batmannow
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Wake Up From The Unmature Dream Of Yours Or May Another General Kicks You Hard On Your Back, Soon?
Former Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf arrested
- Thread starter BDforever
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batmannow
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By the way Batmannow I told you Mushy was done but you were all macho that NO ONE can touch an ex-COAS
What You Think Will Happen?
Or Maybe Its A Written Script Just To Make Him Famous Politicly More? You Never Know?
Just Sharring A Secret Thought?
graphican
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If another general would do that, another general would break the law and must see the music of that. Its not Judicery buts the lawbreakers, wherever and whoever they are must learn this lesson. Dada giri chahe politians karen ya militry, its condemn-able, punishable and should be punished - now.
batmannow
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Maybe Next Genrl Will Kick Or Hang Everone Else, & After That No Will Ever Tries To Come Out Of skin?
Tell Me who in Politics Not doing Dada Giri In pakistani Political History?
What You Think Will Happen?
Or Maybe Its A Written Script Just To Make Him Famous Politicly More? You Never Know?
Just Sharring A Secret Thought?
Enjoy my dear
graphican
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Maybe Next Genrl Will Kick Or Hang Everone Else, & After That No Will Ever Tries To Come Out Of skin?
Tell Me who in Politics Not doing Dada Giri In pakistani Political History?
Who is "next general" to kick people on their butt or head? You support outlaws and law-breakers? Congratulations you had your mindset rule already and what came out of it - Lal Masjid - Bugti - largest insurgency - largest in-land-migrations - NRO - Terrorism and a party which has 0.1% popularity in the country? Good keep toeing this line ans this seems to be line of prosperity for 0.1%. For rest of us Law of the Land needs to kick everybody's head who has been outlaw. No discrimination, no tolerance and no-nonsense - just Justice and that for all.
Yes, I am aware of the interim or new constitution tha musharraf brought, after suspending the original one. However, that doesn't make his act unconstitutional, because he ahd no authority to suspend the original one in the first place. Unless the constitution is amended through a proper legislative procedure by thee will of the people, it still stands.
Suspending the constitution is unconstitutional. That may sound paradoxical, because if the constitution is suspended, then there is no constitution to be unconstitutional any more. However, if that was the case, why do you think the constitution has such an article in it? Surely there is no point in making it unconstitutional to suspend the constitution?
The reason is that there is an assumption that only the will of the people can change the connstitution.
So if a strongman, throuugh the power of guns and gunmen, declare the constitution void, that doesnt mean that the constitution's clear instruction against such an act becomes void. I am pretty sure that he can still be tried for suspending the constitution and the legislature and judiciary. Whether he will be or will not, I don't know.
@RazorMC:
Yes, I am aware that a lot more people were involved in the assault on democracy, and Musharraf alone wasn't to blame. However, you have to remember that he provided the muscle. Ultimately, it was he who wielded the guns and gunmen, and it was the power of guns that abrogated civilian rule. Guns and gunmen who were paid for by the people to ensure the smooth working of their institutions.
Ultimately, it is being looked at as a military takeover or military coup, bcause it was the threat of military force that made all those things happen. He may have had the connivance of a few politicians or otheer civilians, but the first person who should be tried is him. If the army leadership had not played their part, none of the politicians or other civilians could have done a coup. But even if none of the civilians colluded, chances are high that the military could still have pulled off a coup, because they have guns and military training, and a loyal brigade deployed across Islamabad (the infamous 111). In times like these, most people will look to their own interests; and some politicians and judges would side with the army chief when there is an imminent army takeover. If all the civilian govt people (politicians and judges and others) resisted, the coup would still have taken place, but it would not have been bloodless.
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Splurgenxs
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Yet Another Tactical victory! and Strategic defeat fr Mushmush.
shree835
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Death sentence in a bailable offense? Did you mean sentence under article 6?
Justice got to be cheap, you know sasta insaaf.
Let the Nawaz Sarif come in power , you will get to know what I mean.
Death sentence in a bailable offense? Did you mean sentence under article 6?
Justice got to be cheap, you know sasta insaaf.
Let the Nawaz Sarif come in power , you will get to know what I mean.
Devil Soul
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Ehsan Riaz
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he should be treated according to the law and should be given maximum possible punishment for all his sins he committed in his rule.
Capt.Popeye
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Musharraf’s Great Folly Tests the Army
Pakistan's former dictator returned home to what he thought would be a hero's welcome. Instead, a court ordered his arrest -- and put the military in an awkward spot.
BY ARIF RAFIQ | APRIL 18, 2013
In early 1999, unbeknownst to Pakistan's prime minister, then-army chief Gen. Pervez Musharraf ordered a covert incursion into the Kargil area of Indian-controlled Kashmir. Musharraf's aim was to sever India's links between the western and eastern portions of the disputed territory and force the international community to help resolve a 50-year conflict it conveniently ignored.
