France wins A$50bn Australia submarine contract

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

@Vauban, @Taygibay , pensez-vous qu'il y aura la chance que France vend quelques jouets soumarine à la Chine ?

 

[Picdelamirand-oil]

@Vauban, @Taygibay , pensez-vous qu'il y aura la chance que France vend quelques jouets soumarine à la Chine ?

No European Union Forbid to sell weapons to China.

 

[Kiss_of_the_Dragon]

No European Union Forbid to sell weapons to China.

Don't you think this kind of embargo is outdated?

 

[Nilgiri]

I agree, it's silly money for SSKs. Australia would have been bettered served with 8 SSN.

Rumours are out there that they may convert to SSN at a later date if/when the political climate is more conducive for it.

Right now the Aussies have a distaste for anything nuclear-related.

@Vauban niiiice

 

[ahojunk]

$50 Billion is a lot of money.

Damn, which means every Aussie, me included will have to fork out $2,000 each for these expensive military toys.

The French are now celebrating while the Japanese are commiserating.

Personally, I support the government's decision to award to the French.

 

[C130]

50bn is huge mount of money..

50AUD billion over it's life time I bet. 2 decades or more.

wonder if you fit a couple of Sylver 70 launcher into these. Two Sylver 70 launchers for 16 SCALP naval cruise missiles

 

[jhungary]

The reason why French won is simply because of the reinvestment value.

Japan does not want to reinvest much and opt for building the sub in Japan, that's a no-no

German don't have much working relation with Australian Defence as of now, and they even if those money were reinvested in Australian ship building, the progress is not going to be that much as much as Thales and DCNS.

French won by a good proposal, willingness to reinvest into Aussie Shipbuilding and establishment already in Australia. THat is the reason why French won this contract.

We are going to pay 50 billion, no matter what, then it's always going to be how the fund will be funnel thru.

 

[Spectre]

The reason why French won is simply because of the reinvestment value.

Japan does not want to reinvest much and opt for building the sub in Japan, that's a no-no

German don't have much working relation with Australian Defence as of now, and they even if those money were reinvested in Australian ship building, the progress is not going to be that much as much as Thales and DCNS.

French won by a good proposal, willingness to reinvest into Aussie Shipbuilding and establishment already in Australia. THat is the reason why French won this contract.

We are going to pay 50 billion, no matter what, then it's always going to be how the fund will be funnel thru.

Is there a value break up available regarding how much would be the imported content both in terms of salaries and hardware vis a vis local content. Usual norm during the starting phase is 50% which goes higher as more integration is done to as much as 80%. 20% left are usually the critical tech which companies do not part with.

This deal would provide a good bench-mark for future submarine contracts with local manufacturing.

 

[Echo_419]

We were not accustomed to get a contract in "normal times"

 

[jhungary]

Is there a value break up available regarding how much would be the imported content both in terms of salaries and hardware vis a vis local content. Usual norm during the starting phase is 50% which goes higher as more integration is done to as much as 80%. 20% left are usually the critical tech which companies do not part with.

This deal would provide a good bench-mark for future submarine contracts with local manufacturing.

They should have a booked value, but I don't think they will go public about the deal. However, I would have think since there are many French defence tech company that have office in Australia, Thales, DCNS, Airbus, and BAe (Which have subsidiary with Airbus) all have office in Oz, so it would only be natural if they would have a bigger share of reinvestment than Germany.

 

[Taygibay]

wonder if you fit a couple of Sylver 70 launcher into these.

Yes but !

Actually, the MdCN ( Fr CM ) is launched by the torpedo tubes in a shell to reach the surface
as are the Exocets. But that MdCN is also launched by the Sylver 70s on the FREMMs.
Simply exchanging it as a payload to that underwater carriage for a VL Mica is under study.

A pure Sylver launcher on top would require near surface depth. But of course, our SSBN
have the provision for conventional missiles if segregated by block of tubes.

But hush, , Tay.

P.S. @Kiss_of_the_Dragon So unlikely for now as said Pic. Wait 5 years and ask again!

 

[Vergennes]

$50 Billion US is a lot of money.

Damn, which means every Aussie, me included will have to fork out $2,000 each for these expensive military toys.

The French are now celebrating while the Japanese are commiserating.

Personally, I support the government's decision to award to the French.

Just a little correction,it's 50Bn Australian dollars,in current prices,it's about ~38-40Bn US $.

 

[Nan Yang]

The reason why French won is simply because of the reinvestment value.

Japan does not want to reinvest much and opt for building the sub in Japan, that's a no-no

German don't have much working relation with Australian Defence as of now, and they even if those money were reinvested in Australian ship building, the progress is not going to be that much as much as Thales and DCNS.

French won by a good proposal, willingness to reinvest into Aussie Shipbuilding and establishment already in Australia. THat is the reason why French won this contract.

We are going to pay 50 billion, no matter what, then it's always going to be how the fund will be funnel thru.

Agreed. It was a bad decision based on investment and job creation. It was politicians making decision due to local politics.
I am not an expert on submarine but French proposal using water pressure thrust impaler is unproven in a disael submarine and the Australian shipyard never build any submarine before. What can go wrong?

On the other hand Japan builds very good large disael subs and has a proven sub.

Bad decision for both Japan and Australia.

 

[jhungary]

Agreed. It was a bad decision based on investment and job creation. It was politicians making decision due to local politics.
I am not an expert on submarine but French proposal using water pressure thrust impaler is unproven in a disael submarine and the Australian shipyard never build any submarine before. What can go wrong?

On the other hand Japan builds very good large disael subs and has a proven sub.

Bad decision for both Japan and Australia.

1.) Australia had build Sub before. The Collins class (The French sub replacing now) was build in Osbourne, South Australia.

2.) It have nothing to do with politics, if Politics are involved, we would have gone with Type 216 design (with Full US, German and Sweden Support)

3.) Soryu Class is not the best in this deal, the Best would be A-26, to anyone who actually follow this deal would know, technological wise, A-26 design is the best, while the Soryu design was to be the cheapest,

I would agree on your point being the DCNS non-nuclear sub is untried. But then DCNS have a lot of joint venture with Australia, which make it a good partner for reinvestment.

 

[Picdelamirand-oil]

Agreed. It was a bad decision based on investment and job creation. It was politicians making decision due to local politics.
I am not an expert on submarine but French proposal using water pressure thrust impaler is unproven in a disael submarine and the Australian shipyard never build any submarine before. What can go wrong?

On the other hand Japan builds very good large disael subs and has a proven sub.

Bad decision for both Japan and Australia.

We experienced this propulsion system since 1997 on the triomphant class submarine. In fact the nuclear part is only to produce power, there is 2 turboreductors groups (10 MW (13,000 hp) propulsion alternator feeding electric engines). To produce power from Nuclear or from diesael doesn't change the efficiency of pump jet propulsion.

This system produces approximately 1/1000 of the detectable noise of previous submarine and allow to increase by ten times the sensivity in detecting other submarines.

DCNS's pump jet propulsor