency , response time , altitude performance , engines , radar & heat signatures , command and control psyche and doctrine etc.

After analyzing the data , the developed tactics , countermeasures , strategies are embedded in future combat pilot training programs to prepare pilots better for future engagements hence updating raw battlefield knowledge by knowing enemy air craft and pilots strengths and weaknesses. Such updated regimes are then implemented throughout courses fighter pilots take to update their skills. All of this is put to the test during air exercises between different air forces , tested , evaluated and refined. This is how schools like Topgun in USN , Combat Commanders School in PAF and many others train their best pilots.

I hope it helps.

But where are those data or studies? All we have is his personal claim that he apparently went counting all the IAF wreckage, all 100 of them, when even by the official Pakistani claim IAF didn't loose 100 planes over Pakistani Air Space. Unless you and Chuck Yeager are suggesting that he came inside the Indian Air Space on his chopper to count the wreckage!

Just because he wrote something in his autobiography doesn't make it the truth.

My father being a former PAF engineer which even Muradk can confirm had to say about 71 is this:

The Indian pilots were very incompetent. Having superior aircraft they should have destroyed the PAF. The ground war was won by the Indians in East Pakistan. He said the only thing that really saved the PAF were our pilots.

Now bhartis can take it or leave it, but that was my father's opinion.

No offence, but what would an Engineer know about a pilots capabilities?
 
But where are those data or studies? All we have is his personal claim that he apparently went counting all the IAF wreckage, all 100 of them, when even by the official Pakistani claim IAF didn't loose 100 planes over Pakistani Air Space. Unless you and Chuck Yeager are suggesting that he came inside the Indian Air Space on his chopper to count the wreckage!

Just because he wrote something in his autobiography doesn't make it the truth.



No offence, but what would an Engineer know about a pilots capabilities?

Battlefield data is classified information , anyone with basic knowledge of combat aviation or either common sense would know.
 
But where are those data or studies? All we have is his personal claim that he apparently went counting all the IAF wreckage, all 100 of them, when even by the official Pakistani claim IAF didn't loose 100 planes over Pakistani Air Space. Unless you and Chuck Yeager are suggesting that he came inside the Indian Air Space on his chopper to count the wreckage!

Just because he wrote something in his autobiography doesn't make it the truth.



No offence, but what would an Engineer know about a pilots capabilities?

Roy the comment you have written is very foolish. Not trying to flame.
 
Battlefield data is classified information , anyone with basic knowledge of combat aviation or either common sense would know.

Yes, but the record of kills and tail signs would not have constituted classified information or does it?

I was only pointing out that he does not seem like a true professional in his mannerisms and the use of language..

Also, his another analysis of PAF about reaching Delhi in a week turned out to be a bummer, hardly lending him any merit..
 
Battlefield data is classified information , anyone with basic knowledge of combat aviation or either common sense would know.

so basically what you are saying is ....."there is basically no proof, leave stuff as it is...."
 

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