The Kargil operation was classic Musharraf: daring, but ill-thought out. Pakistan's cover story was that the raiders were Kashmiri freedom fighters, not regular Pakistani troops. The need for deniability meant that Pakistan could not meaningfully provide air support to its own troops, who claimed the heights of Kargil and fought valiantly, but were left stranded after India used its air power to cut off their supply routes. By summer, India and Pakistan were at war and Nawaz Sharif, the elected prime minister, had rushed to Washington to ask President Bill Clinton to get India to deescalate. And by October, Musharraf would overthrow Sharif.
Today, General Musharraf is now Mr. Musharraf, and he's once again gotten himself into trouble. On Thursday morning, he fled from the Islamabad High Court, which had denied his plea for bail after a lower court ordered his arrest in a treason case against him, and retreated to his villa in the Islamabad suburb of Chak Shahzad, hoping to avoid criminal prosecution. And on Friday, he was arrested by Islamabad police. He's being detained in a local police facility and it's unclear whether he will be released in the coming days. A bipartisan resolution passed today in Pakistan's Senate opposed any special treatment for the former dictator and called for him to be tried for treason. Like the Kargil affair, this is a mess entirely of Musharraf's own making, and one that puts the army as well as other power brokers in an uncomfortable position during a fragile political transition.
Musharraf had returned to Pakistan in late March after four years in self-imposed exile to take part in the country's general elections scheduled for May. Like countless other exiles, Musharraf claimed that he had come back because his country needs him. But the reality is that few -- aside from a couple of lawyers who profit from the ex-general's numerous legal challenges -- clamored for his return. Since his resignation from the presidency in 2008, Pakistan has grown beyond Musharraf. The party he created soon after overthrowing Sharif in 1999, the Pakistan Muslim League-Quaid, no longer mentions his name. It is allied with his replacement, President Asif Ali Zardari. Sharif, Musharraf's nemesis, is now expected to be prime minister once again. And the urban middle class and elite that supported the commando-turned-politician for most of his tenure have now shifted their loyalty to retired cricket star Imran Khan and other political forces.
The army, for its part, has worked assiduously to improve its public standing post-Musharraf. Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, the current army chief, has distanced the army from overt involvement in politics. He declared 2008 the Year of the Soldier, trying to restore ties with low-level officers who were alienated by the corruption of Musharraf's era. The military also issued a number of leaks to insinuate that Kayani, whom Musharraf appointed to head Inter-Services Intelligence and later the army, had never supported Musharraf's most controversial moves, such as deposing the chief justice in March 2007.
Today, the army is fighting multiple counterinsurgencies and a terrorist threat that will endure well after America departs from Afghanistan. It has no appetite or capacity to rule, despite Pakistan's failing economy and poor governance, and is banking on a smooth political transition. Kayani has expressed his support for democracy on multiple occasions and received plaudits from much of the political class.
While the current army leadership supports democratic rule, it is unwilling to have current or retired military officers held accountable in civilian courts. Last November, Kayani implicitly criticized the activist Supreme Court Chief Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry for ordering an investigation into the involvement of former military officers, including ex-army chief Gen. Aslam Beg, in the rigging of the 1990 elections. Musharraf's latest folly, inadvertently allowing himself to be tried and convicted for treason (a capital offense), potentially disrupts the army's desire for a democratic transition that does not challenge its privileged position. In Pakistan, the army is more than an institution. It is effectively a biradari, or brotherhood, and a world unto itself that manufactures corn flakes, manages real estate, and -- in the words of the present army chief and his predecessors -- guards the country's "ideological and geographical borders."
For Kayani and the Pakistan Army, therefore, Musharraf is an inconvenience they hoped would be forgotten. But his impending trial should serve as a reminder that the army cannot forever have its cake and eat it too. It cannot demand accountability for corrupt civilians and yet ignore its own officers who subvert the constitution and become millionaires through ill-gotten wealth.
Despite its many mistakes over the years, the military remains Pakistan's most respected institution. The esteem is deserved. Just this month, dozens of soldiers died in the Tirah Valley near Afghanistan in battles with Taliban militants. But the sacrifices of these soldiers have received scant attention in Pakistan's private media. Some Pakistani military officers feel that their sacrifices are not being recognized. Putting Musharraf on trial could add to the disgruntlement felt within the army.
And so this is Kayani's conundrum: He may have to choose between his officers and the masses. Kayani may be able to find a middle path: a safe exit for Musharraf or a softer punishment upon conviction. But he and the army's senior officers should recognize that their Teflon is starting to wear off with an activist judiciary, powerful media, and invigorated political class. The army's immunity from accountability will eventually come to an end. Proactive self-reform will strengthen the army's bond with the Pakistani people. And that process of reform might require the trial of Mr. Musharraf to move forward.
Pakistan's former dictator returned home to what he thought would be a hero's welcome. Instead, a court ordered his arrest -- and put the military in an awkward spot.
