Former Indian Ambassador thrashed by Russian female Anchor. Must Watch

[M. Sarmad]

Since when has it been a rule that we may not argue opposite sides when it suits the national interest? After all, Pakistan herself is a living illustration; after tearing apart the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan by raising the mujahedin against the Red Army, she found herself at the receiving end of TTP insurgency, and did not hesitate to complain about the exact same behaviour that she had displayed.

So if we argue against the Chinese veto, we will argue that the Soviet veto was to redress the balance of the western powers supporting their loyal servants in CENTO and SEATO; and, in anticipation of your mirroring that argument in the case of China, arguing that China was equally entitled to redress the balance by holding out stoutly for an isolated Pakistan, would you not be engaged under the same Rules of Engagement?

As far as options are concerned, all the information has been given to representatives of the PRC; they have undertaken to study the information. On every occasion, without any detailed explanation, they have merely obstructed any prohibitive action, and left it to the world to conclude what it might. Lack of evidence was certainly not the sticking point.

I agree that the position China has taken is most reasonable and justified - from the Pakistani point of view!

You can't have it both ways, sir.

As for 'arguing', you obviously are free to argue about anything and everything you want... that your arguments are weak and flawed, that, of course, is an entirely different thing.

And as for your 'loyal servant' remark, I refuse to indulge in cheap jibes...

Asking someone to prove one's claims/allegations is reasonable and justified from a neutral point of view as well.

 

[Longhorn]

It really annoys me when Pakistan has kulbushan in custody caught red handed involved in state sponsored terrorism and here we have these indians making their case like a bruised whore. Really want to kick that haram tooi very hard.

Now we learn mullah omar lived and died in Afghanistan after years of blaming Pakistan. Its all about lying in front of the world.


Well they quickly signed a lease of a nuclear sub to repair the damage but sadly it wont repair the damage done to their products.

One word: Agenda
The world is run for certain interests. The only way the narrative against Pakistan is going to change is if the interests of the larger powers change.
It will happen. It may take time, but it will happen.
Nothing ever stays the same.

 

[Joe Shearer]

You can't have it both ways, sir.

As for 'arguing', you obviously are free to argue about anything and everything you want... that your arguments are weak and flawed, that, of course, is an entirely different thing.

I am sorry that pointing out a reversal of course by Pakistan leads to my arguments being considered weak and flawed; that was the original charge against the original role reversal, and it is educative, instructive even, to learn that this is weak and flawed. It was not then so, of course; that goes without saying.

And as for your 'loyal servant' remark, I refuse to indulge in cheap jibes...

It was not meant as a cheap jibe, I can assure you.

While we were carving out a difficult existence through democratic means and a policy of non-alignment, we saw our neighbours decide matters at the point of a gun, a habit never relinquished thereafter, align themselves with two, not one, military alignments, and acquire arms and ammunition that was never used against the stipulated enemy, and was always used in hostilities against this country. American tanks and American guns were used against us, as well as American planes; American expert advisors were found missing from their embassy offices and found to return with smug expressions at the performance of their trainees with their equipment - please tell me, what was it that saved Pakistan then and later from suits for breach of contract and foreign relations repercussions for breach of treaty? Were the stories narrated by your own generals of the squirreling away of weapons for 'subsidiary' purposes incorrect? Now that in the latest instance, proof has been found of use of treaty-bound American planes in the recent engagements, what saves Pakistan from severe consequences except loyalty and service?

Asking someone to prove one's claims/allegations is reasonable and justified from a neutral point of view as well.

Of course. And asking someone to not pretend that nothing makes sense, none of the players exist, none of them are involved, none of them were legally guilty is also reasonable and justified. Your own colleague, in these same columns, argues that containment was a reasonable response; well, make up your minds. As has been said with flashing wit, "You can't have it both ways, Sir." Either Hafeez Saeed should be arrested and tried, based on the proof given and the evidence from both what we provided and what lies sprawling all over the Internet, or you should give up the pretence that no proof has been received. Unlike Sartaj Aziz, we did not wave about empty folders containing blank sheets of paper in them to make an effect.

