F-35 Too Expensive: US Air Force Might Buy 72 New F-15 or F-16 Fighter Jets

[Zarvan]

The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter might not be produced in sufficient numbers to maintain the U.S. Air Force’s current operational capabilities due to budgetary constraints, according to Aerospace Daily & Defense Report. As a result the service is considering filling the capabilities gap with 72 Boeing F-15s, Lockheed-Martin F-16’s, or even Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornets.

“F-15s and F-16s are now expected to serve until 2045, when an all-new aircraft will be ready, and plans to modernize F-16s with active electronically scanned array radars and other improvements are being revived,” the article states.

U.S. Air Force officials and industry officials revealed as much at the Defense IQ International Fighter Conference, which took place November 17-19 in London. The U.S. Air Force “is struggling to afford 48 F-35s a year” for the first years of full-rate production a senior Air Force officer told Aerospace Daily & Defense Report.

Full rate-production is slated to begin in 2019 and the U.S. Air Force wants to buy 60 planes in 2020, and 80 F-35 per year after that. This year, the Air Force is to receive 28 F-35s, whereas in 2016 the number is slated to increase to 44. By 2038, the service wants to have 1763 F-35 aircraft in service. However, this procurement schedule might not be financially feasible for the Air Force.

“Consequently, F-15s and F-16s will serve longer and will outnumber F-35s and F-22s through the late 2020s,” Aerospace Daily &Defense Report notes. The article furthermore explains:

The service is looking at a three-tier force, with 300 F-16s and some F-15s being modernized “to augment the F-35 and F-22 in a high-end fight” and others assigned to low-end operations, while the contemplated 72-aircraft buy (an Air Force wing) would sustain force numbers and provide additional modern aircraft.

Interestingly, a senior U.S. Air Force official revealed that “the last time we looked, this was more expensive than buying F-35s in bulk.” However, he confirmed that the option of purchasing 72 aircraft is nevertheless still on the table.

The U.S. Air Force has already asked for cost estimates on procuring new F-15s and life-extension/upgrade options. “Also under consideration is a plan to augment U.S. Air Force electronic attack capabilities by fitting some F-15Es with a version of the Raytheon Next Generation Jammer pod,” the article states.

Overall, the Pentagon is planning to procure 2,457 aircraft by 2038. Total acquisition costs are estimated at over $400 billion making it the U.S. military’s most expensive acquisition program. Operation and support costs throughout the aircraft’s lifetime are estimated at over a $1 trillion.

The supersonic fifth-generation F-35 Joint Strike Fighter exists in three variants: The F-35A conventional takeoff and landing variant for the U.S. Air Force; the F-35B short takeoff and vertical landing variant for the U.S. Marine Corps, and the F-35C carrier-suitable variant for the U.S. Navy.

F-35 Too Expensive: US Air Force Might Buy 72 New F-15 or F-16 Fighter Jets | The Diplomat

 

[C130]

I wouldn't mind if we bought 72 Dassualt Rafale Ms for the next gen Gerald R. Ford or even 150.
that would be what $8 billion for 72 and $18 billion for 150? with an 50% economic offset into the U.S military industrial complex.


all you gotta do is retire the F/A 18 C/Ds


that's enough Rafales to arm 3 U.S Gerald Ford Supercarriers.

 

[saadee]

Seems like F-35 got into trouble again. Crack found on the F 35 C's wings, after the flight test

 

[anon45]

Seems like F-35 got into trouble again. Cracks found on the F 35 C's wings, after the flight test

Air Platforms
Wing spar cracks found on USN F-35 variant
Marina Malenic, Washington, DC - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
15 November 2015

An F-35C conducts its first arrested landing aboard the aircraft carrier USS Nimitz (CVN 68) in 2014. The Pentagon has discovered F-35C wing spar cracks during durability testing that will require modifications to the aircraft. Source: US Navy/Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Kelly M Agee
Key Points

• Pentagon testers have discovered cracks in a main structural element of the F-35C's wing
• Government and prime contractor engineering teams are formulating a solution, and retrofits are planned on existing aircraft

Pentagon testers have discovered cracks in a main structural element of the wing on the C-model of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II, a spokesman for the Pentagon's F-35 Joint Program Office (JPO) confirmed on 13 November.

During a late October inspection of the F-35C durability testing ground article, a crack was found in one of its 13 wing spars, Joe DellaVedova told IHS Jane's . Government and prime contractor engineering teams are formulating a solution, he added.

"Initial estimates indicate a modification of approximately a half a pound to the aircraft will fix it," said DellaVedova. "Modifications to planes flying today will be incorporated to ensure full life operation."

The issue is not expected to affect flying operations for any of the three variants, nor will it alter the US Navy's (USN's) ability to meet its planned Initial Operating Capability (IOC) for the C-model in August 2018, according to the JPO. The cost of the retrofits is not yet known.

The F-35C durability test article had already accumulated more than 13,700 test hours, which equates to 6,850 flight hours or more than 20 years of operational flying, according to DellaVedova. "All current F-35Cs flying today have less than 250 flight hours," he added. Durability testing intentionally stresses aircraft to its structural limits by applying cyclic loads to the airframe to simulate operational flying in order to identify weaknesses and potential corrective actions.

Wing spar cracks found on USN F-35 variant | IHS Jane's 360

 

[saadee]

Air Platforms
Wing spar cracks found on USN F-35 variant
Marina Malenic, Washington, DC - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
15 November 2015

An F-35C conducts its first arrested landing aboard the aircraft carrier USS Nimitz (CVN 68) in 2014. The Pentagon has discovered F-35C wing spar cracks during durability testing that will require modifications to the aircraft. Source: US Navy/Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Kelly M Agee
Key Points

• Pentagon testers have discovered cracks in a main structural element of the F-35C's wing
• Government and prime contractor engineering teams are formulating a solution, and retrofits are planned on existing aircraft

Pentagon testers have discovered cracks in a main structural element of the wing on the C-model of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II, a spokesman for the Pentagon's F-35 Joint Program Office (JPO) confirmed on 13 November.