BY ARIF RAFIQ | APRIL 18, 2013
In early 1999, unbeknownst to Pakistan's prime minister, then-army chief Gen. Pervez Musharraf ordered a covert incursion into the Kargil area of Indian-controlled Kashmir. Musharraf's aim was to sever India's links between the western and eastern portions of the disputed territory and force the international community to help resolve a 50-year conflict it conveniently ignored.
The Kargil operation was classic Musharraf: daring, but ill-thought out. Pakistan's cover story was that the raiders were Kashmiri freedom fighters, not regular Pakistani troops. The need for deniability meant that Pakistan could not meaningfully provide air support to its own troops, who claimed the heights of Kargil and fought valiantly, but were left stranded after India used its air power to cut off their supply routes. By summer, India and Pakistan were at war and Nawaz Sharif, the elected prime minister, had rushed to Washington to ask President Bill Clinton to get India to deescalate. And by October, Musharraf would overthrow Sharif.
Today, General Musharraf is now Mr. Musharraf, and he's once again gotten himself into trouble. On Thursday morning, he fled from the Islamabad High Court, which had denied his plea for bail after a lower court ordered his arrest in a treason case against him, and retreated to his villa in the Islamabad suburb of Chak Shahzad, hoping to avoid criminal prosecution. And on Friday, he was arrested by Islamabad police. He's being detained in a local police facility and it's unclear whether he will be released in the coming days. A bipartisan resolution passed today in Pakistan's Senate opposed any special treatment for the former dictator and called for him to be tried for treason. Like the Kargil affair, this is a mess entirely of Musharraf's own making, and one that puts the army as well as other power brokers in an uncomfortable position during a fragile political transition.
Musharraf had returned to Pakistan in late March after four years in self-imposed exile to take part in the country's general elections scheduled for May. Like countless other exiles, Musharraf claimed that he had come back because his country needs him. But the reality is that few -- aside from a couple of lawyers who profit from the ex-general's numerous legal challenges -- clamored for his return. Since his resignation from the presidency in 2008, Pakistan has grown beyond Musharraf. The party he created soon after overthrowing Sharif in 1999, the Pakistan Muslim League-Quaid, no longer mentions his name. It is allied with his replacement, President Asif Ali Zardari. Sharif, Musharraf's nemesis, is now expected to be prime minister once again. And the urban middle class and elite that supported the commando-turned-politician for most of his tenure have now shifted their loyalty to retired cricket star Imran Khan and other political forces.
The army, for its part, has worked assiduously to improve its public standing post-Musharraf. Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, the current army chief, has distanced the army from overt involvement in politics. He declared 2008 the Year of the Soldier, trying to restore ties with low-level officers who were alienated by the corruption of Musharraf's era. The military also issued a number of leaks to insinuate that Kayani, whom Musharraf appointed to head Inter-Services Intelligence and later the army, had never supported Musharraf's most controversial moves, such as deposing the chief justice in March 2007.
Today, the army is fighting multiple counterinsurgencies and a terrorist threat that will endure well after America departs from Afghanistan. It has no appetite or capacity to rule, despite Pakistan's failing economy and poor governance, and is banking on a smooth political transition. Kayani has expressed his support for democracy on multiple occasions and received plaudits from much of the political class.
While the current army leadership supports democratic rule, it is unwilling to have current or retired military officers held accountable in civilian courts. Last November, Kayani implicitly criticized the activist Supreme Court Chief Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry for ordering an investigation into the involvement of former military officers, including ex-army chief Gen. Aslam Beg, in the rigging of the 1990 elections. Musharraf's latest folly, inadvertently allowing himself to be tried and convicted for treason (a capital offense), potentially disrupts the army's desire for a democratic transition that does not challenge its privileged position. In Pakistan, the army is more than an institution. It is effectively a biradari, or brotherhood, and a world unto itself that manufactures corn flakes, manages real estate, and -- in the words of the present army chief and his predecessors -- guards the country's "ideological and geographical borders."
For Kayani and the Pakistan Army, therefore, Musharraf is an inconvenience they hoped would be forgotten. But his impending trial should serve as a reminder that the army cannot forever have its cake and eat it too. It cannot demand accountability for corrupt civilians and yet ignore its own officers who subvert the constitution and become millionaires through ill-gotten wealth.
Despite its many mistakes over the years, the military remains Pakistan's most respected institution. The esteem is deserved. Just this month, dozens of soldiers died in the Tirah Valley near Afghanistan in battles with Taliban militants. But the sacrifices of these soldiers have received scant attention in Pakistan's private media. Some Pakistani military officers feel that their sacrifices are not being recognized. Putting Musharraf on trial could add to the disgruntlement felt within the army.
And so this is Kayani's conundrum: He may have to choose between his officers and the masses. Kayani may be able to find a middle path: a safe exit for Musharraf or a softer punishment upon conviction. But he and the army's senior officers should recognize that their Teflon is starting to wear off with an activist judiciary, powerful media, and invigorated political class. The army's immunity from accountability will eventually come to an end. Proactive self-reform will strengthen the army's bond with the Pakistani people. And that process of reform might require the trial of Mr. Musharraf to move forward.
Safriz
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