 

[M. Sarmad]

But you know that is completely false statement , given that your commissioned officers and soldiers participated in Kargil incursion, all the while your ISPR and Primeminister office parroted them being Non-State actors.
So Pakistan on record corroborated by the account of your own EX-PM and Ex-COAS and a multitude of ex military officers validate Pakistan's policy of utilizing non-state actor as state policy tools. How is that difficult to understand?

How is one to force Pakistan to implicate itself in court of law?

Even if we accept that what you are saying is true (just for the sake of argument),
You are still inferring present guilt just from past criminality. Not admissible in a court of law...
Where is the evidence of Pakistani involvement in (current)Pulwama attack? where is the 'proof' that Pakistan was planning more attacks in IoK??

India has openly helped Mukti Bahini in the past, is it sufficient to prove that India is helping Baloch terrorists currently? Pakistan too has a right to attack India after a terror attack is carried out on Pakistani soil, based on India's past criminality? Do you not see the weakness/flaw in your argument/position?

You don't have to force Pakistan to implicate itself. You have substantial proof of Pakistani involvement in Pulwama incident/planned strikes? Just take it to the UN/ICJ or any other international body.... You accuse Pakistan of 'infiltration' across LoC, but then you refuse to let any neutral mechanism to investigate such charges when Pakistan denies them.... You don't want investigations, you don't want to resolve issues.. you just want that your state propaganda and lies should be accepted unquestioned ... The current episode, however, proves that it ain't happening anytime soon..

I am sorry that pointing out a reversal of course by Pakistan leads to my arguments being considered weak and flawed; that was the original charge against the original role reversal, and it is educative, instructive even, to learn that this is weak and flawed. It was not then so, of course; that goes without saying.
.

Let me remind you, sir, that you (not I) are the one complaining about China using veto against Indian interests... I just reminded you that the USSR had used the same veto several times to protect your (illegitimate) interests and therefore you should be the last ones to complain about it

Hope that helps

... As has been said with flashing wit, "You can't have it both ways, Sir." Either Hafeez Saeed should be arrested and tried, based on the proof given and the evidence from both what we provided and what lies sprawling all over the Internet, or you should give up the pretence that no proof has been received. Unlike Sartaj Aziz, we did not wave about empty folders containing blank sheets of paper in them to make an effect.

We arrested and tried him, but we did not have enough evidence to convict him, so, the courts had to set him free .... Just like what happened in India, when your courts, for the lack of evidence against him, could not convict Modi (for his role in the 2002 Muslim genocide in Gujarat)

 

[coffee_cup]

I think it is time that using social media we give some background information to Western news anchors about a very long history of India's sponsorship of cross-border terrorism in the region with overwhelming evidence that Indians can not deny.

LTTE, Mukti Bahini, BLA, TTP etc.

There is undeniable evidence available on the right places, it is time to show this to the world.

 

[SrNair]

Former Indian Ambassador thrashed by Russian female Anchor. Must Watch

More like a backhanded Compliment.
Indirectly praising India's power

1.Russians werent in the loop during all these scenario. Only Americans,UAE and Saudis .That scorned Putin.
2.We knows what Russians did in Syria

 

[coffee_cup]

@Joe Shearer I think ........... pot shouldn't call the kettle black. This is all that is to it.

Everyone has interests, if you or them are allowed to achieve those interests by any means ..... then stop crying if we do it too. The difference is we don't involve our common people and lead them into plain blind hatred and intolerance .... a situation where you have to do circus before elections to feed their egos.

Churning out lies again and again is easy ........ ain't that difficult ......... but the reality is one day all those lies get busted.

Anyways I am not impressed by your ex ambassador and Chairman of National Security Advisory Committee or something. The very evident flaw in his statements is when he says we did preemptive strikes .......... it means you had undeniable credible evidences and proofs ......... and it is no brainer to think that you won't have shared those proofs with others before taking action. However, the post "preemptive" strikes (violation of Pakistan's territorial boundaries) statements including this media talk are not supporting that.