During a late October inspection of the F-35C durability testing ground article, a crack was found in one of its 13 wing spars, Joe DellaVedova told IHS Jane's . Government and prime contractor engineering teams are formulating a solution, he added.

"Initial estimates indicate a modification of approximately a half a pound to the aircraft will fix it," said DellaVedova. "Modifications to planes flying today will be incorporated to ensure full life operation."

The issue is not expected to affect flying operations for any of the three variants, nor will it alter the US Navy's (USN's) ability to meet its planned Initial Operating Capability (IOC) for the C-model in August 2018, according to the JPO. The cost of the retrofits is not yet known.

The F-35C durability test article had already accumulated more than 13,700 test hours, which equates to 6,850 flight hours or more than 20 years of operational flying, according to DellaVedova. "All current F-35Cs flying today have less than 250 flight hours," he added. Durability testing intentionally stresses aircraft to its structural limits by applying cyclic loads to the airframe to simulate operational flying in order to identify weaknesses and potential corrective actions.

Wing spar cracks found on USN F-35 variant | IHS Jane's 360

I red this one too

 

[anon45]

I red this one too

Yea it's a minor issue, same issues you see on any developing jet.

 

[anon45]

Just looked for the source article, and it's Bill Sweetman.

Seems to be puffing up a list of budget options/ alternatives prepared by the DoD for Congress and possibly the new administration and adding a bunch of 'maybe's' and 'considering's'. Probably just to show them that the F-35 bulk buy is in fact the best option.

Consider the quote from the article.

Interestingly, a senior U.S. Air Force official revealed that “the last time we looked, this was more expensive than buying F-35s in bulk.” However, he confirmed that the option of purchasing 72 aircraft is nevertheless still on the table.

 

[Viper0011.]

I wouldn't mind if we bought 72 Dassualt Rafale Ms for the next gen Gerald R. Ford or even 150.
that would be what $8 billion for 72 and $18 billion for 150? with an 50% economic offset into the U.S military industrial complex.

all you gotta do is retire the F/A 18 C/Ds. that's enough Rafales to arm 3 U.S Gerald Ford Supercarriers.

Just like the article states about -15 and -16 upgrades, there are -18 upgrades on the table too. Including the Stealth-Optimized package, which adds Stealthy Weapons Bay (External), in addition to air-frame treatment for reduction of RCS. These upgrades make the -18 a couple of notches above the Rafales!! I'd personally like to see "Made in USA" on our AC's!!

 

[C130]

Just like the article states about -15 and -16 upgrades, there are -18 upgrades on the table too. Including the Stealth-Optimized package, which adds Stealthy Weapons Bay (External), in addition to air-frame treatment for reduction of RCS. These upgrades make the -18 a couple of notches above the Rafales!! I'd personally like to see "Made in USA" on our AC's!!

if you are talking about the Advance Super Hornet I agree, but no matter the upgrades done the Rafale just simply outperforms the F-15,F-16, and F-15 in flight characteristics.

but also like I said France would have to do 50% offset into the U.S. so if out $18 billion they would have to re-invest $9 billion, and Boeing makes sense.

 

[Viper0011.]

if you are talking about the Advance Super Hornet I agree, but no matter the upgrades done the Rafale just simply outperforms the F-15,F-16, and F-15 in flight characteristics.

but also like I said France would have to do 50% offset into the U.S. so if out $18 billion they would have to re-invest $9 billion, and Boeing makes sense.

I guess it makes sense, but then you'll get into a pissy contest with BAE, who has a much stronger working relationship with Boeing. And the European consortium / Britts will offer the EFT with more offsetting ratio then the French can......like the Britts did with the Harriers. To avoid pissing off so many people, I'd take the Advance Super Hornet on any given day, twice every Sunday

 

[TheNoob]

It'll be a matter of time before private cooperation like the defense firms have their own advanced army. o_o

 

[MastanKhan]

Just like the article states about -15 and -16 upgrades, there are -18 upgrades on the table too. Including the Stealth-Optimized package, which adds Stealthy Weapons Bay (External), in addition to air-frame treatment for reduction of RCS. These upgrades make the -18 a couple of notches above the Rafales!! I'd personally like to see "Made in USA" on our AC's!!

Hi,

See---that is the american in you talking---did you boycott the French wines as well in the last few years!

It'll be a matter of time before private cooperation like the defense firms have their own advanced army. o_o

Hi,

They already have---they are called contractors.

 

[oproh]

Another proof that made in america products are junks.

 

[Viper0011.]

Hi,

See---that is the american in you talking---did you boycott the French wines as well in the last few years!.

No, not really. My comment wasn't made in bad taste. I love French Wine and French Chicks. There is something about the way the language flows, or them girls roll

My comment was made due to the fact that the US jets aren't any less than the Rafale. The French have always produced good jets, specially from the Mirage 2000 era, but I don't think the USN needs Made in France jets when we produce 5-6 different types of top end jets.

I am sure if we didn't have these expertise, I'd be nodding in favor of the Rafale. But we have plenty of expertise and aircraft manufacturing giants like LM, Boeing, NG, etc. So why not use what we already have in house?

 

[MastanKhan]

Another proof that made in america products are junks.

Hi,

No they are not---. They are still the best----. A crack here a crack here---it happens with every new aircraft--. What is critical is what do you do after you find the issues.

The only thing junk used to be made in america cars----.