What I mean is if you had that undeniable proof(s) you wouldn't have chosen to stage a drama for domestic consumption and electoral gains ........ you would have shared all that with the world sympathetic to your claims (which you keep repeating in your defense). Just imagine something which no one including Pakistan's allies could have denied. But what happened is you tried staging a drama and thought it would go unanswered .... why because Afghanis think Pakistan is failed state.

That is why I said if it was me I would have left that ex ambassador feeling like an idiot.

Ask him about the suicide bombings that were introduced by Indian trained terrorists in the region.
Ask him about the half century old terrorism support that India has been providing to the terrorists in the region.

And see how he is taking the side walks.

 

[Nasr]

Former Indian Ambassador thrashed by Russian female Anchor. Must Watch

Oksana Boiko is a brilliant journalist, she follows the truth, objectively and that is why she has trashed the former Indian ambassador.

We as Pakistan, must remain objective in our pursuit to improve our country, our people and our way of life. We as Pakistanis must not forget who we are, Muslims First. Because if we do that, then our entire basis of existence is nothing more than a farce.

 

[coffee_cup]

That still doesn't explain why IC814 hijackers, terrorists freed from the hijacking, with utmost impunity roam about free in Pakistan? And the complaint is not just from India w.r.t hizb, HuM, leT, Jem, there is also the US taregtte AQ leadership that finds refuge in Pakistan, and Afhgan's bane Taliban leadership which thrived in Pakistan. But yet with remarkable belligerence, there is always a finger to point outwards.

Kargil is not a distant past as you would like for everyone to believe, Bangladesh was recognized by your own country as a sovereign nation, Indian Army was not masquerading as Mukti bahini, and not at a single point in history India denied liberating Bangladesh. We owned up to it, and were ready for any any international action including inviting the wrath of nixon's 7th fleet at the time. IG literally toured the world anouncing india's intent to liberate bangladesh at the time, and there is ample material supporting that. Unlike 99, then Rashid Quereshi, day in day out talking points of Pakistan has nothing to do with kargil, it's all mujaheddin, its indigenous movement that India is fighting; but it turned out to be what exactly? Pakistan state sponsored operation masterminded by Pakistani Army, so when Mujhhideens/freedom fighters/tribal fighters/militants/Pakistan Army/ all of these terms are so fluid and interchangeable as clearly demonstrated by your own state machinery, how does any investigation body implicate the perpetrator?

So despite how much you would like for us to send out dossiers and "Kadi ninda" (strong criticism) and try investigating a case whose puppet masters are untouchable, Indian establishment said "no thanks"; not out of choice, but for the lack of any.

You must first hang the terrorists responsible for Samjhota Express. Then come back here and tell us, "look guys, we punish our terrorists and do not reward them by offering high govt. posts. Now it is your turn".

Unless you do that, you have absolutely no right to talk trash here.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Pakistan denies a lot of things and then feigns ignorance. Like OBL living in its military garrison town. So Pak thinks at most it is responsible for omission, not commission. But this is a ridiculous argument. No country worth its salt even remotely condemned India for crossing the IB. And I think India wanted to make a point crossing the IB instead of just the LoC.

Did India violate Pak air space? Yea. But did it do it with the intention of occupying or capturing Pak land? Nope.

You're comparing apples and oranges - OBL hiding in Pakistan was an intelligence failure. To this day, US government, military and intelligence officials state on the record that they have no evidence that any Pakistani institution was complicit in hiding OBL. And given that Mullah Omar, it now appears, was hiding next door to US bases in Afghanistan, Pakistan can hardly be blamed for being the only State to suffer such an intelligence failure.

The US under Trump has no qualms about violating international law and the rising Islamophobia within the Republicans, and especially Trump supporters, is clear. So it would stand to reason that the Trump Administration would essentially say nothing when it came to another country violating international law, especially when it involved another country (that happens to be majority Mulsim) that Trump has picked to scapegoat for US failures in Afghanistan.

 

[__Jihadi__]

Former Indian Ambassador thrashed by Russian female Anchor. Must Watch

I like this girl DGISPR need to bring her here she belongs to pakistan

 

[coffee_cup]

You know Sir,
During 1971 when the war was near completion ,self loathing story was running on high on western side that Pakistan is winning that war .
This is characteristic of that nation.
Let them continue

This is the age of Internet, social media and free flow of information. Even though it is easier to spread fake news like Indian media is doing, but they are usually very short lived.

A lot has changed in the last 48 years. If you still want to live in 1971 (btw why not go back a little bit more like to 1962 or 1948?), it is your choice.

 

[MilSpec]

You're comparing apples and oranges - OBL hiding in Pakistan was an intelligence failure. To this day, US government, military and intelligence officials state on the record that they have no evidence that any Pakistani institution was complicit in hiding OBL. And given that Mullah Omar, it now appears, was hiding next door to US bases in Afghanistan, Pakistan can hardly be blamed for being the only State to suffer such an intelligence failure..

What about KSM?
or Omar Sheikh? those too intel failures?

Were any of Hijackers of IC814 arrested? Is hajacking/kidnapping still a crime in pakistan to begin with?

What about thousands of Army regulars that fought under the guise of being non-state actors, as on record stated by Rashid Qureshi, erstwhile ISPR DG? was kind of failure should that be characterized?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

The small difference being, Sir, that it was the Pakistani side that provided a team to join the Indian team and visit the site. The point being made was that every request from the Pakistani side, including the somewhat extreme ones, was met; it did not help to come to any action by the Pakistani establishment.

A lot of time has passed - are you aware of the particulars of the purported evidence provided? Would said evidence really stand up to scrutiny in the same civil courts that India wants Kulbushan Yadav tried in? I highly doubt you have a Hafiz Saeed or Azhar letterhead, signed and thumbprinted by the aforementioned, directing the attack/s and admitting to providing support for the attack.

Would not the uniform rejection of post-facto evidence, including evidence of the LeT involvement with Mumbai, lead to a reasonable conclusion that pre-emptive information would not result in any meaningful action? Merely stating that it was not offered an opportunity to brush everything given under the carpet hardly justifies the lack of pre-emptive information being given to Pakistan as a major lacuna.

Has LeT not been contained? It has. And that should demonstrate that, within the domestic limitations that Pakistan faces, it has done a lot to reduce the kinetic operations of these groups in India.

So yes, Pakistan should have been engaged, if India actually had evidence of some plots, because given the information available so far, it doesn't appear there was not much more than a JeM Madrassa (and not a training camp) at Balakot.

Let us draw a gentle veil over the entire matter of the second pilot and the second parachute, and the reportedly fatal mob assault on one unknown pilot. Pakistan already has a track record of manipulating evidence and of outright denial and I have quoted every example; it is difficult to believe that this leopard has shifted its spots onto its halo.

The reward for a track record of manipulating evidence and outright denial in the face of overwhelming evidence, post Pulwama, goes to India. Multiple (non Indian) news organizations have reported from the site, analyzed satellite imagery, and debunked the official Indian claims. Yet India continues to regurgitate them

Multiple organizations (some Indian even) have debunked the facebook post talking about an alleged PAF pilot being lynched, yet the Indian Defence Minister was shameless enough to spout that facebook post as 'evidence' in an official press conference in front of the media asking her for evidence that an F-16 had been shot down. Such are the depths of depravity that the Modi Sarkaar has taken India to.

Given all the discrepancies and lack of evidence in the Modi Sarkaar's accounts (and note that I used Modi sarkaar rather than Indian government), shouldn't Indians actually be questioning their government about the second IAF jet that the PAF claims was shot down and fell on the Indian side?

But you know that is completely false statement , given that your commissioned officers and soldiers participated in Kargil incursion, all the while your ISPR and Primeminister office parroted them being Non-State actors.
So Pakistan on record corroborated by the account of your own EX-PM and Ex-COAS and a multitude of ex military officers validate Pakistan's policy of utilizing non-state actor as state policy tools. How is that difficult to understand?

How is one to force Pakistan to implicate itself in court of law?

Kargil was not a terrorist attack - it was a covert military operation in disputed territory that engaged regular Indian military forces. Lets get the terminology and context of various events correct first before throwing accusations of 'supporting terrorism' around.

 

[Super Falcon]

Indians are big liars